Fishymancer - Version 2.1

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catalogguy

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Interesting ideas! I really like the idea of putting Crown of Thieves on my merc to take advantage of the gold find! He also wears Duriel's shell, (Tal mask atm), and Insight with 250 damage. This is the first time I have put Insight on this build and I absolutely love it. For an example of how I use it, when I enter the Pit level 2, I run forward from the opening to the edge of the first platform then back. This gets my army to move up as a shield and draws the bad guys up to play. Then safely behind the army I spam attract, then amp, then corpse explode to high heaven.

BTW I now look at corpse explode as a one point wonder. In the past I have maxed that skill, but I find one point is sufficient, even early in the game before I had much plus skills gear. It is one of the most useful skills in the game. I have a CV Insight that does about 500 damage, but of course with 210 str req, it will stay on the mule for a while.

On switch I have the Spellsteel unique axe with teleport. It would be great someday to have Enigma to tele without dropping the skellie and repair cost, but that would be a whole different game. Spellstell has been great, I use it usually in Durance 2 to deal with a doorway blocked by a tough mob. If I could find a comparable ammy with teleport (+3 summon and 22 str), I would definitely consider the Baba Rhyme shield. I raise 13 skellies, 7 mages, and 13 revives. When I switch, I think I lose just one skellie.

In my dreams I gamble the plus 2 nec tiara with 2-3 sockets and Lems for the gold. Maybe Wealth armor is a good way to go? I doesn't have much going for it except the MF and gold find, but Skullders would give me the MF and a skill point which is nice. I was thinking a dusk shroud might be the armor of choice to make Wealth?

He has 90 strength as geared and I may have put a few stat points into str in the beginning, but I don't really recall.

Unfortunately he was not able to kill the Diablo clone last week. I cant recall whether I already had the torch. I got help from a smiter and netted a 14/20 for another toon. I spawned him in the Countess' chamber and there was no way. I went through so many mercs (need the might aura generally) and reraised armies, and at best only took a little slice off his life. I am sure I have used this build in the past to kill the clone, but I think I spawned him in the Den. It was hard this time to get him surrounded, it was just too tight with him sticking near the wall in the little Countess room.

So my build is complete. I have everything I normally put. I have 38 skill points remaining at level 86. I really never know what to do with all the extra points, but would like to have a skill that necro himself could use to kill something when the army is at work. Maybe bone spear or poison nova? I really have no idea as i have never built a necro for either of those skills. Sorry for long rambling post! Too much to share!
 

zephody

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I'm currently building my first fishy and I was wondering at what (cirka) lvl do you guys jump over to nm and to hell?

And is CE worth dealing with before hell?
 

Doctor Clock

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I play fairly slow, but I usually enter Hell around level 70-75. You can go earlier, but I wouldn't start until at least 60 unless you have some good gear.

For CE, 1 point is usually good through Normal and NM to keep the mana cost low. On my Fishy, I just saved up the skill points and then maxed CE all at once when I entered Hell.
 

zephody

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Thanks for the quick reply.

And to nm? Somewhere around 50? I was aiming at br's from ~25-50...
 
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catalogguy

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

This is the one build where I don't plan based on the levels. With other builds that are very skill-dependent, say a sorceress, I plan carefully to have enough in my lightning tree, for example. Not so with the fishymancer. As soon as I can kill Baal, I move on. BTW, I never join this guy in Baal leveling games... no point IMO. I just play through the whole game.

The thing I find really important is good resists. especially lightning. You might stay in some norm games before going to nm if you have barely enough resists to survive norm (same for going from nm to hell). Lightning seems most important because a monster can target you and your army will not block it, it can come from a monster not even on your screen, so you don't get warning, and it is fast! Cold and fire are also important, but you have a better chance of surviving those attacks. I keep antidote in one belt slot and don't really worry much about poison res.

If you find you are dying from physical damage, consider trading in your merc for one that provides the defiance aura rather than might. That will give your defense a huge boost until you are better geared up.

Certain items help a lot. If you can trade for a homunc, it is excellent. Pdiamond the shield and maintain max block and keep your other stat points in vit. They are reasonably cheap already on the ladder. Also, find a decent wand with 2 necro skills, and raise skele, skele mastery, etc. I also put 1 point in bone armor which you might find as a mod on a wand.

Make sure your merc has a source of leach. Tal mask is great and allows you to put insight which is cheap and easy and will let you corpse explode all you want. At very low levels, the bloodthief weapon works well.

I start using corpse explode in act 2 mag lair in normal difficulty



Thanks for the quick reply.

And to nm? Somewhere around 50? I was aiming at br's from ~25-50...

 

Sparks

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Nightfish himself has said in some of his Guardian threads that he stopped leveling to a certain level before going to the next difficulty, it's not really needed. This is especially true for a Fishymancer, I'd still try and keep good resists though.

