Latest Diablo 3 News
DiabloWiki Updates
Support the site! Become a Diablo: IncGamers PAL - Remove ads and more!

Everyone's Oppinion [block Vs. Vit]

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by dkb1982, Apr 12, 2005.

  1. dkb1982

    dkb1982 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Everyone's Oppinion [block Vs. Vit]

    i'm really at a loss here. i don't see too many bone necro's around to ask their oppinion, but what do you guys think. for bone necro, BLOCK/DR or VIT?
    leagues or dualing clans are not a question. just a bone necro for probably mostly pvm and pub pvp from time to time. i need everyone's oppinion please.
    pros, cons, experiences, etc. etc. thank you guys
     
  2. Overtone

    Overtone Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    75% chance to block with a necromancer isn't the easiest thing to achieve, unless you're using homu (maybe another shield, but IMO if you're interested in blocking with a nec, homu is the way to go). You can aim for a lower block %, but I think either aim for max block, or dont aim for blocking at all. If you have max block, you will of course have quite low life. With the block, you're not taking damage 75% of the time, and also, in PvP, people won't leech from you when you block (though that's not really important anymore, 1.10 really made life and mana leech close to useless in PvP).

    With high life, you'll be able to withstand many of the non blockable attacks such as ranged elemental attacks, etc. You also wont get into a block lock if you were using a shield.

    My necromancer has base dexterity, and pumped vita, and I do just fine with clay golem+act 2 merc for my shields. Personally, I would go with more vita with a necromancer, but defiently for 75% chance to block with a melee character.
     
  3. Zpliffman

    Zpliffman IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2005
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    78
    Max block or vita... tricky question. I would have to say if you can afford godly charms such as p&b skillers with 40-45 life and the rest with 20 life sc's with an anni ofcourse. Then maybe. The thing is most times you use a enigma on your necro so you teleport and don't really stand still so it is kind of useless to use max block which will require a lot of dex I don't know if this is correct but i think you will lose about 500-600 life just by doing that depending on the shield.
    I say Vita mancer is the way to go but ofcourse a max block build could be very effective aswell. So the question comes down to. What do you prefer? More life or max block. Are you going to wear a enigma or no? No enigma is max block, enigma is vitamancer. Sorry if this makes no sense I tried :(
     
  4. Bigru

    Bigru IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2004
    Messages:
    151
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    homo- go for block
    anything else= dont

    couple of exceptions, but homo is by far the best choice for block.
    generally the beat necros use darkforce and pump vit, but doesnt sound like (i could be wrong) u can afford a nice darkforce.
     
  5. Boneposse

    Boneposse IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    My question is "Are you playing sc or hc" If playing hc, I say block is more vital. I play hc and I always have max block with my necro--even with enigma. While wearing trangs set, I still had max block and yes my life was lower, but the set has good dr and I experimented witha prayer merc w/high cb to see if that helped. I was used to the skels of v9 which also made me try that. Anyway--its wasy to have max block with homunc, and if using enigma you have extra points you didn't use for strength to put in dex and have good life. Mine has 1320 or so before bo and 2300 after and is very adeqate I think. It depends on how and where you play mostly and how close to the action you get. I believe block to be more import in hc than sc unless you're doing pvp in sc, then it's just as vital IMO. Also, if you bug with marrows you have the extra protection of your bone armor and that's as close to having vita as ,,,well,,having vita. In fact the 15 points you get in bone armor from the bone prison and bone wall synergies is 5 more points of pseudo-life than you get from putting five points in vitality so putting them in dex is not such a big loss--also IMO. If playing sc, I would imagine 20 vitas are pretty common and cheap.They are trading 2 for an ist on the hcladder.You should have plenty of life and block if you get good charm. GL to you.
     
  6. Myrakh-2

    Myrakh-2 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,952
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Don't forget that if you are bonemancer, you most likely have a very high-life bonearmor as well (in fact, even my skelemancer has a very effective bone armor, and he has no points in bonewall...). Bonearmor eats all the physical damage, so if you try to not get swarmed you'll not get ANY physical damage at all.

    Also, a lot of the attacks that would be blocked are melee range attacks, and its always a good idea to stay away from the bad guys. If you want to play a barbarian, do not select the necromancer on the selection screen.

    There's still elemental missile attacks that can be blocked, though, but Gumby, bonewall and curses can help to divert these elsewhere. Besides, even though I vote against blocking, I always vote for high resists.

