D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

[VonMises]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

I also agree with the OP. I played LOD only because of all the new content and because my friends did. Classic was a better game soley because everyone had different gear and trading was thus more fun.

I doubt the D3 team will move in the "classic" direction, but I hope they do. They should also swap the names, rares <-> uniques, which would fit with their appropriate definitions.

Uniques, runewords, and sets could still have a function in D3, but I will certainly be upset if they dominante the economy.

 

[Inphi]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

.. maybe they can make "Uniques" really uniques, like only one Eye of the Oculus can exist within a realm.

now that would be nice and a great way to spicy up economy if every once in a while there be rumors of some new unique, once a month new uniques on the realms.. be a novelty just owning one..

anyways, its diablo so I'll probably like it like from the D1 to LoD, missed hellfire tho.

 

[the V]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

I don't mind uniques being powerful or viable at all. I just want rares to be able to compete and be better at the high end, so once you have the best unique for a slot, you still have room for improvement and something to look forward to finding/trading for. Always leaves room for improvement, you don't just cap your character off once you've got the best uniques/sets/runewords/whatever for each slot.

 

[NASE]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Some decent points, but weapons and armor are the main character defining slots, and in LOD, almost 100% of the time means rune word or unique. I wanna see rare weapons be on top more than anything, as they were in classic.

The problem once again are dupers. 50% of those uniques/runewords for the armor/weapon slots are made of duped runes.
Take out dupers and things are different. Don't forget this.



P.S. I don't get why everyone is being so difficult. things are quite easy. The average unique should be as good as the average rare. Where rares have a much larger deviation - making them the top end yet very rare - while the uniques should be trusty weapons that offer mods that can't be found on rares.
Same goes for crafts, where these add mods that can't be found on rares too.

That way, you can perfectly be original while you can still use trusty uniques if you want to.

 

[the V]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

The problem once again are dupers. 50% of those uniques/runewords for the armor/weapon slots are made of duped runes.
Take out dupers and things are different. Don't forget this.

Not sure what you mean here. Yeah, there'd be less of them, but that doesn't mean that they still wouldn't be the best items. That's what this is about.

 

[NASE]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Yet they won't be used by everybody and we will see many more variations in builds and more uniques/rare/magic or even set items for armour and weapon slot.

 

[Kalara]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Blizzard made a mistake in classifying Unique items as unique. Even without duping the game will be littered with "Uniques." It just isn't worth the effort to hand design a unique item that will only drop a handful of times (a waste of Blizzard developer time), far better to have luck, a random roll, produce truly unique items. It is the rares, each crappy vendor fodder and godly treasure alike, that are the true "uniques."

It is important to have fixed/semi fixed mods on named items to deepen the world lore and to have unusual effects and mods. This should be the role of our Unique items. Perhaps a more appropriate name for such items, as Kruger said in another thread, is Legendary. What better description and vehicle for lore is there then the the items of legend? Give them mods that can't be found in anything but the items hand crafted by blizzard. Give them both strategic advantages and cool effects. As someone mentioned, and I'm sorry i can't remember who to give credit, have a Legendary two hand sword named the Guillotine that decapitates on each kill shot.

Let these Legendary (i'll use this term instead of "Unique") items be top shelf, amazing items for the level they can be equipped. We don't need crappy Legendary items, let them all be good. However let the best of the best, in most situations, remain the purview of the Rares. Keep our crappy Rares but also keep the possibility for a higher damage on a Rare then on any Legendary weapon. If the special mods on Legendary items are well made we will have use of swapping out for those Legendarys in certain areas or when facing a particular mob. And then switch to the godly rares to mow down the following legions of hell.

This lets us have a use for the Legendary/Unique items and still search for that individual and truly "unique" Rare that had all the stars line up and against all odds produced a weapon/armor/shield/what-have-you to be the main item you use. We can still have the sheer joy of seeing a Rare drop and the anticipation of identifying it. Rares could spawn such a wide range of mods that most often you would find crap but just every once in a while you would be blown away.

 

[Akse]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Blizzard made a mistake in classifying Unique items as unique. Even without duping the game will be littered with "Uniques." It just isn't worth the effort to hand design a unique item that will only drop a handful of times (a waste of Blizzard developer time), far better to have luck, a random roll, produce truly unique items. It is the rares, each crappy vendor fodder and godly treasure alike, that are the true "uniques."

Well uniques were truly uniques in pre-LOD single player when they could not drop if one was in the game already or had dropped in one game already.

This worked out in battle.net too but not so efficiently since there was many games and many players, but anyways back then if there was someone with a SOJ in game or a SOJ had dropped in that game.. it could not drop again. I think this system was nice.

