Fishy build help - can't kill big D

DeathMaster

Diabloii.Net Member
Fishy build help - can't kill big D

What should I do now, my Fishy naked necro can't kill big D (normal), tried number of times, all at "/players 1", all 8 skeletons (max RS), 1 revive, 1 Iron golem (made from few rare weapons), die at one or two hits (most time just one fire or RLoD). My necro with good life (since he doesn't need much str, no need dex, and at very low energy, all goes vit) can stand few hits, but fishy build can't do damage himself. Help!
 

csarmi

Banned
DeathMaster said:
What should I do now, my Fishy naked necro can't kill big D (normal), tried number of times, all at "/players 1", all 8 skeletons (max RS), 1 revive, 1 Iron golem (made from few rare weapons), die at one or two hits (most time just one fire or RLoD). My necro with good life (since he doesn't need much str, no need dex, and at very low energy, all goes vit) can stand few hits, but fishy build can't do damage himself. Help!
There are several methods.
First, try decrepify + clay golem. It is very lame, but works. Big D will be very slow. Your army might survive.
Second, use the combination of Golem+Iron Maiden. He shall kill himself.
 

PowerDispatcher

Diabloii.Net Member
Took my fishymancer a couple trys to get Big D, but I used the clay golem, kept recasting when dead, Decrepify, and just had to get so all the skellies and the golem were in close before he started pumping out the fire and lightning..also, a cold arrow Act 1 merc helped, a decrep'd and chilled Big D does things pretty slowly...but again, took quite a few tries for me before the stars aligned properly, and I go to visit Harrogath, vacation spot of the rich and freezing.

John
 

csarmi

Banned
PowerDispatcher said:
Took my fishymancer a couple trys to get Big D, but I used the clay golem, kept recasting when dead, Decrepify, and just had to get so all the skellies and the golem were in close before he started pumping out the fire and lightning..also, a cold arrow Act 1 merc helped, a decrep'd and chilled Big D does things pretty slowly...but again, took quite a few tries for me before the stars aligned properly, and I go to visit Harrogath, vacation spot of the rich and freezing.

John
Decrepify + Chill + Slow - he won't move much.
 

DeathMaster

Diabloii.Net Member
PowerDispatcher said:
Took my fishymancer a couple trys to get Big D, but I used the clay golem, kept recasting when dead, Decrepify, and just had to get so all the skellies and the golem were in close before he started pumping out the fire and lightning..also, a cold arrow Act 1 merc helped, a decrep'd and chilled Big D does things pretty slowly...but again, took quite a few tries for me before the stars aligned properly, and I go to visit Harrogath, vacation spot of the rich and freezing.

John
So I had to find a sockted bow, add Perfect sappires (just having 2 in hand). I'd give it a go. I don't really like cold arrow, it sometimes leave nothing on ground, I can't rise my army.
 

SnakeEye85

Diabloii.Net Member
clay golem + decrap is always enough for me on players 1

if you can get him chilled then there should be no problems
 

DeathMaster

Diabloii.Net Member
LprMan said:
Do have points in Summon Resist?? That would help you...
Yes, I do have on point there, but doesn't help at all.
Here is stat:
1 Decrepify, 1 Attract, 1 CE, 1 Summon resist, 1 Revive, 20 Rise skeleton, 1 skeleton mastery, all pre-req

I got all skills I will ever need, just need to build them up.

One more question, How long I can stay in act4 (normal) while effectively gain exp? My fishy build wasn't exact following NF's build, so I missed some SM, time to lvl up a while.
 

Dinnin Darkblade

Diabloii.Net Member
DeathMaster said:
Yes, I do have on point there, but doesn't help at all.
Here is stat:
1 Decrepify, 1 Attract, 1 CE, 1 Summon resist, 1 Revive, 20 Rise skeleton, 1 skeleton mastery, all pre-req

I got all skills I will ever need, just need to build them up.

One more question, How long I can stay in act4 (normal) while effectively gain exp? My fishy build wasn't exact following NF's build, so I missed some SM, time to lvl up a while.
Okay, well I'll point out the flaw in your build when it comes to big D. 1 skeleton mastery. Those points you have in golems, mages, and revives all should have gone into mastery to make your skeletons tougher. With that boost they would be able to survive big D. Only golem you should have right now is Clay Golem. Level up some to get another 4 or 5 points into SM and then give it a go. Good Luck
 

LprMan

Diabloii.Net Member
Dinnin Darkblade said:
Okay, well I'll point out the flaw in your build when it comes to big D. 1 skeleton mastery. Those points you have in golems, mages, and revives all should have gone into mastery to make your skeletons tougher. With that boost they would be able to survive big D. Only golem you should have right now is Clay Golem. Level up some to get another 4 or 5 points into SM and then give it a go. Good Luck
More points on SM is of course good thing, but against big D resists and slow is MUCH more important. Clay Golem and Decrepify will slow him down enough to make your skellies survive. Few more poitns in SM won't make too much difference
 

MorbidDoom

Diabloii.Net Member
LprMan said:
More points on SM is of course good thing, but against big D resists and slow is MUCH more important. Clay Golem and Decrepify will slow him down enough to make your skellies survive. Few more poitns in SM won't make too much difference
Nevertheless, keeping SM at 1 like that for so long isn't the best thing to do. When I made my Skelliemancer I pretty much brought SM and RS up equally and I breezed through normal. The added life from SM ensured a much longer survival time than if I had just 1 point in SM, and that helped at D. But right now his best chance is definately Decrep and Clay, since it would take too long at this point to get enough skill points to put into SM to really make a difference.
 