    Lets look at some numbers:
    1000 fire damage missile, no resists, no blocking -> 1000 damage
    1000 fire damage missile, 75% resists, no blocking -> 250 damage
    1000 fire damage missile, no resists, max block -> 250 damage
    1000 fire damage missile, 75% resists, max block -> 63 damage

    However, assume you need 200 dex to get the max block, so the "no blocking" build has 400 additional life (IIRC necros get 2 life/vit --- I'm playing a no-blocking necro, but I just dump the points in vita without worrying about the actual results): in this example, the no blocking takes 187 additional damage, but since he has 400 more HPs he's still leading.

    Of course, if you change that to 10000 fire damage only the max everything build has a chance to survive --- I don't know whether he'll have the 625 hitpoints, but the others would need 2500... but in order to get 10000 firedamage you pretty much have to have a deathwish to start with.

    Of course it's somewhat an artificially constructed example, but I tend to get out of harm's way when harm moves in my direction, so I'm not dealing with a constant long-lasting bombardment of blockable attacks --- it's more like "oops, a bunch of archers, retreat and setup diversions".
     
  7. Chimaira

    Chimaira IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,709
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    120
    If non PvP then definitely vita. You have a minion with a slowing ability and you have crowd control curses, so you shouldn't get hit too much, and when you get hit you have a fairly strong bone armor. Also the real problem most often come from piercing ranged attacks from Gloams and Viper Magi, where block can't help you.
     
  8. scampi2

    scampi2 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2004
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    33
    Chimaira, i dont agree with you,

    I use a PvP Bone necro with top notch gear and when i am doing baal runs,

    i switch from darkforce to homunc... i dont have 75 % blocking but it should be around 65-70

    i put 100 stat points into dext , rest in vita (my necro has still 3k life with cta when dueling in pvp)

    for pvm: homunc for the blocking (u ever teled in the middle of a group phys damage dealers? without block u be dead in 3 secs, even with mass life)
    for pvp: homunc for babas and bowazons (phys dam) together with some dext items (my amu has +2/5fcr/19 dext/mana/life)

    for pvp: darkforce vs casters

    but it all comes to personal preference, richness and where u duel...
     
  9. Chimaira

    Chimaira IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,709
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    120
    I don't tele...if you don't have Enigma and you progress fairly careful (stay behind your merc/minion(s) you should be safe enough. If you do have teleport I guess it would be nice to have block, but since Enigma is close to impossible for me to get (single player) I'd still advocate all vita...but personal preferences and playstyle can't be accounted for. My personal opinion is that all casters who have some sort of tankable minion could (somewhat) easily go without block.
     
  10. ethos

    ethos IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2005
    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    11
    Im currently making a PvP necro, and I have chosen to go all vit because i will utilise skeletons too, so im hoping with Iron maiden curse most melee'ers will stay away from me :D and the skeletons + gumby will take the zon hits.

    So for a shield i naturally thought spirit, but all im hearing is darkforce darkforce. Wouldnt spirit Monarch be better? More fcr, and loads of fhr which helps vs Bowazons / necros. A 3+ summon 3+ psnbone darkforce is kinda hard to find i think aswell. With all the + str gear, I will probably only have to invest 20-30 into strength, and so the +vit from spirit makes up for it.
    Enigma 60+
    Anihilus 17+
    marrowalks 20+
    maras 5+
    Shako 2+
    =104 + to str
     
  11. dkb1982

    dkb1982 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    thanks for all of your input. still not real sure lol..
    gear setup will be as follows...
    shako
    um'd pvipermagi
    hoto/wiz (depending on mana/resists)
    frosties/trangs
    cat's eye
    ravenfrost/rare
    sander's boots
    arachnids
    homo/spirit or splendor

    ..won't be using tele at all, no mf runs, mostly pvp and a little pvm
    i just plan on having some fun with him. still open for input if you have it.

    thx guys
     
  12. Zpliffman

    Zpliffman IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2005
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    78
    Well if you are making a PvP bonemancer then I will just tell you what I use on my bonemancer since I am making one aswell.
    My gear setup will be this:
    Shako
    Enigma Bp
    Hoto (40 resis)
    Darkspawn
    Archnid
    Rare boots (fwr/fhr/resis)
    Upped magefist
    Soj's
    Crafted amulet (+2 skills/fcr/resis/and some other stuff)
    And Cta and Lidless on switch

    Now I went for an all out vitamancer since Enigma is the only armour with +2 skills which doesn't require over a 100 strenght (determent on the armour), which makes the teleport feature very attractive.

