Latest Diablo 3 News
DiabloWiki Updates
Support the site! Become a Diablo: IncGamers PAL - Remove ads and more!

Do we even care? {Lebanon}

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by jmervyn, Apr 25, 2005.

  1. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    15,275
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    498
    Do we even care? {Lebanon}

    I thought it interesting that I've seen almost no coverage of Syria's pullout from Lebanon. While I've not been glued to the TV, I sample several different news outlets, and I only recently saw something on Yahoo talking about how the Syrians are effectively out today, which I guess is around 4 days ahead of schedule.

    Instead, I've seen plenty of Papacy, Jacko 'the fondler', and a goodly bit of how eeevil Frist is for joining in a televangelist broadcast about the judicial filibuster (I guess churches in Harlem don't play a political role - it was absolutely SHOCKING that Frist would play up to a religious audience!).

    So what's up, folks? Is it that we just don't care a whit about what used to be one of the most urbane countries in the Mid-East, emerging from the shadow of what is debatably one of the most oppressive? Is the media petrified at the thought of even hinting about a relation to Shrub's "democracy breaking out all over" plans? Are we so shallow that we're more interested in Jacko's paedophelia than people actually having a chance to pave their own way?
     
  2. Garbad_the_Weak

    Garbad_the_Weak IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2003
    Messages:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    466
    The price of gas is going down, so who cares what the barbarians do?

    Garbad
     
  3. Necrolestes

    Necrolestes IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2003
    Messages:
    1,904
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    Early withdrawal method rarely works.

    I've only seen mention of this historic event in my local paper; nothing of this has been on my local or national news (though it may be on tonight). Lebanon will not truly be free until all pro-Syrians are voted out of office (it is more likely, however, that pro-Syrians will be removed by more violent means) and the military withdrawal is only the beginning (this, perhaps, is why the news has chosen to ignore it because this is just the first step and not the final destination of Lebanon's journey towards freedom).

    Edit: Here's an article on Yahoo showing the first steps towards freedom
     
  4. Dirty_Zulu

    Dirty_Zulu IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    1,580
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    466
    From the media's money making perspective, stuffs about a place most Americans never heard of doesn't sell. Most of my friends never heard of Kuwait before Sadam invaded it. Same with Kabul.

    So if it's not about Jacko's tickling, Britney's pregnancy, or which celebrity is swapping parters, it wouldn't sell.
     
  5. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    15,275
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    498
    I'd be a lot more willing to buy the 'ignorant yanqui' concept if it weren't for all the Lebanese that fled the country over the decades. They're almost as well known for being 'wild geese' expats as the Irish. I was talking with my Mom's landlord in Honduras about Nicaragua, only to be hearing him jump to talking about Britain's involvement in Palestine; turns out, of course, that the family was originally Lebanese.

    Sales likely do have a lot to do with it - so I guess self-obsessive/narcissistic Westerner does factor in. Still, I cringe to think that the media panders so exclusively to the shallow & purile... then again, seeing how many 'reality TV' shows there are reinforces that viewpoint.

    Thank God for BBC America...

    EDIT - I suppose PR plays a role as well: http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html
     
  6. jimmyboy

    jimmyboy IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    2,551
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    We're Americancentric. The Paris of the Middle East... well ... it's Paris. And even though Jacko is a weirdo, he's our weirdo. He even gets more air time than the Pope.
     
  7. llad12

    llad12 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    6,189
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    466
    Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the USA invited the Syrians to come into Lebanon in some 25-30 years ago to help stablize the country.

    "Breaking out all over"??

    Perhaps you should read a portion of this interview from Juan Cole:

    Democracy Now

    While Dubya's little escapade in invading/conquering and nation building a third world country may have a positive effect in ridding the world of Saddam, the end results of this type of intervention may be far more detrimental to US interests in this area than one cares to believe.


    PS: The LA Times and CNN ran an AP wire story on Syria's withdrawal.
     
  8. Steel_Avatar

    Steel_Avatar IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2003
    Messages:
    3,087
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    I'll second Jimmyboy. I saw the title of this thread, and I read "Lebron" as in Lebron James, who I admittedly do not care about.
     
  9. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,522
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ehh, I dunno, maybe you should move into this century. I checked the news on my phone during a break at school and pretty much everything on the air or on web sites was either Japan's train wreck or Lebanon. Bolton, Frist, and Delay managed to use the vast right-wing media conspiracy to disappear from the spotlight, and instead focused it on disasters and "victories for democracy thanks to America **** yeah!" that are neither victories for democracy nor thanks to America.

    As far as Syria moving into this century, all I've really got to say is "**** yeah!"
     
  10. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    15,275
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    498
    Well, if I can rely on Duped and Ill for nothing else, it is to be contrary. Ill, you'll have to show me chapter & verse if you want me to accept the idea that we urged THE prototypical Soviet client state to intervene in the civil war of a neighbor to our only ally in the region. Duped, I only caught the Yahoo! story from Wired; it had already passed from view on the main page and hence I saw no regular coverage.

