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Fishymacer WS K Runs Mini-Guide

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Nightfish, May 20, 2005.

  1. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    Fishymacer WS K Runs Mini-Guide

    Intro
    Well, this is basically just my 0.02$ on running the WS K with a necro. I've spent quite a bit of time there and got a fair share of gold and green out of that. While the returns are obviously not as great as they are with mephisto, I do believe this to be the best way to get items of TC78 and higher.

    Yes, you can run other places and find good stuff. Yes, you can use a million of different builds and find good stuff. But I don't want to write a 20 page guide every day so this is just focused on this small thing. As a matter of fact it's an addendum to my skelliemancer guide. So please don't tell me how a hammerdin or a winddruid is much better or how the pit or pindle reign supreme... Quite frankly, I don't care. ;) No offense intended. :D

    Why the WS K?
    Well, it's an alvl 85 area which means it can drop everything. What sets this apart from the other 85ers is baal who's waiting at the end -which causes some people to just skip the WS K and focus only on baal which is in my opinion a bad move for several reasons. Reason being that if you just focus on baal you will compare the results you get from him to mephisto's and that can't work out. It just takes longer to get to baal and you can't expect him to give you a windforce every run. And if you just skip through the WS K and only kill baals minions you end up "wasting" a lot of time you could spend killing good stuff.

    Imo, the right mindest to run the WS K is to consider it to be equal to the pit with baal as the icing on the cake. And not the other way around, Baal with too many obstacles before him. While this may seem trivial, having the right things in mind helps keeping one sane while MFing. (though people argue MFing in itself is already proof of sanity slipping)

    Items:
    Refer to the guide for detailed info on build and why to chose which merc. Here I'll just briefly reiterate what we want from our gear and why we want it. This assumes realistic MFgear you can attain without running the shadowmaster for runes.

    In general we want:

    Weapon 1: MF
    Shield 1: Resistances & Blocking
    Weapon 2: Teleporting Charges
    Armour: MF and +skills
    Helmet: MF and +skills
    Belt: MF
    Boots: MF or +mana per kill
    Gloves: MF
    Rings: MF or +skills
    Ammy: Resistances and + skills or Resistances + MF

    Charms: Try to cover your resistances here or go for more MF with 7% small charms.


    Here's what I use, for example. If you don't have what I use, use something else. (duh?)

    Weapon 1: Gull or Ali Baba (2 x Ist or 2 x Tir)
    All of these give similar MF, the 2 Ist Ali would give more MF while the 2 Tir Ali would give you 4 mana per kill which helps keep CE going. I favor this over +skills for this slot because you can get a big chunk of MF for the +skills you surrender.

    Shield 1: Homunculus(PDia)
    In this case it's exactly the other way around, you can get a lot of +skills and resis for a very small amount of MF lost considering the only MF shield you have is probably Rhyme.

    Weapon 2: Teleporting Charges
    This is either spellsteal or Naj's Puzzler, with the puzzler being the obviously better choice. Teleporting just rules. Weapons can be repaired with the cube which saves money. (not that we need to but still). I favor this over a switch with higer +skills for summoning skellies.

    If you have enigma for teleport you are probably hacking and I have no idea why you're trying to MF for items... Okay, just kidding. If you have enigma you will want a +skills switch or a beast / oath runeword. Another option is an -150% defence weapon and crushing blow setup to help kill baal faster.

    Armour: Skullder's (PTopaz)
    Used for 2 reasons: Good MF and +1 skills. Also it looks better than tal rasha's armour which is the other good option here.

    Helmet: Harlequin Crest (PTopaz)
    Ugly as **** but impossible to beat. Skills, mana, life, MF, this one has it all.

    Belt: Goldwrap
    Mainly used because there is other belt that seems to be very useful. Arachnid Mesh is an option, or something that gives you more resis. My necro doesn't need more of either so he uses goldwrap.

    Boots: War Travs
    Kinda hard to find but these are probably the best boots. More MF is all we really need. Another option is silkweave if you have trouble running out of mana when casting CE.

    Gloves: Chance Guards
    Uhm... MF? Gold Find? Thanks.

    Rings: Nagelrings or Stones of Jordan
    Personally I find both about equally useful. I don't kill a lot faster with SoJs, I don't get that much MF from nagels. I think I'm neutral here.

    Ammy: Mara's
    This is another slot where you can gain +2 skills and a decent amount of resis for sacrificing a small amount of MF so I got this ammy here.