CE still does a lot of damage even at /players 8, you don't have a lot else to do anyway :). The main problem is using your mana quickly, you can either get a feel for how much assistance from CE is useful to your army or you can get Insight for your Merc, it cures any mana problems.
 

zephody

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

This is the one build where I don't plan based on the levels. With other builds that are very skill-dependent, say a sorceress, I plan carefully to have enough in my lightning tree, for example. Not so with the fishymancer. As soon as I can kill Baal, I move on. BTW, I never join this guy in Baal leveling games... no point IMO. I just play through the whole game.

The thing I find really important is good resists. especially lightning. You might stay in some norm games before going to nm if you have barely enough resists to survive norm (same for going from nm to hell). Lightning seems most important because a monster can target you and your army will not block it, it can come from a monster not even on your screen, so you don't get warning, and it is fast! Cold and fire are also important, but you have a better chance of surviving those attacks. I keep antidote in one belt slot and don't really worry much about poison res.

If you find you are dying from physical damage, consider trading in your merc for one that provides the defiance aura rather than might. That will give your defense a huge boost until you are better geared up.

Certain items help a lot. If you can trade for a homunc, it is excellent. Pdiamond the shield and maintain max block and keep your other stat points in vit. They are reasonably cheap already on the ladder. Also, find a decent wand with 2 necro skills, and raise skele, skele mastery, etc. I also put 1 point in bone armor which you might find as a mod on a wand.

Make sure your merc has a source of leach. Tal mask is great and allows you to put insight which is cheap and easy and will let you corpse explode all you want. At very low levels, the bloodthief weapon works well.

I start using corpse explode in act 2 mag lair in normal difficulty
Interesting, I see your point(s). I surely found out early on that the fishy is a very open build, much thanks to the build's simplicity. Hehe, I've also noticed the thing about lightning... it's "lightning" fast.... Bah. Bottom line, it's dangerous.

You mention the homunc, and I can only say that I have got my hands on it already, and i'm eagerly waiting to get to use it. :)


 

obesechicken

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I know that everyone says fishymancer can solo the game naked. But really, I find that the skeletons die to fast to bosses, so I went hybrid bone spear/summon. I mostly use revives to tank since I'm on singleplayer, and got to respec out of skeletons. I don't know why, I just don't think skeletons don't do well against bosses, and I'd rather have a master of all trades than a master of one.

Fishy, you said that skeletons encounter problems in act 4 hell difficulty. Obviously, this means you should change to revives if you don't have all the good runewords?
 

Sparks

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Against bosses Clay Golem + Decrepify should keep your minions alive.
 

Darkflight

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I know that everyone says fishymancer can solo the game naked. But really, I find that the skeletons die to fast to bosses, so I went hybrid bone spear/summon. I mostly use revives to tank since I'm on singleplayer, and got to respec out of skeletons. I don't know why, I just don't think skeletons don't do well against bosses, and I'd rather have a master of all trades than a master of one.
I have never had much problems killing bosses with my Fishymancer. Decrepify and Clay Golem slows them to a crawl, and if you manage to get some crushing blow on your mercenary you are golden. Normal Duriel and Normal Diablo should be the hardest really. On Duriel you just have to exit the lair and get new skellies maybe a few times. On Normal Diablo you have to make sure you are level 24 and have gotten decrepify.

Fishy, you said that skeletons encounter problems in act 4 hell difficulty. Obviously, this means you should change to revives if you don't have all the good runewords?
They encounter problems in hell act4 if you are naked or untwinked with really bad gear. Any decent twinking will make mobs die almost before you see them, even in WSK on hell.



 

Neacross

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Hey, I just noticed my skelletons doing less dmg every level. Is this normal? Or is this just a display error. pls help^^ I'm afraid my skelles will go down to like 100 dmg in 10-20 lvls^^
 

Gillsing

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Apparently it's because of unused skill points, and it might only be a display error. Or so it says in the first post. Perhaps it was updated in reply to your question? I think I read something to that effect when it came to answering questions. Then again, it seems as if it would make sense to also post a reply back here as well.
 

JOndoloore

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I just reinstalled last week after years of not playing. I took my first HC Ladder Necro up to ** using what I remembered - supplemented heavily by this guide.

Two things....

1. Thanks for sharing this, it was a huge help - especially to a "born-again noob".

2. I have a cruel colossus Voulge, with 2 sockets in it. What do you suggest I place in these slots - it's (obviously) going on my Act 2 Might merc.

I was thinking something like Shael/Amn. Or maybe making the "Wind" runeword if I get lucky with and find the rune for it.

Any input?

I have no real problems tanking this guy untwinked all the way to Hell Baal. Yes, at times it can be a little slow(takes me forever to wear Baal down), but it is extremely safe.

For what its worth I ended up maxing

RS
SM
CE

The rest went mostly into Bone Armor synergies. I know everyone has a different opinion on what you should do with your "retirement points" as I call them. But since I'm on Hardcore and don't really like Mages I figured "why not?". CE pretty much sweeps everything off the screen anyway - so I like the added safety.

Thanks in advance for any help.
 