 

[Krugar]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

but anyways back then if there was someone with a SOJ in game or a SOJ had dropped in that game.. it could not drop again. I think this system was nice.

This is still the case. For drops that is. The same unique will not drop twice in the same game.

 

[Akse]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

This is still the case. For drops that is. The same unique will not drop twice in the same game.

heh oh yeah.. but when the games last so short time nowadays.. its a slim chance that any unique drops twice

 

[Kalara]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

And as for not having an item drop that anyone in the game has seems quite prohibitive to group play. I wouldn't want to see anyone telling a friend they aren't invited in a game because they got a lucky drop in the game before.

 

[Vang]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

LOL!
My definition? You are the one trying to establish a semantics context to Uniques. I'm not even in that league, my friend. I'm more concerned with how these items will be balanced towards the endgame.

If the best of the best rares can't compete with the best of the best Uniques, there's only one conclusion to be drawn. For some reason you don't want to draw that conclusion. And that is pretty awkward because you are now saying rares are better than Uniques, which kinda is not what you want to say. Is it?

I think your trying to say one over the other. Spear Class weapons for example, Rares win hands down. The elite unique versions are pathetic, compared to a nice Rare War Pike with 350+ED and 40%ias. Add in the possiblity of Ethereal and repair durability and it hands down wins.

Rares on weapons can be the best damage in the game. The problem is, its that rare. How many items have you found over 400%ED?

Certain items uniques win, almost all are armor is better due to the range of Mods, but depending on what you mean to accomplish, a unique might betotal garbage(a -damage character, magical circlet, tiara, or the other two win.)

 

[Dimmu]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Ok I don't know if this was brought up in this forum at all, I was to lazy to read it, however, maybe you don't know that much about LOD as you think you do. I say this because the truly godly players are not always looking for uniques, and runewords actually most the time they are not. Sets are nice for mediocre play, uniques can get you to a pretty high level of play, but honestly, godly players are looking for rare or crafted items, because they can be the best in the game. Rare belts=better than unique belts. Crafted belts=Definitely better than unique belts. Rare and crafted ammys are the same, and rings... and almost everything else. You might think uniques and runewords are all people look in for LOD but you have it wrong when it comes to being the best of the best. As a matter of fact, the best shield for a light sorc is a magical tower shield with 3 open sockets (faceted) and increase chance of blocking. Talk about a rare find, I've been playing for, well since the game came out and I have yet to find one. Helms are another thing that people look for non-uniques. Almost all of the best helms in the game for almost every class is a circlet. This is not to say that uniques and runewords cannot go on a godly build, because they can. However by blizzard creating LOD as an expansion I don't think that they created more cookie cutter builds, and concrete things to strive for, I believe that they created more variety at what can be done. A godly player will mix all of these things in their builds; rares, uniques, crafted, runewords, even magical. LOD truly did add more ways to personalize a character and if you think that uniques and runewords are the be all end all in LOD, you are wrong.

Okay , you're pretty much wrong on EVERYTHING, and if you think otherwise, I'll crush you pvp garaunteed.

1. Rare belts=better than unique belts. Crafted belts=Definitely better than unique belts. Rare and crafted ammys are the same, and rings... and almost everything else.
This is bull. Rare and (less so) crafted belts are only good in lld and mld. Nothing beats an arachnid mesh or for some builds a dungos. Show me a top tier char that actually uses a rare or crafted belt, please.

2. As a matter of fact, the best shield for a light sorc is a magical tower shield with 3 open sockets (faceted) and increase chance of blocking.
Spirit crushes a faceted jmod in every single way. 2 skills/55fhr/35fcr/resistances>>>>a meagre 40% more base damage and the absolutely worthless block. In reality, that deflection mod would bring your block chance from 8% to about 14% in hell difficulty unless you invested some serious points in dex which is totally pointless on any half decent sorc.

3. Helms are another thing that people look for non-uniques. Almost all of the best helms in the game for almost every class is a circlet.

Rare circlets (or pelts in the druid's case) are indeed the best of the best for most casters, but a CoA is neccesary for any decent barb or most melee chars. Once in a great while you'll find a crazy 2os eth-auto repair helm that meleers manage to get their hands on, but there are VERY few on any realm that can beat CoA.

So let's add this up. Casters use rare/sometimes crafted jewelry and helms, melee chars invariably use highlord's wrath for the massive DS, a ravenfrost because you need the CBF and it has a massive AR bonus and that leaves one slot for a rare ring. Once in a great while you'll come across a rare eth PB or zerker axe that beats runewords or an eth DC in melee but those are worth more than this entire forum commuty's accounts combined. Other than that, every char is reduced to uniques or..more so....rune words.

