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Difficulties, should they return?

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 General Discussion' started by raveharu, Jul 9, 2009.

  1. raveharu

    raveharu Diabloii.Net Member

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    Difficulties, should they return?

    Just wondering, did Blizzard confirmed D3 will be applying the same different difficulty levels(normal, nightmare, hell) like D1 and 2?
    I read it off somewhere but I can't remember.

    I don't really like the idea of replaying the game 3 times, I mean I know it's the way Diablo games are made, but can't they think of a better solution, say dividing the entire game into the 3 different difficulties. This means the game content has to be huge, but isn't that a good thing too :thumbup:

    Furthermore, I have always felt that epic end game dungeons like, for example, Hell, should remain, well, epic. Because of this difficulty thing implemented, I do not have any special feeling towards end game content in Diablo because it was completed in Normal. No satisfaction or whatsoever.

    Edit: Oh shucks I couldn't change the title, it should be "Blizzard should change the difficulty system" :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2009
  2. Nextt

    Nextt Banned

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    Who says its gonna be the same game though from perhaps act 1 -5 in normal and act 1-5 in hell? They didn't really specify that far into it so, they might have plans to have it be quite different.

    I don't think it will be replaying game 3 times. I think it will be like act 1's final boss in normal might be someone who is seen in the lore as a strong enemy but not quite that strong. and maybe act 5 of normal will be like 1 of the actual Ancients who is considered to be one of the weaker ones, And act like 3 or 4 of Hell might be the stronger ancient?

    I dunno how its gonna be just sayin, it might be like that so it isn't the same game replayed 3 times.
     
  3. Echod16

    Echod16 Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    If they don't, I'm not buying the game

    Include Uber mode again, too...but make the bosses stuff like Starcraft Marines, Ultralisks, and Tauren from Warcraft ;p
     
  4. raveharu

    raveharu Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    The only thing they could add is stronger monsters, if they add different content for every difficulty wouldn't it indirectly affect the game's lore?

    My suggestion is more feasible then, using D2 as an example, make Normal be Act 1-2, Nightmare Act 3, and Hell Act 4-5. Of course everything else must change, the content added into each Act should be at least 10 times more.


     
  5. Nextt

    Nextt Banned

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    Mmm, yeah but I mean that means these places would have to be HUGE, like MMO huge where you might run across multiple towns, etc etc. And I dunno i don't see how it could go like this unless the max level is like 50.

    I didn't read the games lore nore care about it personally I play a game because I like the game not because I like the lore. BUT, I don't see how they couldn't make it like that without affecting the lore? Isn't there most likly small parts of the lore throughout the whole thing that could be used over a longer period of time?

    If not then I dunno.


     
  6. blikst

    blikst Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    As a casual D2 single player, I would hate that suggestion because it would take forever for me to "beat" the game. I simply don't have time if the hell difficulty matches the one in D2.


     
  7. 5zigen

    5zigen Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    If "difficulties" don't return, they are taking a HUGE step backwards in throwing away content.

    They even moved to difficulties in WoW for both dungeons AND raids (normal v. Heroic).

    They need at least 2 difficulties. One to go through the "story" and 1 for the actual challenge.

    While it's likely not going to be based solely on the act / world system of D2. Just imagine what it would be like for a second to have no difficulties. You would end up with a metagame focused around 1 Act (or Zone or Area). The result? Playing the same small amount of content over and over again for the metagame. To counter this, blizzard will have to dump a LOT of work into in game assets at high levels and accepting low level content as throw away content.

    Because there will be no reason to go backwards to low level content (maybe 5 times, one for each class, but no more with the inclusion of respecs) all of that low level stuff will just become things seen once and skipped over from there on. In other words, throw away content.

    adding difficulties increases the amount of content for the metagame, and additionally gives people a reason to revisit content more than once for different reasons.

    Not including difficulties in the game would be a HUGE mistake.
     
  8. raveharu

    raveharu Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    End game content should never be easy, it should be unique in a way such that not everyone will be able to complete it without a challenge. If any tom, dick or harry is able finish the game, then game = fail.

    As if that is worse than playing the same thing three times, only with the monsters being stronger the only difference :rolleyes:

    Like I said if my idea were to suffice, they need to boost their content per Act, and not just a mere few quests like in D2.

    Like I said if you were to use D2 as an example of course it won't be feasible because each act only has 6 quests, one town and a few maps.

    But if they made used of all 9 highlighted towns as shown in the D3 world map, and each 3 makes a difficulty then things will be ALOT more different. And my idea will be more feasible based on that speculation, of course.

    3 different towns + tons of dungeons + plenty of quests +different game content per difficulty is always better than same 5 Acts + repeated quest + same game content X 3.

    No it doesn't. It only forces players to go through the same thing 3 times.

    There are many ways to make people visit the previous Acts, if that is what you wish for. You don't need 3 different difficulties to make it applicable.

    It doesn't need to be as huge as an MMO.

    They could add three different areas for every difficulty. It's possible if you look at D3's world map, there are 9 places highlighted with a beacon.


     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2009
  9. Mackan

    Mackan Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    They have more or less confirmed that the difficulties Normal, Nightmare and Hell will return. They have mentioned it in interviews. They want Normal to be just 'normal'... meaning that anyone can beat the game. But for the other ones, they want things to become more challenging than just upping the damage and hitpoints of monsters.

