Deadly Strike and Crushing Blow together?

Nesjan

Diabloii.Net Member
I hope this is ok posted here if not mods feel free to move it.
Could someone explain to me the details of how Deadly Strike and Crushing Blow work together?
I thought i had read that they do not stack but work seperately so say you have 50% DS and 50%CB your doing one or the other each time you hit never both, but i have been playing with Headstriker and i have venom grip gloves. So i am doing 100% DS and have 5%CB on my gloves, so i thought i am hitting DS 100% of the time which leaves no room for that CB to get a hit, but as i have been running Baal and Andariel i can clearly see once in awhile that red blob and a sudden large chunk of life taken when crushing blow hits? So what am i not understanding here.
As well how do both of these work with added element damage?
 

Gynli

Diabloii.Net Member
The post is fine from what I can see.

iirc...

1. Deadly Strike and Crushing Blow are independent; proccing one does not affect the other.

2. What you may have been thinking about is the Deadly Strike and Critical Strike (Amazon passive). These two are dependent of each other and are pretty much equivalent in terms of what they do. The chance from DS and CS are not additive though, because they roll separately. 30% DS and 50% CS does not = 80%, it actually = 65%.

3. I'm not sure if either DS and CS work with elemental damage. I've seen posts saying it does, but I also recall some saying it doesn't. Someone will come by and confirm of deny soon enuf. Or perhaps a quick search through the forum will net you some answers. EDIT: quick search on google/forum says it does NOT affect elemental damage.
 

Nesjan

Diabloii.Net Member
The post is fine from what I can see.
oh ok that makes sense, so i also have Goblin Toe boots i have not equipped because i thought the CB would be negated by the 100% deadly strike. So to clarify if i have headstriker, Venom Grip and Goblin Toes equipped i am doing 100% DS as well of a 25% chance to do CB?
iirc...

1. Deadly Strike and Crushing Blow are independent; proccing one does not affect the other.

2. What you may have been thinking about is the Deadly Strike and Critical Strike (Amazon passive). These two are dependent of each other and are pretty much equivalent in terms of what they do. The chance from DS and CS are not additive though, because they roll separately. 30% DS and 50% CS does not = 80%, it actually = 65%.

3. I'm not sure if either DS and CS work with elemental damage. I've seen posts saying it does, but I also recall some saying it doesn't. Someone will come by and confirm of deny soon enuf. Or perhaps a quick search through the forum will net you some answers. EDIT: quick search on google/forum says it does NOT affect elemental damage.
 

Nesjan

Diabloii.Net Member
The post is fine from what I can see.

iirc...

1. Deadly Strike and Crushing Blow are independent; proccing one does not affect the other.

2. What you may have been thinking about is the Deadly Strike and Critical Strike (Amazon passive). These two are dependent of each other and are pretty much equivalent in terms of what they do. The chance from DS and CS are not additive though, because they roll separately. 30% DS and 50% CS does not = 80%, it actually = 65%.

3. I'm not sure if either DS and CS work with elemental damage. I've seen posts saying it does, but I also recall some saying it doesn't. Someone will come by and confirm of deny soon enuf. Or perhaps a quick search through the forum will net you some answers. EDIT: quick search on google/forum says it does NOT affect elemental damage.
oh ok that makes sense, so i also have Goblin Toe boots i have not equipped because i thought the CB would be negated by the 100% deadly strike. So to clarify if i have headstriker, Venom Grip and Goblin Toes equipped i am doing 100% DS as well of a 25% chance to do CB?
 

JoeBruce

Diabloii.Net Member
I could have sworn there was a guide on this somewhere, but a search only revealed several threads with questions about these two abilities. Might be worth a look to search "crushing blow deadly strike" and read a few of those threads.

But the basic is that crushing blow and deadly strike (and critical strike) are separate. Crushing blow reduces an enemy's health by a certain fraction, deadly strike and critical strike increase your damage. There is a weird, non-additive formula to calculate how deadly and critical strikes work/combine together, but crushing blow is its own thing. They are all good abilities to have, especially crushing blow for taking down monsters with lots of life.