    Inventory:
    Now I use 10 pb skillers some with life some with str, anni and some life/mana life/resis small charms.

    Hope this helps you in anyway.
     
  13. dkb1982

    dkb1982 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    i guess charms would be a huge factor as well. in my case, i can't really afford too many life charms. hmm, haven't thought about that. going to have to do some more research.
     
  14. Kemist

    Kemist IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2005
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    It is very very simple, stick to the basics:

    If ur a decent bone mancer and of course if u are, uve most likely got teleport from Enigma and decent-good cast rate. Now having a high block percent is good for when a melee player is attacking you.

    If you are a decent dueler at all you will not be hit often by melee or if u are, you will have enough life to tank it and kill.

    Other reasons why max block is not needed, of course u can tele ect, u can iron maiden so melee and hope u get hit lol, or u can summon stack ect.

    If you chose max block, it would add a little help for u against melee but ur life would be low (1k-1.5k) with cta bos and any caster could kill u quick and easy. If u invest all points into life, casters wont kill u as fast and neither will melee which wont hit u half the time because u should easily kill them first.




    Its life for sure.
     
  15. dkb1982

    dkb1982 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    vit it is. btw, does anyone know what happened to the old necro duels channel back in 09? does anyone even still duel nvn? what happened to us proud necros? enough whining, i'm out. thx for your input everyone
     
  16. Pherdnut

    Pherdnut IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    1,749
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    466
    Can't speak for serious dueling since I don't do much but I like to at least keep block at 50% for PvM. It's like cutting all melee damage in half. Also, there's nothing wrong with Trang's Wing's block of 66%. 75 is great. It doesn't mean anything under that sucks.
     
  17. HafidzMD

    HafidzMD IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2005
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    33
    hey

    im a frequent visitor but never posted anything.
    anyways..

    vit vs block. its really depends on ur gameplay. i play pvm and have a slow internet. i have always been a spearmancer. so here goes.

    i need to be able to stand 10 seconds lag at all time. i made a necro to 97 with pure vit, no stat points go anywhere xcpet vits. highest life recorded was 7k, i must say my build was extremely good but when it comes to 10 seconds lag and surrounded by hordes of frenzy monsters and mages with curses, chances are i'd die.

    seeing no future with my 10 seconds lag, i made another necro, hes now 98, with 75% block and others to vit. i find that blockin attacks is much better than having a huge pool of life with no blockin. (low blockin). most of the times, monsters miss the hit. and ive survived lags of more than 10 seconds.

    also, i have 18% dmg reduced and high defense (around 8k). im still thinkin on how to make a char that can survive a minute lag, or more.
     
  18. UltraNull

    UltraNull IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Survive a minute lag in Hell?
    A pally with max block, a level 40 Prayer, resist all 95%, 50% dr and some '(magic)dmg reduce by X' stuff could do the trick.
    Peferrably with a Doom weapon for slower monsters.
    The trick is to make a build that alowes you to have Meditation on at all times and have a shield.
    Myabe a Hammerdin/FOHer, but a weak one, since you can not use Concentration or Conviction..
     
  19. Myrakh-2

    Myrakh-2 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2004
    Messages:
    2,952
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    I hate playing with this kind of lag, but my Skelemancer has no major issues with that. Or almost no --- I don't go into the WSK with this kind of lag: black souls don't one-hit kill me, but I don't want to get fried for a minute before I know what's going on :)

    Of course, a minute is extreme. I've played with a few seconds of lag and just estimating that I could handle a minute as well. It would be very slow progress, though, as I cannot operate completely blind, and I have to make sure I stay behind my skellies even if I don't see what's going on...
     
  20. Tib

    Tib IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2004
    Messages:
    221
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    102
    I thought the point of all the +str stuff was to get marrows on! Why would you count +str from marrow? Sounds kind of redundant if ya'll ask me ;)

    From a PvP perspective, many melee combatants tend to stock psn charms... those can be a bytch without good gear/potions. I think it's important to look into the potential damage of psn charms since they WILL hurt you if they get past your shield. With 75% ctb, you're blocking not only the physical impact, but the poisionous / wounding aftereffects of the blow/s :) It's terribly important (imo) to calculate these factors into the vitamancer build.

    I run max block and an enigma. Reason being, my defence is low, so I NEED the max block to make up for it! Every level, I've been putting 2 dex, 3 vita. Works like a charm :)
     

Share This Page