Does "fire facets" effect DTail splash?

Claws

Banned
Does "fire facets" effect DTail splash?

i would really like to know this :scratch: ... cuz i still have 1 socket left in my tucs and got a +5/-3 fire facet in a trade some days ago :)
 

Claws

Banned
hehe... gonna use a CoH :)... think the +2 skills+that fire facet will help more then a fire ormus :)... dont know what amu to use yet tho... thinking of maras :)
 

Frenzied Bovine

Diabloii.Net Member
Research needs to be done to determine if the +15% fire from Ormus multiplies the total fire damage (AFTER the DTail multiplication of TS) or adds to the DTail multiplier of TS..

If it multiplies, then the formula becomes ((kick dam * TS) * DTail) * Ormus

I am sure you can see how that might rock :)
 

jrichard

Diabloii.Net Member
Ouch, just realized that i had never got around to testing that for you like i said i would frenzied. sorry. I'll try to get to it. I've taken a break from testing and actually even from playing 'sins for a few days. Mourning the loss of my HC trapper. :)

I still believe that the fire facets will work and will be applied after dtail as the damage isn't actually converted to fire until then.

jrichard
 

Claws

Banned
hmmm... i believe that this must be tested b4 i know what to use... since i have both tucs and fire lizards :)
 

Frenzied Bovine

Diabloii.Net Member
I think that only the fire damage from the primary Firelizard would work.

The question is, how does the fire damage fit into the equation? Assuming it's additive, 236-480 isn't that much when you are already releasing several thousand fire damage in an AoE.
 

Pent

Diabloii.Net Member
in response to original poster:

unnecessary runewords are the downfall of most builds
15% fire ormus is totally better then +2 skills, on terms of fire damage output.
just because it's a high end runeword doesn't mean it works for every build ;)
Don't get me wrong chains of honor is a nice runeword, with +2 skills, resists, DR, ect, but if you don't need the resists or DR I don't see why you would use it :)
fade fixes all DR and resists problems imo...

by the way, I myself would use the hand of justice runeword in a nice phase blade or something to make for quick kicks. if just for the -20% To Enemy Fire Resistance, Level 16 Holy Fire Aura When Equipped (bonus)

although I'm not sure how dual bartucs socketed with 5/5 fire facets would fare in comparison, that also looks tasty.

I'm guessing the dual bartucs wins, +6 martial arts, and 10% fire damage/10% minus fire resists
 

ThyForbidden

Diabloii.Net Member
Hand of jsutice takes cham.. It's really not worht it. Holy fire without senergies is awful.

I think best thing would really be a 470ish(i think thats max fire dmg on magical...) claw with 2 facets in it, and a sheild with like cheap fire facets. With charge up melee chars i've found c/s to be superior myself.. but thats just me.

Right now I'm making my fire assassin for LLD.. got those fire dmg boots on and all, lol. Trying to find a 15% ormus(I only have a 12% fire with a light facet) and a few fire facets befor I go on. :p
 

jrichard

Diabloii.Net Member
Okay frenzied,

Sorry to say, but Ormus's robes do not seem to affect dtail damage. I still need to test some more as the wide damage range of dtail makes most of the hits when only 15% is added to the damage fall within the normal damage range. So far, i'm seeing that the armor affects damage added by other sources, but not the dtail damage itself. Chains of Honor kicks (pun intended) the hell out of the robes for a dtailer imo.

On the fire facets, they don't affect dtail either. At least the +%fire skill damage doesn't. Not sure on the -%enemey fire resistance yet.

For the hand of justice runeword. Tried one on a test kicker a while back. Less damage than a dual 'tuc setup. It has -20% to enemy fire resistance, but it takes more than that on average to make up for the damage loss from the stats and skills of the 'tucs. A shield filled with fire facets starts to get there, but on my titan built kicker it still doesn't do it. From a pure pvm perspective, making up for the loss of +all assassin skills from the tucs causes the HoJ to really lose out when taking the whole build into account. Understand, with a fully charged TS we're talking about a difference in damage of over 10,000. That's a lot of ground to make up for. It really only does so against targets with very high fire resistance. Against all others the damage is much less than with the 'tucs.

As a side note: During the testing for this i learned something new. The ED added by TS is determined by the level TS was at when you last charged it. In other words, i could charge up with a dual 'tuc setup and then switch to a HoJ/facet shield setup and get much higher Dtail damage than if i charged TS with the sword/shield setup active. The reverse is also true, if i charged TS with the s/s setup and then switched to the 'tucs, my dtail damage would be much lower than if i charged TS with the 'tucs active.

ThyForbiden,
I'm not sure you understand how dtail works. The fire damage added by firelizards wouldn't be multiplied by TS or the dtail bonus and it wouldn't be applied in the area of effect. It would just be added on to the release strike. The claws have no more +skills than a 'tucs and don't have the str/dex of the tucs. In the end, you'd be better off with the tucs. One other question, what makes up a LLD? 'Cause the robes have a clvl req of 75. That doesn't seem very low level to me. Even the facets req of 49 doesn't strike me as very low level.

jrichard
 

Frenzied Bovine

Diabloii.Net Member
JRichard - thank you for testing that. It's sort of a mix of good and bad news really. It's bad news in that Ormus doesn't help. It's good news in that Ormus is really bad for all the OTHER things you'd want to stay alive, like resists, and furthermore lacks skills.

Gogo CoH! Everyone has one by now, right? Right?
 

jrichard

Diabloii.Net Member
A thought on why the +%fire skill damage doesn't work. I think that the increase in damage is being applied before dtail converts the damage to fire. So, when it is applied, the damage is still physical and is not affected.

jrichard
 

Radagast

Diabloii.Net Member
jrichard said:
Okay frenzied,



On the fire facets, they don't affect dtail either. At least the +%fire skill damage doesn't. Not sure on the -%enemey fire resistance yet.

For the hand of justice runeword. Tried one on a test kicker a while back. Less damage than a dual 'tuc setup. It has -20% to enemy fire resistance, but it takes more than that on average to make up for the damage loss from the stats and skills of the 'tucs. A shield filled with fire facets starts to get there, but on my titan built kicker it still doesn't do it.
jrichard
Slightly confused still. Could you please clarify: does - enemy resis work? And thanks so much for the testing, its really really appreciated!
 

jrichard

Diabloii.Net Member
sorry, not sure on whether or not the -%enemy resist works when it comes from a facet socketed weapon. The HoJ weapon seems to work and the 'tuc with a fire facet should also, but when the change is only 5% it gets harder to tell.

jrichard
 

Claws

Banned
WOW... ty to jr :)... just in time to decide what to socket in my tucs :)... gonna change that +5/-3 fire facet to a +13 all res jewel :)
 
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