    But regardless of the legitimacy of Juan Cole or his opinions, my concerns about the lack of any sort of perspective remain. Aren't we blinding ourselves by allowing mass media to dictate our "interests" to such an extent (note I don't resort to 'libberul medyh', since I've been just as disgusted with FOX's overcoverage of Terry Schaivo and Jacko)?
     
  11. zarikdon

    zarikdon IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2003
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    62
    Maybe they're waiting for the official ceremony on Tuesday? But the boredom factor might be important too.
     
  12. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,522
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I'm contrary? Tell it to my phone, man. It's not my fault my phone is so much cooler than your computer.

    *puts more bars in more places*
     
  13. DurfBarian

    DurfBarian IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2003
    Messages:
    9,707
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    467
    I think the Bush Administration has been pressuring the media to keep the Syria story out of the news because it won't do to have the public thinking this thuggish state is on the way to redemption before we start bombing it.

    I'll be signing tin-foil hats at Borders later this week. :teeth:
     
  14. Ash Housewares

    Ash Housewares IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Messages:
    21,802
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    467
    dot dot dot


    HIPPY!
     
  15. llad12

    llad12 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    6,189
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    466
    An excerpt from a brief synopis of Lebanon history ... Per Juan Cole:

    Global Policy or Juan Cole's Informed Comment



    I don't claim to be a expert on Lebanon history ... thus a qualifer was used in my original statement.

    If anything, the only debating point that could have be made, relative to my quoted statement, was that the invite to Syria was made by the embattled Christian president of Lebanon (with tactical approval from Israel and the USA per JC).

    SF Gate

    I am disappointed with your attack on Juan Cole. The use of a Horowitz attack-dog-site, linked in order to discredit this learned professor of Middle Eastern history, seems a rather pathetic tactic --> reminiscent of Karl Rove.

    Debate the issues if you can ... not the man.
     
  16. Anakha1

    Anakha1 Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2003
    Messages:
    10,368
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Everyone knows that a nation cannot turn to democracy on its own good time. The U.S. has to do it for them.
     
  17. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    15,275
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    498
    Nor am I - but I had no desire to turn this into just another fencing match. My point was the shallow nature of our media, not Lebanese history.

    When you cite him so extensively, I have every right to examine his motivations and legitimacy (which, like Hersh, I don't regard as infallible or even necessarily accurate because they appear so irrationally partisan; Hersh has been on the Daily Show and seems like a nutter). I don't give a rat's -tail- about their winning of awards, since they are often preaching to the converted like yourself. Particularly, as I said, when you're the one reeling away from my intended topic.

    If you really want to sink to another quibble, as you seem to delight in, here's two that I chanced across on Google that certainly don't validate Cole's "CIA is EEEVIIILLLL" mantra as the cause:
    And

    But that's it - if I'm going to waste my time bickering with you or Duped about how the evil U.S. is really at fault for this too, I'd rather let this thread die.
     
  18. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,522
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Hey, maybe you can quote me on that?

    I'm not saying the US is evil, I'm just saying that it's ridiculous to assume that this pull-out is because of American military presence in the region (as opposed to, say, the months of public demonstrations and diplomatic railings against their presence that went on prior to this apparently under your radar). I think perhaps you'll recall what happened the last time America had a military presence in Lebanon. I mean, you have been touting yourself as the planet's sole expert in all things military, I'd assume things like that wouldn't slip your mind.

    Also, you'll be happy to know that this has made its way onto Yahoo so you can find it without actually reading any news. It's currently right beside the story about our top weapons hunters declaring the WMD hunt in Iraq completely exhausted. (Haha, I got you good! America is evil!)
     
  19. DrunkCajun

    DrunkCajun Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2004
    Messages:
    5,249
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    merv, I don't think you're giving the Bushies credit where credit is due, and I'm not talking about Lebanon.

    Bush and his camp have a great grasp of how to control the media. If they wanted Lebanon to be making headlines next to the derailed train and Wacko Jacko, it would be, because the press office of the White House would be bleating about it like a stuck sheep.

    They're not, because they're being realistic about it. Claiming that the White House is solely responsible for helping Lebanon find democracy is a very weak claim that would soon be shot down, and moreover there's still no guarantee that things will go smoothly. This is the Middle East, for crying out loud. The day that Bush declares a victory and congratulates the Lebanese democracy is the day some psycho with a trunk full of explosives finds just the right target to immolate and turns the whole thing right back into a disaster again.
     
  20. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    15,275
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    498
    Perhaps, though I don't know that there's as much interest in the press office as in what Paris Hilton is screwing lately (then again, if Ari had dressed in a leotard, the press would be all over it like, well, a cheap suit).

    Ok, I can buy that Shrub won't draw any attention to it because he knows both just how debatable any U.S. support would be and how likely it would be to aggravate those involved. But that still doesn't explain to me why there was a dearth of coverage earlier - I finally saw a snippet on FOX, though the entire Hannity & Colmes was spent blathering on about kidnapped & murdered children (with a side of bumfight coverage). Still nothing on the AM earlier shows, though as Duped mentioned it was up on Yahoo again.

    FOX I expect to be tawdry & shallow, I suppose... yet I saw them hitting the issue earlier than the 'big 3'.
     

Share This Page