Yes your calculations sound correct. That is pretty solid for a melee character. One thread that I saw mentioned DS having "ignore target defense" - not sure if that is true, but that would be pretty amazing.
 

pharphis

Diabloii.Net Site Pal
The formula for critical strike and deadly strike isn't so weird. If we go with the 50% and 30% example, you consider that 50% of the time you will crit, and of the remaining 50%, you will crit 30% of the time. ie 15% of the time. Therefore you will crit 50% + 15% = 65% chance.
 

pharphis

Diabloii.Net Site Pal
Which comes from the inclusion-exclusion principle if anyone is wondering.

num(A_OR_B) = num(A) + num(B) - num(A_AND_B)

num can be number of events, or probability.
 

Kitteh

Diabloii.Net Site Pal
I found this too, if it helps at all;

Set Items and Unique Items sometimes have special magical effects that are not found on any Magic or Rare item. This is not a complete listing of all special effects.

Deadly Strike
This is a chance of doing double damage. This bonus is applied after skills such as Critical Strike and any other damage bonuses. Critical Strike (CS) and Deadly Strike (DS) exclude each other.

If you have a 33% Deadly Strike item, and 68% Critical Strike Skill the complete chance to get double damage is:

=CS + (DS/100)*(100-CS)
=68% + (33/100)*32%
=68% + 10.56%
=78.56%

It is possible to get up to 100% chance for Deadly Strike. Anything above 100% is discarded.

Open Wounds
This is a chance of making a monster bleed uncontrollably. They lose health while bleeding. Open Wounds Items stack in most cases.

Duration: 200 frames (that is 8 seconds).

The damage per frame seems to be the following (where Clvl is the attackers level, that is the player's level usually):

Clvl=1-15: (9*Clvl+31)/256
Clvl=16-30: (18*Clvl-104)/256
Clvl=31-45: (27*Clvl-374)/256
Clvl=46-60: (36*Clvl-779)/256
Clvl=61-99: (45*Clvl-1319)/256

If you prefer per second, just multiply by 25:

Clvl=1-15: 25*(9*Clvl+31)/256
Clvl=16-30: 25*(18*Clvl-104)/256
Clvl=31-45: 25*(27*Clvl-374)/256
Clvl=46-60: 25*(36*Clvl-779)/256
Clvl=61-99: 25*(45*Clvl-1319)/256

Some examples:

Clvl 10: 11.8 per sec over 8 seconds for a total of 94.5 damage. Clvl 30: 42.6 per sec over 8 seconds for a total of 340.6 damage. Clvl 50: 99.7 per sec over 8 seconds for a total of 797.7 damage. Clvl 70: 178.8 per sec over 8 seconds for a total of 1430.5 damage. Clvl 90: 266.7 per sec over 8 seconds for a total of 2133.6 damage.

Also, the damage is divided by 4 for a player target. In addition, for a missile versus a player target one should divide the damage by 8 instead.

Finally, versus bosses and champions (could be just bosses or special bosses) the damage is divided by 2.

It is possible to get up to 100% chance for Open Wounds. Anything above 100% is discarded.

Crushing Blow
This is a chance of reducing a monster's health by X% in a single blow.

-Default: 1/4th
-vs. Players: 1/10th
-vs. Hirelings: 1/10th
-vs. Champions, Uniques, Bosses: 1/8th
-with missile weapons, default: 1/8th
-with missile weapons, vs. Players: 1/20th
-with missile weapons, vs Hirelings: 1/20th
-with missile weapons, vs Champions, Uniques, Bosses: 1/16th

-The life removed is also scaled with number of players. So that if a monster has 450% more life due to 8 players (or whatever the value is) the life removed is further reduced by the same amount (450% would equal multiplying by 4.5 so the life removed by Crushing Blow is divided by 4.5).

* It is possible to get up to 100% chance for Crushing Blow. Anything above 100% is discarded.
* Physical resistance does apply to Crushing Blow damage, but only if the resistance is positive.
* Crushing Blow Items stack in most cases.
* Since 1.10 Crushing Blow is calculated before your normal damage. So, before doing the damage that you would normally do, there is a chance you will reduce the health of the monster by X% then normal damage apply to the resulting lower life. If you have more than one item with Crushing Blow, the probabilities will be added together. There will be one random check for a Crushing Blow. There is no check for each separate item, so one can not get multiple Crushing Blows in one attack.
 
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