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Edge runeword , thorn aura

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Tecibbar, Aug 28, 2010.

  1. Tecibbar

    Tecibbar IncGamers Member

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    Edge runeword , thorn aura

    I am playing an untwinkled summoner. And I found Edge bow extremely helpful. I think the monsters do more damage to themselves than the damage done by my minion.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. hubb

    hubb IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    It's considered crap for hell because the monsters have so much hp compared to the damage they do. For example (if the arreat summit monster data is correct) an amp'ed venom lord in norm will lose 91% of his HP when hitting a skelly, compared to only 13% in hell. Also, in hell the most dangerous monsters are ranged or elemental, so thorns doesn't help you there.

    I've also just started an untwinked summoner and will try it out as soon as my merc hits 25 :)

    average dmg/average hp

    norm:
    (14*2 + 810%)/280 = 91%

    hell
    (122*1.5 + 810%)/12361 = 13%
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2010
  3. Damric

    Damric IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    Yes, it's overall usefulness will diminish greatly by the time you get to hell. You can use amplify damage to double the effect though. Some boss packs in hell that hit extra hard will still get rather hurt by amp'd thorns (lister's pack), but once eight players are in the game you can forget it. The damage to life ratio is just too small at that point. Use it against nightmare cows and stuff for some easy untwinked leveling.
     
  4. Tecibbar

    Tecibbar IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    13% is still pretty good comparing to 0%, especially since you are just standing there doing nothing. I will keep it on switch.

    I would rather hold it myself, might aura is too good to miss.

    Another question, if both monster and my minion are amped, won't it be 13%*4=52%?
     
  5. Pasky

    Pasky IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    It's not that it's 13%, it's 13% and they will most likely heal it back. Also, if you want to do thorns, it'd be better to have it on a might merc using bramble. I know edge is a much cheaper alternative.
     
  6. YogiRat

    YogiRat IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    WHAT!?!
    Do you realize this is taking place in an active combat situation? Not only is the monster taking damage back from the thorns, it is receiving damage from the minion and taking damage again the next time it attacks and on. But not for very long. There is very little/no time for monster healing in battle unless you are dealing with Zakarum.

    I think that is right.:thumbup:

    I've used 'Edge' rogues for a couple seasons now, mostly because of A2 mercs being useless in those small back waters known as the CS and the WSK.:evil2:

    After glancing at this thread, I decided to can my level 85 rogue and go with a might merc. "IM is gone, he should be safe, I'll give him an 'Obedience'
    eth thresher just to be fair to him."

    The result for me has been pretty mixed, Yes, this merc is one bad boy one on one, I have seen well dressed might mercs kill Hell Baal before. But his help with aura and damage out in the open with regular monsters is about even, maybe weaker than thorns.

    more in a bit..
     
  7. TurtleBay

    TurtleBay IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    Only enemies can be affected by amp.
     
  8. Mad Mantis

    Mad Mantis D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    Monsters like Griswold cast Amp on your minions.



     
  9. zrk

    zrk IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    It isnt 1.06 any more. Damage reflection doesnt do much. But those type of builds are helluva fun to play if youre into old scool single player! Iron maiden is an absolute monster.
     
  10. onderduiker

    onderduiker IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    Level 15 Thorns returns 810% melee physical damage, not +810%, so:

    14*8.1*2/280 = 81%

    122*8.1*1.5/12361 = 12%

    Hubb's calculations already took into account the monster being cursed with Amplify Damage (Venom Lords have Damage Resist 0% in Normal, resulting in DR -100% when AD is cast and damage being multiplied by 2; they have DR 50% in Hell, resulting in DR -50% when AD is cast and damage being multiplied by 1.5), so damage approximating 24% (12*2) of Venom Lord life is returned if your minion is cursed with AD and has DR 0% (Clay Golem has DR 25%, Iron Golem will have DR % when made out of an item with that property and Revived will have the monster's DR %).

    As TurtleBay pointed out, the Necromancer can't curse his own minions so they can only be cursed with AD by Cursed Unique monsters, Oblivion Knights or Stygian Furies.


     
  11. hubb

    hubb IncGamers Member

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    Re: Edge runeword , thorn aura

    Ah, that makes more sense. So use to just doing weapon dmg I didn't think clearly about it :)
     

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