Death_Dealer

Diabloii.Net Member
You also might want to consider swaping out your rogue for an act 2 def merc. This will help your minions stay alive longer. Definately go with decrep, and clay golem though. The other golems are a waste of points IMHO.
 

SnakeEye85

Diabloii.Net Member
MorbidDoom said:
Nevertheless, keeping SM at 1 like that for so long isn't the best thing to do. When I made my Skelliemancer I pretty much brought SM and RS up equally and I breezed through normal. The added life from SM ensured a much longer survival time than if I had just 1 point in SM, and that helped at D. But right now his best chance is definately Decrep and Clay, since it would take too long at this point to get enough skill points to put into SM to really make a difference.

i don´t agree

i always max RS first and then SM!
 

Nightfish

Diabloii.Net Member
Funny... I took him down on players 8 without much trouble... Try getting more than 1 point in SR. And yeah, get an Act 2 Merc next time.

Morbid, maxing RS first works perfectly for me. Much better than keeping them about even, which I did when I played the necro for the first time.
 

MorbidDoom

Diabloii.Net Member
Nightfish said:
Funny... I took him down on players 8 without much trouble... Try getting more than 1 point in SR. And yeah, get an Act 2 Merc next time.

Morbid, maxing RS first works perfectly for me. Much better than keeping them about even, which I did when I played the necro for the first time.
The last time I maxed RS first was back in 1.09, and I distinctively remember that Skelliemancer completely sucking come Act2 Norm. I had to remake that Skelliemancer and balance SM and RS, only then did his skels not die once looked upon. Guess it is different in 1.10, but ever since then I always balance RS and SM at the begining.
 

Nightfish

Diabloii.Net Member
Well, if you wanted to test what's better - maxing RS first or keeping them even you should try both things in the same version...
 

Crudesash68

Diabloii.Net Member
I followed Nightfish's guide for skill allocations to the letter; Big D went down on players 8 with three waves of skellies, using clay golem and prayer merc. I used decrepify and amplify damage in tandem-first, I used decrepify, and then while he tried to swat the skellies, I would switch to amp. I thought three waves of skellies was pretty good, and my necro only had one scary moment, when I got too close to the lightning hose. I am playing it HC, and generally having no problems.


Steve
 

Dinnin Darkblade

Diabloii.Net Member
Maxing Raise Skeleton first adds more damage, more life, more defense, basicly more everything over Mastery. It is much much better to max it first.

However, to the post that said a few points won't help him against big D, yes it would. If he had held off on Blood Golem, Iron Golem, Skele Mages, and Revive that would have given him 4 points more to work with. One of those into Summon Resists and 3 into Skeleton mastery. Now, those three points in skeleton mastery do a few things. They add about 21 more HP's roughly, add more AR and Defense, and they add 6 more points to the base damage. Granted those six points do not sound like much, but with maxed skeletons its truely a massive leap in damage. Since Raise skeleton works by increasing the base damage by a % that 6 damage to the base jumps the actual damage by around 20 points per skeleton. That can make for quite the pounding and a large difference in killing. The extra point in Summon Resist would also allow for the skeletons to live longer.

To the original poster, your best plan right now would be to try and make up those four levels worth of skill points and get SR up a point and 3 more points into SM. This will help you kill off big D. Use lots of Decrepify, sprinkle with a clay golem, and top with mass skeletons and he should die nicely. I second the idea of an act 2 merc simply cause you are going naked. But You may wish to try a prayer merc since Big D's attacks are mostly auto hit elemental attacks anyways. The extra regen may keep your skeletons alive long enough to clober the big red teddy bear.
 

DeathMaster

Diabloii.Net Member
Dinnin Darkblade said:
One of those into Summon Resists and 3 into Skeleton mastery. They add 6 more points to the base damage. Granted those six points do not sound like much, but with maxed skeletons its truely a massive leap in damage. Since Raise skeleton works by increasing the base damage by a % that 6 damage to the base jumps the actual damage by around 20 points per skeleton. That can make for quite the pounding and a large difference in killing. The extra point in Summon Resist would also allow for the skeletons to live longer.
I already lvled up another 3 lvls, so +4 SM now. the add 6 damage on base, and at lvl20 RS, it only add 117% damage, so it worked out at 13. Where does 20 come from? Yes, it does make difference in killing speed, but another point of SR will only add 6% resist. I still couldn't get my skeleton close to big D, that's after I decrep and clay golem him. clay golem dies at any hit, so I had to recast him countless time, 8 skeletons (lvl20 RS, lvl4 SM, 28% resist all) all die at any hit either, no matter fire ring or red lightning.

I guess naked Fishy build is too weak against big D (no +skill items) at low level. I have to stay at act4 until lvl44 (current 37) or something to make up all those +skills.
 
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