    Well, that's what I heard.


     
  10. blikst

    blikst Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    You are talking like this is a MMORPG. It isn't. I want to be able to beat Diablo and go through all the acts on single player without spending ridicuolous amount of time playing. What you propose would efficiently exclude a large chunk of players from enjoying the games full content (story line). Having several levels of difficulty eliminates the problem and there are other ways to make them feel diffrent.

    This is a much better system for these kind of games.


     
  11. AniMe

    AniMe Banned

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    blikst; just because you want to be able to spend an afternoon, going through the entire game doesn't mean everyone else want less content.

    Remember the old NES games? Those games took like, 30 minutes to an hour to finish in general if you didn't have a particular motor disorder... NO ONE wants that with a big time game like D2. I mean, even casual gamers want endless content...

    If you buy a game for $50, why would you want to finish it in a day? Enjoy it for hours, days, weeks, months... years ;) No harm in that, even if you can only play a few hours per weekend...

    A game that lasts>a game that's finished.
     
  12. blikst

    blikst Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    When did I say I wanted to be able to play through it in one day? It should take a reasonable time for the average gamer. There are many ways you can prolong a game and all I'm saying is that I don't think raveharu's idea is a good one.

    Do you honestly think that a single player game should take a casual players years before being able to beat the final boss? As I've said, you can find plenty of other ways of making high end charachers fun to play and other ways to make the difficulty levels feel different.


     
  13. Nextt

    Nextt Banned

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?


    Then they can make Single Player easier by reducing mobs hp dmg etc for the people like you.
    OH WAIT, thats right casual gamers don't want it to be easy you want it to be challenging, yet it can't be challenging to where it takes longer than a week to beat the game.


     
  14. PReP

    PReP Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    I believe it is just this thing (or among others)
    that blizzard say that they will have many randomized quests for each new game (and/or difficulty) :)

    To make it slightly different everytime, and that is very promising :)
     
  15. blikst

    blikst Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    I'm not the voice of all casual gamers.... I'm just stating my opinion. And I haven't said I wanted be able to beat the game in a week...

    And how is the first sentance you wrote any diffrent than what they did in D2. One player = easier mobs. Two players = harder mobs. Good job on that...


     
  16. Kingbob

    Kingbob Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    Maybe they could release new content like new skills in greater difficulties. That makes it so you are playing in a whole different way than you played the previous difficulty.
     
  17. paperkut

    paperkut Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    Easy guys...blikst is just sayin the game should be enjoyable for everyone in that we should all get to play through the storyline. Not all of us have hours upon hours a day to hand over to diablo.

    That's why the difficulties are so fitting for a game of this type. Casual gamers can handle the normal difficulty, while hardcore gamers hang out in the higher difficulties. This doesn't mean the game has to be beatable in a week. This means that your average Joe should be able to play when he has time and progress through the story with minimal level grinding and item hunting. Throw in too much of either of these and then storyline loses its shine as the player loses focus on it. The story can be really long, it just can't leave a player stuck at a point in the story for weeks on end. Once the player has enjoyed the storyline, then the game can become more difficult and require more grinding and hunting for hardcore players.
     
  18. Nimbostratus

    Nimbostratus Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    I really liked the way D2's difficulty allowed you to have more of an "all areas are still relevant" endgame. However, I really dislike that they end up feeling as just one continuous journey, since that prevents them from being treated as actual difficulty settings. People say "oh, casuals can beat Normal, that should be enough." Except it isn't, since these difficulties don't work that way. Act 5 Hell isn't treated as "Act 5 on Hard," but as "Act 15."

    Perhaps D3 could include both D2-style difficulties as well as traditional ones. Preferably without it being confusing. xP
     
  19. paperkut

    paperkut Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    I think i get what your saying... Are you saying we should pick a difficulty in the begining and then start from scratch at that difficulty? Like you could pick Hell right away and then the game would have that hard-as-hell feel all the way through the 5 acts?

    Not gonna lie, I kinda like it.
     
  20. Nextt

    Nextt Banned

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    Re: Difficulties, should they return?

    That isn't what he is saying, he is saying that it shouldn't take the casual 2x longer (or more , usually is more cause casual plays less than 2x of hardcore player) to play through the story.

    Which doesn't work.


    This doesn't work, Casuals are never simply satisfied with normal difficulty or hell difficulty, because they feel they should be able to do with the hardcore player can do while spending no where near the same amount of time.

    A game cannot exist where both hardcore players and casual players find a game equally enjoyable. Theres like 500 examples i can give but ill give 2.

    1. Casuals feel they should be able to do what the hardcore player can do (or at least 95% of it) while not having to spend as much time as the hardcore player

    2. The hardcore player feels the casual should only be able to do half of what the hardcore player did in double the time the hardcore player spent. Meaning if the hardcore player takes 1 year to get the best gear of everything, it should take the casual player 2 years to get the best gear of everything. (This is assuming the hardcore player plays 2x longer) like casual = average of 15 hours played a week, hardcore = average of 30 hours played per week. (Which obvoiusly real numbers would probably be like hardcore = 41-140 hours played per week and casual can range from 10-40.

    And yeah 140 is insane, chances are that person will die from not enouph sleep and bad health.


     

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