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Experts from The SPF: I need your help

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Merlin The Wizzard, May 20, 2008.

  1. Merlin The Wizzard

    Merlin The Wizzard IncGamers Member

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    Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    Hi there. I have some questions. Actually, if you sum t all up, I have a LOT of questions, and I would like it if you would answer those you know an answer for...

    Most of this has to do with my lack of experience on Nightmare/Hell (HC nooblet, I simply dont survive that far :-( )

    All questions deal with 1.10/1.11b games

    Nasty monster hero skill combos.

    What constitutes for nasty unique combos on a) melee monsters, b) ranged monsters, c) caster monsters/special monsters (council members, Oblivion Knights etc)

    - Extra Strong Extra Fast is a nasty one for hard melee hitters of course. But there are worse out there, probably even worse.
    - Cursed/LE - I believe the curse is 'transmitted' by the CB's from the monster as well?

    Well, fill in the blanks I'd say. If you can specify what kind of monsters they are especially lethal for (For instance, Stone Skin isn't a particularly BAD skill for those nasty undead dolls, but Stone Skinned Minotaurs are nothing to sneeze at for a meleeing barb...)

    Second - For these combo's what are the best ways to deal with them for the specific classes? Or even subclasses, when appropriate?

    For instance, bowazons have completely different problems then SpearAzons, and those that use Slow Missile extensively might fear other abilities then those that don't... And that's just amazons for you...
     
  2. Hrus

    Hrus IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    Those that use Slow missiles are usually slaghtered by nasty archers bosspacks while trying to cast Slow missiles :grin:

    Particularly nasty - FE NM Scarabs, FECELE bosspacks, Conviciton + FE/CE/LE...
    Extra Fast/Extra Strong (especially A5 Lancers, Urdars, Frenzytaurs) - you can deal with Extra Strong Cursed, but try to run before extra fast bosses.. and they can easily surround you.
     
  3. zarirazz

    zarirazz IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    being amped. against reanimated with extra strong and/or fanaticism =P

    usually i'll 1 or 2 hit ko if they successfully charge me..
     
  4. TopHatCat64

    TopHatCat64 IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    Melee Monsters

    Extra Fast / Aura Enchanted (holy freeze) / Mana Burn
    Scary on: Any fast monster like blood hawks, spear rogues, ghosts...

    This trio is a dangerous because you're largely immobilized. The monsters have a huge speed advantage since you're slowed and their speed is boosted. Mana burn means that everytime holy freeze pulses, you're losing a ton of mana - meaning your ability to use your skills is very limited. Ghosts are particularly nasty with this trio because they naturally drain mana, they can pass through walls, AND they can stack up on top of each other for maximum attacks.

    For Melee characters, the best way to handle this kind of group is to stand and fight with your merc. Running away simply doesn't work because monsters can keep up with you, and keep you slowed. Take down the unique as quickly as possible and things get much easier. For Ranged characters, let the monsters converge on your merc, then retreat far enough away that you're outside HF's aura but not so far away that your merc runs back towards you. Blast away.

    Aura Enchanted (fanat or might) / Extra Fast / Stone Skin
    Scary on: Any large heavy hitter like yetis, thorn hulks, urdars

    Normally these types of monsters hit hard but pay for it by attacking slowly and moving at a plodding pace. Extra fast erases both penalties and makes for one heck of monster pack. Fanat or might means they hit even harder and stone skin means you're going to slugging it out for awhile with them.

    Melee characters would be best served trying to inch forward and draw off one or two monsters at time. Make sure you kill off any stray monsters that may be around - the only thing worse than 6 monsters with fanaticism is 18 monsters with fanaticism. If your primary attack is elemental based, you're in luck, otherwise bust out your physical immune solution. Ranged characters should try and follow the same basic idea. If you have a recastable tank like wolves, grizzly, golems, valkyrie, decoy, etc.. keep casting it on the far side of the monster pack. Monsters will than be split up between your tank and your merc and both will live longer. Again, fire away with something that does elemental damage.

    Aura Enchanted (conviction) / Lightning Enchanted / Multishot
    Scary on: Basically anything with a lot of hitpoints, beetles

    If you're a melee character, this is not fun. Massive lightning damage everytime you hit the unique and conviction makes a mockery of any resists you might have.

    If I saw this with a melee character, I'd pull out thundergod's vigor and wisp protector. Don't have them? Then I'd probably just park the unique and run away. Inspiring, huh? For ranged characters your merc will probably be fried after a couple hits so you have a small window of time to unleash hell on the unique.

    Cursed (a special mention)
    Scary on: anything

    Basically it seems like all uniques in Hell diff are Cursed and being amped makes even the wimpiest monster in hell hit hard. You can go to the town healer everytime, drop a point in cleansing if you're a paladin, or party up with one who has the aura to get rid of the curse.

    Ranged Monsters

    Aura Enchanted (conviction) / Extra Fast / anything
    Scary on: High damage elemental monsters like abyss knights and gloams

    Conviction gloams...the sight strikes fear in nearly every character. High volume piercing lightning coming from all directions while your resists are in uh...single digits?! And oh yea, they're chasing after you at warp speed.