    How to Run:
    While this is pretty straightforward there are some things to keep in mind. First of all you will want to have a good map and run that map in a good way. Now, what's good? In contrast to a good meph map where you want the distance between WP and stairs to be minimal, here you are looking for a map that allows you to go almost everywhere without walking the same corridor twice. This includes smart use of teleport. Take a look at my map and how I run it, for example (go go paint art)

    http://upl.silentwhisper.net/uplfolders/upload1/WS_K_2.jpg

    As you can see I can run the entire place without steping on the same stone twice, which is the way it should be. Personally I like to optimise my WS K 2 map and accept a slightly less good map on WS K 3 because I sometimes clear that only partially.

    A small note on player settings: I run on players 1 since I am after the items. Since about 80% of sets and uniques come from bosses champs, and because those are unaffected by players that's the way to go. I stay there for baal since his no-drop chance is already pretty small and I don't want to double his life for the small gains that gets me.

    WS K2:
    Of all the things I can spawn here nothing should give your necro a hard time. I know lots of people have issues with gloams but with a bit of practice they're easy, too. Just try to have about 800-900 life and 75% LR, that's enough. Use your curses and your golem (reposition) and just wait for the first corpse to go down then 1-2 CEs send them all into eternal darkness.

    I would consider bypassing this area if the selfexploding monsters and the hierophants spawn. The one kind doesn't give you any items, the other kind occurs only in a low density which means that you won't be getting a lot of items this run.

    Useful stuff to revive: Not much. Serpents are alright, flayers and beetles are okay, too. Hellspawns are so-so. Gloams are horrible, just like hierophants and cadavers.

    WS K3:
    This place can potentially give you bigger problems but nothing that can't be handled. OKs can kill your merc if you're not careful but most of the time you should be able to explode some DKs before your merc goes down.

    I would consider bypassing this one if both kinds of PI monsters spawn on top of OKs. It's still possible and probably easy to clear but that's sometimes a bit of a hassle with unbreakable bosses.

    Useful stuff to revive: Death Knights, Frenzytaurs, Flayers, Ghosts. Don't bother with other stuff. The teleporting goblins and wraith's outright suck, the succubi on this level tend to overwrite your curse with their own lower defence curse which blows. I'm not even mentioning those funny blue things that never do anything.

    Throne of Destruction:
    This one is a bit difficult to run efficiently, I only fully clear it if I feel like it and if it spawns my favorite revivables. Some teleporting at the right places might help. Again there's OKs on this levle but genereally I have no problem with anything here.

    Revives here include Hell Witches, which are about the best revives all around and Frenzytaurs which come in as a close second. Death Knights and Infidels are decent, too. Vampires, Dolls and Serpents are alright, too, but aren't really the top choices. The only bad revives on this level are burning souls.

    Try to enter the throne with as many revives as you can and with as much time on your revives as possible. Teleport once or twice so you don't lost too many if you're coming a long way.

    When the minion waves spawn it's always the same routine, cast amp damage and make sure your merc is attacking something. Then cast CE. Stop casting CE once stuff is dead as about half the time baal neglects to remove all the corpses which gives you a head start on the next battle. I'd only revive a few of the third wave if you still have less than your max revives. Always get a few of the fourth wave, though. I'd explode a corpse or two and then start reviving. If lister proves dangerous (fanatic / might) use Decrep instead of amp. Again, make sure your merc is attacking and cast CE.

    Before entering baals room summon a clay golem and switch to decrep on your main switch, then switch to your teleporting weapon switch. Enter the chamber and teleport right on top of baal, switch back to your main weapons and cast decrep. Once you're sure the clay golem has slowed him you can change to amp. Now wait for him to die. (and teleport if he does so) Pick up loot and curse at baal for not giving you the item you were longing for again. Rinse and repeat.

    I usually don't bother selling items because I make a lot of money from gold find alone. I do pick up and identify most rares and all charms / jewels and everything else that might be useful.

    Well, that's basically it for the first version. Hopefully this answer some of the more common questions, I know it's nothing new to most people. Still, I had 20 minutes and nothing better to do. Do tell me if this is useful, I think it's probably too basic, no?
     
  2. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

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    Looks good! 1 point though.
    having 2 tirs in a ali baba is pointless. a normal fishy should onyl be using his mana mid run for CE, and even if you kill 5 monsters per CE, that still only 20 mana back, and that isnt going to make or break you. if you need to, just carry a couple of blue potions with you, and use those 2 sockets for more productive things.
    Oh and dont forget to mention when you TP onto baal, to have some CB on switch for faster kills if you can find something with MF and CB then that'll be lovely.
     