Juicy Cheese

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I think it depends heavily on what other gear your mercenary is using, I wouldn't add a shael rune in, unless it puts you at the next breakpoint. If you know what armour/helmet you intend on using then we can see if you have enough life leech. Also, as it is a magic item, you wouldn't be able to make a runeword in it. Runewords can only be made in grey items.
 

JOndoloore

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

I think it depends heavily on what other gear your mercenary is using, I wouldn't add a shael rune in, unless it puts you at the next breakpoint. If you know what armour/helmet you intend on using then we can see if you have enough life leech. Also, as it is a magic item, you wouldn't be able to make a runeword in it. Runewords can only be made in grey items.
Well, right now he's wearing Mask of Horror, and just garbage armor. He's wearing the Mask of Horror because of the +strength(CCV has high stren requirements) but I'm not thrilled with his set up obviously. I'm on the look out for a Vampgaze/Shaftstop. Or Guillumes face. I'm just running this guy on what I find though so i'm far from rich =P.

I just found a Hone Sundan. Wondering if socketing that and crafting a leech helm would be a more efficient set up. I would loose some damage but he would hit faster and certainly leech more.


 

Juicy Cheese

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Hone Sundan is a very solid option for any Fishy, with that and maybe a Tal's Mask, if you have one, in addition to an armour like Treachery would be excellent. If you don't have a Tal's Mask then I'd go for 2 amns and a shael maybe, and try and get IAS from your other two slots.
 

JOndoloore

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Hone Sundan is a very solid option for any Fishy, with that and maybe a Tal's Mask, if you have one, in addition to an armour like Treachery would be excellent. If you don't have a Tal's Mask then I'd go for 2 amns and a shael maybe, and try and get IAS from your other two slots.
Ok, currently he is wearing...

Weapon: Hone Sundan(Shael Shael Amn)
Helm:EDIT!I just found Tal's mask in Hell WSK! So he's wearing that. Guess I just gotta find armor now!
Armor:Twitchthroe(meh, open to suggestions about middle/end game armor I should hunt for)

I'm still looking for better armor/helm combos. The crushing blow thing really works well(he owns bosses in hell now compared to before).

Also, I respecced my Necro.

20 RS
20 SM
20 CE

Then what? I tried mages - didn't like it. Then I tried bone armor synergies, and found that the only stuff that really hits me is all elemental damage that goes through my minions(Namely, black souls - which STILL hurt me even though I have full resists - I know DV is an option here but its still difficult to DV them since they shoot so often). Or physical damage that ignores my bone armor anyway:wink:. So I'm at a bit of a loss. I've got about 29 skills to use up, and I haven't found anything that made me happy. I know its personal choice and most of your killing is done with CE so its all just supplemental fun from there on out - but I'm having trouble deciding. Maybe Golem mastery to soup up an Iron golem? Any input? Pump Summon resist? Maybe bone spear for helping my friends with rushing or bosses in normal/NM?

I'm a level 90 HC Guardian. I've pretty much retired him to MF'ing. He doesn't have a lot of godly gear but I love playing him:nod:

Thanks again.


 
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potter

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

As for merc armour, Duriel's Shell/"Treachery"/Gladiator's Bane/Shaftstop/"Duress" all work well.
Other great helms are Rockstopper/Blackthorn's Face/Darksight Helm(CBF and DV proccing)/Andariel's Visage/Crown of Thieves.

As for Gloams, DV is the dealbreaker. Pump it all up and spam it ahead of you and close to corners. They'll be dimmed before they even know it. Stairtraps are still dangerous though. Thundergod's Vigor War Belt will rid you of your thundery pain though.

Edit: I put a few points in Revives for Baal. I summon a few gorebellie types in River of Flame or Durance for their innate chance of Crushing Blow. Teleport charge on top of Baal, BAM.
 

damaris

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

THIS IS what i've been looking for! I started playing diablo2 again in different computer, this time play @ battle.net =)

thanks Nightfish, really appreciate your hard work

regards,
Damaris
 

catalogguy

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Fishymancer - Version 2.1

Based on a number of recommendations from people I have met in the game, I am going to try something a little different from my prior fishymancers: beast for my toon with pride for the merc. Beast provides the Fanaticism aura and Pride provides Concentration. The Pride I will make in an eth CV, but what do you recommend for Beast? Most common seems to be the Berzerker axe, but I am nowhere near having strength for that. Berzerker requires 138 and I have only 89 (I really only need 84 for the highest req item, trang armor, so may eventually respec to squeeze back those extra points).

I have seen Beast made in a double axe which reqs only 43 str. Beast can be made in axes, scepters, and hammers. Obv I don't melee, so does it matter what base it is made in, as long as I can equip it? I would like to do something that may be later salable, but it has to be within my str level. Of the acceptable weapon types, double axe has the lowest str reqs of those that can get 5 sockets.

I found a superior double axe in hell (will larzuk @ 5); it has useless 3 AR mod, but why not. Is this the way to go? Thanks for any recommendations!
 
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