It's just really annoying when somebody argues as if they have any clue what they're talking about but clearly doesn't. /rant

Anyway, I think they should just make a much more expansive crafting system.

 

[Edairu]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

I don't mind uniques being powerful or viable at all. I just want rares to be able to compete and be better at the high end, so once you have the best unique for a slot, you still have room for improvement and something to look forward to finding/trading for. Always leaves room for improvement, you don't just cap your character off once you've got the best uniques/sets/runewords/whatever for each slot.

Completely agree, this is what I want in Diablo 3.

 

[Akse]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

I think your trying to say one over the other. Spear Class weapons for example, Rares win hands down. The elite unique versions are pathetic, compared to a nice Rare War Pike with 350+ED and 40%ias. Add in the possiblity of Ethereal and repair durability and it hands down wins.

Rares on weapons can be the best damage in the game. The problem is, its that rare. How many items have you found over 400%ED?

Certain items uniques win, almost all are armor is better due to the range of Mods, but depending on what you mean to accomplish, a unique might betotal garbage(a -damage character, magical circlet, tiara, or the other two win.)

wins in pure damage maybe, but runewords(I compare to runewords now because they are the top items) have huge damage and maybe 10 other mods which are rare ones like crushing blow, open wounds and deadly strike.. these can't be obtained in rare weapons.. and if you get crushing and stuff from weapon you can more freely choose your other gear.

 

[Vang]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

I specifically said Spear class. Your chance of finding a Zod to make a Breath of the Dying is probably not going to happen at all(again, if you play on battle.net then its different, due to hacking) So sure a Aroic's have DS, and The War Pike has some CB, but other than that, I'd take a max damage spear class weapon any day, even over an Eth Hone.

Other weapon classes get lucky and have a slew of RW's to actually choose from, so they get left out of the equation, because even for a single player guy, the runes are low enough they are easily obtainable, and hands down beat most item.

 

[Akse]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Findign zod is as probable as rare war pike with max dmg mod ethereal 40 ias and indestructible. Also i guess you need 2 sockets so you can put 2 shaels to get last breakpoint.. or is 80 ias even enough with war pikes?

There are some other cheaper runewords than botd available.. some are so much easier to get than rares.

 

[Firegrip]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Diablo 3 looks like it is taking the good parts of the games and leaving out the bad. D2 got boring fast considering there was no work involved in it. You made a new character and then begged your friend to rush him through the whole game in under 15 minutes, Then all you had to do was chaos games. That is THE definition of a grind. If you make a new character and can finish the game without killing a monster, That is sad. The only reason someone that loved D2 won't like D3 is because they can't cheat their way to a powerful character.
All you had to do was to teleport to where the items dropped, Kill the monster, then make a new game and try again.

 

[Akse]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Diablo 3 looks like it is taking the good parts of the games and leaving out the bad. D2 got boring fast considering there was no work involved in it. You made a new character and then begged your friend to rush him through the whole game in under 15 minutes, Then all you had to do was chaos games. That is THE definition of a grind. If you make a new character and can finish the game without killing a monster, That is sad. The only reason someone that loved D2 won't like D3 is because they can't cheat their way to a powerful character.
All you had to do was to teleport to where the items dropped, Kill the monster, then make a new game and try again.

Yeah its funny how many agree that the rush thing was boring. Then when in battle.net I ask people that get rushed that "why don't you play the game properly, without rush" .. the general answer is "its so boring to do the quests over and over again" then I ask "what? and running 1 damn area for 1000 times is not?"..

Its not like there are hundreds of quests in this game.. it is so damn short that I really enjoy playing the different areas through even when I've created more than 100 characters during 9 years.

 

[Ishtor]

Re: D2 Classic Players Won't Like D3

Hello, i would like to throw my 2 cents in. The asic idea about item rarity, is that each rarity is better than the last.

uncommon (blue) is better than the common (white)
rare (yellow) is better than the uncommon (blue)
unique (brown/gold) is better than the rare (yellow)

Set items and rune words were extras they included, and gave more choices of equipment. these Runes to make the better gear where hard to find and get, except the duping issue, which is why some of them were still so good. but this also brought use to the useless plain socketed items that would drop. now with d3 and runes not working toward the gear and weapons, this will mean set and unique items will be the top gear to get again.

Rares are good but they do not deserve to better than the unique drops. If you disagree with me, that your own opinion, but just becuase you can find a rare with alot of good mods, the mods a unique item deserve to be better.