  3. nepeta

    nepeta IncGamers Member

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    How about runes? Didn't find anything yet, also haven't looked at rune drop chances, lazy me :p
     
  4. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    No, he should be using his mana for CE all the time. If you kill a couple things with CE you get a bit of mana back. And 20 is already about half what CE costed. Nothing "only" about that imo. Might be an option for lazier people. I use pots. As for the sockets, if you don't have ists ,there is nothing more productive to put there.

    nepata: I don't believe in legit runes. The chances definetly don't increase enough to warrant higher player settings, that much I can assure you.
     
  5. Masas

    Masas IncGamers Member

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    In my opinion there's another way to use the corpses of Ventars wave. Lure them just a bit out of Baals range, don't mindlessly spam CE (around 2 times is enough, with them being amped at P1), then lure Listers pack right on top of their corpses. Spam some CE, and voila Extra Strong Fanat Listers Pack eliminated. This might take some practice to get used to thou'.
     
  6. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    I know. Takes too long, imo, and is not worth the effort since lister doesn't give me any trouble.
     
  7. Torstar

    Torstar IncGamers Member

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    Nice of you to let everyone know about the WSK runs :thumbsup:

    I just started them heavily about 2 weeks ago and it has been quite rewarding(IKSC and Tals Armor last week)

    Anyways, GL to all

    Torstar
     
  8. Masas

    Masas IncGamers Member

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    Well, it's just my personal preference. Also, while having a source of constant tele (oskill) it doesn't take that long.
     
  9. Sleepless

    Sleepless IncGamers Member

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    It's not everybody that carry an enigma in their invetory n00b ;) Most of us, mere mortals , must uses charges :confused:
     
  10. Masas

    Masas IncGamers Member

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    Charges are plentiful! :) Who needs those few extra k gold anyway.
     
  11. midnightvulture

    midnightvulture IncGamers Member

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    Another good guide NF. :thumbsup: Basic, true, but wasn't that the intention?

    mv
     
  12. TenYearsGone

    TenYearsGone IncGamers Member

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    Thanks NF for the mini-guide (kinda like a mini-map). Always useful.
     
  13. Kaptain_Insano

    Kaptain_Insano IncGamers Member

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    Nice job NF! I never get tired of reading stuff like this.

    Cheers K
     
  14. Derrick1001

    Derrick1001 IncGamers Member

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    Nice guide. I've been doing pretty much the same thing for a while. Though I use tps instead of teleport charges to organize my army (because I'm cheap :) ). Also, do you use the full map all the time?
     
  15. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    Thanks for your comments. :)

    Yes.
     
  16. Sint Nikolaas

    Sint Nikolaas IncGamers Member

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    IMO you could also put in the WS K level 2, WS K level 1 way to go at it.
    That way you don't have the minions from Baal nor Baal himself, but weaker characters can definately go this way. I find WS K level 1 less dangerous and actually quite decent to level up.
    Also, just on a side note, if you're explaining what WS K runs are.. you might want to consider dropping in a line like: ''WS K stand for ''the World Stone Keep'' alot of people refer to it as WSK but often mean ''the Throne of Destruction'' (where Baal throws his minions at you) and ''the World Stone Chamber'' where you fight Baal himself when they are running him/it.
    So.. yeah :)

    (Nice btw ;) )
     
  17. mad.as.a.meataxe

    mad.as.a.meataxe IncGamers Member

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    Hi Nightfish, thanks for the read. Coupla queries:

    1) You use Fire Golem normally over Clay (ie up to entering Baal's chamber)? I presume this from seeing your screenshot. What's the rationale behind this please.

    2) How much inventory space do you keep clear while running? Do you just ID as you go or have one big ID'ing session at the end. I would presume the former.

    3) How long would an average run take you?

    Regards

    MAAM

    EDIT: First question can be ignored as I just read the answer - I'm one of those dumbasses who read the MF guide and asked questions before reading the updated Fishy guide :rolleyes:
     
  18. Phillip

    Phillip IncGamers Member

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    I'm also curious as to how long the run takes, especially how long it takes to kill Baal.

    Nice little guide by the way, that's how i run WSK with my necro as well. :thumbsup:
     
  19. Ashmer Amadeus

    Ashmer Amadeus IncGamers Member

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    Not to be picky NF, especially since your Fishymancer is the only SP pat I've ever had, but any chance you could make a list of lesser, but maybe still allowable MF gear? Before I deleted everything I didn't have a UGH so I used a Peasant Crown(PTopaz). And would it make that much difference if I went ghetto mf and used a 4PTopaz elite armor instead of Skulders? I know I lose the skills, but more then likely I'll have more MF for it.
     
  20. Hrus

    Hrus IncGamers Member

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    You can place a PTopaz in skullders, that beats 4PTopazed armor.
     

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