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Darwinism or Intelligent Design

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by olie0923, Mar 28, 2005.

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  1. olie0923

    olie0923 Diabloii.Net Member

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  2. HAMC8112

    HAMC8112 Diabloii.Net Member

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    As long as i can choose wich school my kids go to them Godpeople can do as they like. I mean come on, Darwinism is not proven so tell them story's about an imaginary God. Come on...
     
  3. Freet

    Freet Diabloii.Net Member

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    Just as Darwins theory has not been proven, God has yet to be disproven and no matter how insulting one becomes on the subject, you have to admit that you really don't know for a fact one way or the other.

    One thing is for sure though, a society can never know the facts on any point unless all theories are studied. This includes this one.

    A person doesn't have to be religious to study religious beliefs so why is adding creationism to a class considered a violation of the separation of church and state laws?
     
  4. HAMC8112

    HAMC8112 Diabloii.Net Member

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    Indeed, it seems that no-one knows, but on the other hand, i do not really care. if it turns out that God does not exist, that's fine by me. If he does exists than let reckoning day commense, i've got some score's to settle with the man!
     
  5. UserMathias

    UserMathias Diabloii.Net Member

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    Evolution has a lot more going for it in terms of evidence than creationism does. It is backed up by the findings of biogeography, paleontology, embryology, morpholgy, and others. Creationism, meanwhile, is backed by... religion.

    From the point of view of science, the theory of evolution is classifiable as a law.

    Religious zealots' motto "it is a theory and not a fact" is such an outrageously obvious statement it makes my blood boil. That's the assumption we make when we say "scientific law". And just because your belief conflicts with science, doesn't mean the science is any less valid.
     
  6. DurfBarian

    DurfBarian Diabloii.Net Member

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    Evolution is a fact. Plain and simple. It's been observed by humans and proved to exist.

    The morons who argue that "it's just a theory" don't understand the scientific sense of the word "theory." These are not people I want in charge of the science curriculum.

    Note that none of those has any bearing whatsoever on whether God/Allah/YHWH/a giant alien being created planet Earth. What we can observe tells us that the most accurate explanation right now is the scientific theory of evolution . . . and the "scientists" who want to replace that with something along the lines of "yeah, well, it's really complex and maybe someone planned it this way" are not actually following the scientific process of observe-test-confirm.

    They aren't scientists. Keep them out of the science classroom. (Or, hey, don't . . . There are plenty of countries where they don't let narrow-minded interpretations of 2,000-year-old religious texts guide what will be taught to their kids as fact about the world. Let those countries take charge of the scientific realm. America can lead the world in . . . I dunno, lawsuits to keep braindead people alive.)
     
  7. DrunkCajun

    DrunkCajun Banned

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    AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! Not again!!!

    *runs screaming*
     
  8. rplusplus

    rplusplus Diabloii.Net Member

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    *Steps in the thread*

    In the beginning....



    R++
     
  9. Ace_wanderer

    Ace_wanderer Diabloii.Net Member

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    Precisely. They should be teaching kids more logical things. Maybe they could learn about god in Sunday school.
     
  10. Pier

    Pier Diabloii.Net Member

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    God does not excists by the principle of Ockhams's razor (see the movie 'Contact').

    Grr pIER
     
  11. AeroJonesy

    AeroJonesy Diabloii.Net Member

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    Isn't Occam's razor that you shouldn't make unnecessary assumptions?

    To me, it's a lot easier to assume a God created everything than that some combination of amino acids randomly formed and life was spawned, and continued to evolve for millions of years.

    Of course, anything I don't understand can be "easily" explained by saying it's invisible aliens controlling it.
     
