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Damage reduced by xx & Magic damage reduced by xx ifra

Discussion in 'Theorycrafting and Statistics' started by jimmah, Jun 24, 2005.

  1. jimmah

    jimmah IncGamers Member

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    Damage reduced by xx & Magic damage reduced by xx

    How does those 2 mods work really? I mean the one that e.g. is on The Gladiator's Bane.

    I tried search, but it won't work for some reason. =/
     
  2. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    a more detailed explanation in the ES sorc guide, but essentially, phys damage reduced by X and X% are different, as are absorbs.

    basically, damage is done to you in frames. if a monster swings at you and hits for 5 damage, that damage is removed from you in 1 frame.

    however, if you have 5 damage reduce, you take 0. if you have 20% damage reduce, you take 4.

    mdr affects the elemental damages in the same way, but is much more powerful because almost all of the most dangerous elemental damage is calculated by frame. if you take 10 damage over 10 frames, you take 100 damage. however, if you have 10 magic damage reduce, you take nothing.

    however, almost all elemental damage done to you by monsters carries phys damage, including poison, so it's impossible to be invulnerable to everything.

    absorb is better because it effectively works at double the listed value. if you have absorb 20, it will take 20 damage and return 20 life, thus being the equivalent of having 40 damage reduced by (if you have 10 life and 10% absorb, you will lose nothing for 1 damage. you lose 1 life for 2 damage, thus effecitvely being 20% more defense.)

    in summary, % damage reduce or absorb is better than reduced by X, except for specific damage reduced builds such as the ES sorc.
     
  3. helvete

    helvete IncGamers Member

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    This is incorrect. mdr have penalties to frame based skills, like 1/25 for firewall, 2/25 for diablo lightning, and so on, so you WILL take damage from those skills unless you have a lot of mdr. (and a good lvl ES will help).
     
  4. Stevebo

    Stevebo Banned

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    If i have a ring that has "Magic Absorb +3" does this basically work in exactly the same way to a ring that says "Magic damage reduced by 6"?
     
  5. helvete

    helvete IncGamers Member

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    No, it does not. Magic absorb is only magic damage, whilst magic damage reduced by xx is magic and elemental damage.

    Magic damage (in the absorb case) is teeth, bone spear, bone spirit, blessed hammer, magic arrow, berzerk, the berzerk synergy and the weapons that say they add magic damage

    Besides, even if net life loss while using absorb is less than your total life (or even gain life) the initial damage could still kill you. That's one major difference between reduce and absorb.
     
  6. Jerkazoid

    Jerkazoid IncGamers Member

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    also note where in the dmg order MDR(magic dmg reduction) and magic absorb come into effect.

    mdr comes early, before resistance, so increased resistance wont greaten its effect.

    however +X magic absorb comes AFTER resistance,,
    so IF u could have a decent amount of magic resistance the absorb would scale and become more effective. however u can only have a pathetic ~10% magic resistance via saftey shield crafts.
     
  7. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    helvete: i am undone by that ES sorc guide! well actually, i didn't believe it either (magic damage reduced by x affects elemental damage) but when i actually tried it, sure enough, i would take nothing from elemental damage when i used dwarf star and vipermagi.

    original poster: there is only one item with magic absorb in the game, crescent moon runeword items.
     
  8. acceleration turkey

    acceleration turkey IncGamers Member

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    oath also has magic absorb.
     
  9. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    i'm old. :(
     
  10. Jerkazoid

    Jerkazoid IncGamers Member

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    spirit rune word too.
     
  11. lCE

    lCE IncGamers Member

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    Its a straight numerical absorb though, and usually u wont notice any difference, maybe only in pvm when u get hit by OK's bonespirit or snakes' bonespears which do low damage unsynergized.
     
  12. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    actually, it works pretty good. i took 0 elemental damage using vipermagi and dwarf star with energy shield.

    imho, you've got to stack it. you can't expect X damage reduce (not x%) to block 100% of incoming damage. however, if you can cut down incoming damage (in the case of energy shield, down to like 25-20%, some people get it down to 5%) X damage reduce works pretty well.

    however, if you can't cut down incoming damage by 75%, by, for example, using phys damage reduce % (through say shaftstop/ss/shako/etc) then it's not worth it.

    the guy who wrote the ES guide used lvl 40 ES with prebuff, which hits the cap of 95% damage redirected to mana, and used around 20 pdr and mdr, and he said he was pretty much invulnerable to everything.
     
  13. lCE

    lCE IncGamers Member

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    With ES sure, because so little damage gets through it, however ur still vulnerable to mana burn monsters.
     
  14. helvete

    helvete IncGamers Member

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    Mana burn is bugged to burn 250 times as much mana as it's supposed to. (4x monster damage). So if a monster with 2-4 damage hits you with mana burn, you'll lose either 2000, 3000 or 4000 mana....

    The solution to this is to have really really fast mana regen, which is gained by an extremely large mana pool (as much as possible, I usually get by with "just" 1500 mana) and high bonus to mana regen (easily gained by having merc wear Insight polearm and having a point in warmth).

    Of course maxing warmth if you need the synergy.
     

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