    Pretty much the ne plus ultra of nasty monsters, conviction gloams require 100% of your attention. For Melee folks try and get within melee range as quickly as possible. Use walls and obstacles along the way to shield yourself from incoming lightning. Their melee attack is pitiful compared to their lightning. You can also entice the gloams to come within melee range by moving around erratically in a small radius, for some reason this seems to make the gloams charge you. For Ranged characters, shoot and scoot. If you stay in one place you will get fried. If you can, try and target the unique first.

    Aura Enchanted (fanat or might) / Extra Fast / Extra Strong
    Scary on: Any ranged physical attackers like rogue/skellie archers and spear cats.

    Ranged monsters are particularly dangerous because their attack range isn't limited to the 8 "spaces" around your character. You can have a TON of projectiles inbound, destination: your head.

    Melee characters: shields come in handy here, as well as walking towards archers to keep your block percentage from dropping. Try to engage as many archers as possible when you get into melee range, that way you'll hopefully stun them with your damage and keep them from firing. Ranged characters just have to stay behind their merc and/or tanks and make sure that you never become the primary target.
     
  5. Ugla

    Ugla IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    There is a lot of stuff which is bad enough on its own, no matter if it's bugged in essence or "merely" imbalanced.

    Dolls on NM and esp. Hell (insane physical damage from their death explosion) - I find it unbelievable that they can be revived ever after!
    Charging zombies on Hell (insane and unblockable physical damage)
    Burning Souls on Hell (insane lightning damage with pierce for even more fun)
    any player's skills used by monsters (Amp!, Nihlathak's CE, IM, as well as the above mentioned Charge and Lightning; Baal uses some sort of CB) - all these ignore the fact that monsters have ~ ten times more life than characters.

    delivering damage at inappropriate occasions - this includes all enchanted monsters, i.e. almost every other boss :rolleyes:
    mana burners (imagine how a life-drain would look like :laugh: )
    tomb vipers (added frame-based physical damage)

    As for the monster mods, most of them were already mentioned, but:
    multiple shot - 3-times more damage at close range is :shocked: esp. stuff like spectral hit, LE, MS (with Conviction :tongue: )
    might > fanaticism on packs due to higher bonus to minions
     
  6. muzzz

    muzzz IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    LE/Beetle + CE/FE/Both.
    Bad on: anything you want to touch.

    Not the worst of combos if you notice it in time. But I've had numerous deaths when I thought "pfah, I can tank those charged bolts easily", only to find out I needed to tank invisible novas and explosions as well.

    Cursed + CE/Fast + Strong/Might/Fanat.
    Bad on: anything that hits you. Especially archers.

    I've had much more deaths to cursed/damage bonus combos than to dual-damage bonus combos. So much, actually, that I often find myself doing a tactical retreat as soon as I get cursed. Which is quite a bit more difficult if the other guys are faster than you.

    Also, these guys deserve special mention for %DR-oriented characters. Going from 50% damage to 150% damage is not pretty.
     
  7. Insane Wayne

    Insane Wayne IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    Look out for Berserkers (the champion type) of any strong monster type. They inflict quadruple damage.

    Beware of Sand Raiders' (4-armed monsters) multi-hit attacks, especially boss packs.

    This is true! SM is dangerous when used recklessly. Her cast animation is slow. Any strong pack of gloams/archers might kill a zon while she's waving her hand in the air. SM is a useful skill but it must be applied carefully.

    -------

    The key to dealing with dangerous Hell packs is to have methods prepared for keeping all, or most, of the mob off you. It sounds simple, but that's really all there is to it. Crowd control skills handle the minions, isolating the boss. Eliminating the boss eliminates their harmful auras. Characters lacking crowd control can use charges of Terror, CoS (Nadir), Teleport, etc... easy to acquire. Or, use tanking minions which can hold out long enough for your spells/attacks to work. If you have weak minions, capable of tanking only normal monsters, be prepared for them to fail, and plan accordingly with other crowd control/evasive tactics. Think ahead.

    Don't panic. When you see those double/triple boss packs, plus champ packs, multiple auras (and you will see them, several times through Hell) the key is not to freeze up, or panic. It's easy to forget what your hotkeys are for seldom-used emergency skills, especially if they're charges. Thinking clearly under heavy fire takes practice. I'd suggest occasional practice against less lethal packs, pretending they were the real thing.



     
  8. maxgerin

    maxgerin IncGamers Member

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    Re: Experts from The SPF: I need your help

    Or save/exit.
    That seems to be the safest. :grin:

    But seriously, I've never trained myself to check the mods of critters, another manifestation of my n00bness.
    When I do see something dangerous, most of the time I'm not prepared for it so I just run away (euphemism: offensive defense), save/exit (if I'm really sure I'll be dead beef), or blast/hack away if I'm feeling a lucky or confident. More often I survive, but my belt is alot lighter afterwards.


    --maxgerin



     

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