  12. Moosashi

    Moosashi Diabloii.Net Member

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    Not only is evolution as solid a theory as gravity, "intelligent design" is even less scientific than its proponents would have you believe. It rests on one man's idea that there should be one more law of thermodynamics: conservation of information. In other words, the bytes in a system cannot increase spontaneously. He believes that DNA represents a violation of this (his) law because information is seemingly added to the genetic code as life diversifies- and who can break a law of thermodynamics but God? However, in his book, published by a Christian printer, he conveniently ignores the fact that Earth is not a closed system, so even if his law were valid, DNA does not evolve spontaneously.

    On the surface, his arguments are attractive because he couches them in the logic that things do not spontaneously gain complexity. This represents a misguided concept of molecular evolution, which is actually the degeneration of the genome through errors in DNA replication. So thermodynamically speaking, molecular evolution represents an increase in entropy as more and more mistakes accumulate.

    You all probably noticed that I have not named the author or his book. I will asap, but the paper I wrote on the subject is inaccessible to me at the moment. The man is a statistician, not an evolutionary biologist, and he publishes in journals issued by Christian printing companies. His is essentially the only modern technical work behind intelligent design - the rest consists of "oh it's so complex, God must have done it" type arguments, which Darwin addressed effectively in his book on orchids.
     
  13. Lord_Shinnok

    Lord_Shinnok Diabloii.Net Member

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    God told me he doesn't exist.
     
  14. P2blr

    P2blr Diabloii.Net Member

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    There's no problem with that, but it depends on where you add creationism. If added to a 'general religion' course(like I've got in my school) then there's no real problem because the course is taken optionally, meaning if they don't like what's being taught, get out. But when it's added to a more "main stream" (for lack of a better word) course, and a science one even, then there's the problem. Biology is one of those courses that there is no way to get that type of credit by taking another course. Social science you can get a billion different ways, but science you can get 3(physics, biology, chemistry).
    To me that's also like forcing a christianity on someone; remember when people did that? Called the crusades?
     
  15. Steel_Avatar

    Steel_Avatar Diabloii.Net Member

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    You are wrong by the virtue of your not understanding Occam's Razor.
     
  16. publius

    publius Diabloii.Net Member

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    A recent amusing contrast to Intelligent Design's "list of scientists who support Intelligent Design" is the National Center for Science Education's "Project Steve:"

    http://www.ncseweb.org/article.asp?category=18

    Basically, in response to all of the lists of scientists who doubt evolution circulating around, the NCSE decided to create a list of all the scientists who do support evolution, and who happen to be named "Steve". Currently, their list dwarfs all of the dissenter's lists.
     
  17. Akira

    Akira Member

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    At this point "easy" is going to get blurred into "easier for me to accept". Some people are going to say it's "easier" for amino acids to randomly combine to make life, others will say it was "easier" for an infinite being to have controlled the process the entire time.

    I don't know why people have to be so black and white on the issue, I wonder if there's anyone out there who belives God created life and gave it the ability to evolve at its own pace.
     
  18. llad12

    llad12 Diabloii.Net Member

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    I think those that do not believe in evolution need to take a course in geology and go whack on a few marine fossils from some 500 million year old limestone.

    Ordovician Trilobites
     
  19. Steel_Avatar

    Steel_Avatar Diabloii.Net Member

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    Don't forget, Ilad, God put those there to test us!

    Never mind that if radio-dating were wrong, we wouldn't have atomic bombs or nuclear powerplants.
     
  20. Freet

    Freet Diabloii.Net Member

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    Durf,
    I can truely understand that you have strong opinions on this matter and I accept that you could well be correct in your asertions. That was the point I was making, I don't know any more than anyone else in this discussion knows for a fact. The fact is, we are trying to get a handle on how we came to be based on limited evidence and no one is saying with 100% confidence that any of the theories is right.

    I was somewhat surprised by you calling people morons based solely on their religious beliefs. That really isn't Durf like, for lack of a better term.

    Wasn't this country founded on the freedom from religious persicution? Must all religious people be treated with less respect (as they often are here) than any other human?

    Please, at least be civil.
     
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