Cow King v1.00 drops are truncated!

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
I don't think it is as easy as just the map seed, else we'd see the very same drop all the time. Something else must be in play, likely something similar to what affects racks in 1.07. I have JUST ran the cow king about 50 times today, and I assure you, similar items and stats, yes, but definitely not duplicates. I would have noticed, as a lot of my finds today were near-keepers but not quite there. All of them had some +life and some enhanced defense, but the other stats did vary, even from the same six item pattern.

I'll make some documentation from hell cow king for you, I'd LOVE to see a guide. I'd definitely link it in my general 1.00 guide.
 

Treeharl

Diabloii.Net Member
@helvete it seems to me however the stats of the items are fully random at this point. I haven't seen any truncation on the stats or names or collors of the items. Duplicate items do spawn on 1.00 although I never have seen them drop from monsters, if they drop it is always from objects (chests etc). It seems very simmilar to rack running indeed. I will definiatly write a guide but first things first. First I need to know aproximatly how many patterns the cow king drops on hell. I don't want to make the assumption that nm is exactly the same as hell. Afterwards I need to verify if duped drops do happen, I guess it doesn't or it does only marginally. So basically I have to gather data from atleast 100-200 hell cow runs before I start writing.

Is it possible though you make an excel file aswell like I did? I could use some more data on total patterns occuring at Hell difficulty. (I can also judge if you got a decent seed or a crappy one ^^)
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
COWKING.jpg 10 runs so far, have had different magic items drop each time, but the map is very good even if the seed seems to spawn a lot of different drops.

EDIT: I've also seen Gauntlets and Great Sword as the magic item, which I haven't seen before...

EDIT 2: Here are 50 runs, as much as I could before I had to mule.

EDIT 3: Out of 50 runs, 32 rare, 6 set and 12 unique drops. Pretty far off from ~16/16/16 which would be the expected value if each scenario has the same odds, but maybe not far enough to conclude anything.

Some definitely matching patterns, but from this I'd say 26 different magic items speak for themselves. Multiple patterns on Mace and Leather Armor, so I'd say there is an extremely high probability this seed had more patterns to offer.
 
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imakeigloospat

Diabloii.Net Member
Good luck with your further research! But please don't base your research on 50 or 100 cow king runs in NM or 50 identified rare items because I am 100% sure that this have happened to me multiple times. Perhaps you can discover why this really happens. I would love to help you out but I better not or I will probably start playing regularly again. :p

Also, I am pretty sure this has changed from 1.00 to the newer LOD patches so perhaps someone with a bit more reverse engineering experience (try the 'other' forum) can help you dig into the item generation code for rare items in these older patches. :)
 
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helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
It could be there are only around 65k possible rare items for a given seed, and cow king drops are further truncated, but not as bad as chests? I really have no technical insight, so some reverse engineering would have to be done by someone else.
 

Treeharl

Diabloii.Net Member
@helvete okay let me analyse your patterns... hmm it seems hell has more patterns. Also I think your mapseed could be alot better, I see only one pattern with an ornate and no martel patterns. If I where you I would reroll with that data. Thank you alot for posting though!

Still I have some questions.
1. How does your cowking map look?
2. Do youwalk always the same way or do you go the other way if you see big pack of cows (might change the seed!)

@imakeigloospat I only make 100-200 runs for a total number of patterns. I will make alot more runs when I finished the guide ofcourse and I might include a dupe paragraph.
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
1. Portal to tristram spawns directly north of WP, so close it appears on the minimap without approaching it. The Moo Moo Farm has its entrance around one and a half screen from the Cow King. However, another boss often (but not always) spawns close by, and it is cursed/cold enchanted/whatever which calls for extra care when it dies and curses me.

2. There's only one way out from where the portal spawns, which leads directly to the "fortress".

I don't really care about ornates or martels, as I have no immediate plans of playing other classic patches, with the exception of cubing amulets in 1.06b which doesn't require a leveled character. What I DO care about is getting a pike with 180+ max damage and decent durability. Mine breaks WAY too often to play comfortably. I also need some gear to make my goldfind barb in making better. He can handle NM well, but has too low life leech for hell, and could have way better items overall. Also some armor for my rush sorc, but that's a gambling problem.
 

Treeharl

Diabloii.Net Member
@helvete you say a bosspack sometimes does and sometimes doesn't spawn. I guess that means your mapseed is unstable and you have more patterns than you usually do. I guess you get nearly 30-40 patterns this way due to the unstable seed. On a stable seed a bosspack should always spawn 100% at the same spot! I guess you're doing double efford atm.

Also as offtopic question, why do you want gold% on 1.00 as monsters hardly drop any gold on 1.00. Goldfind gets usefull from 1.07 onwards. 1.00 is just get as much grimwands in the least amount of time.

I am kinda stuck at the flayer jungle atm at hell before reaching the Cow King, I always seem to forget how tough it is to get the Brain without getting cornered and then quickly escape out of my game and start all over aigain.
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
Champion packs drop around 10k each mob with my current setup, which makes for very quick farming if they're near waypoints. They're also much easier to find than stable containers which drop several high value items, I have found. Also, I like seeing vast gold drops as a personal preference =)
 

imakeigloospat

Diabloii.Net Member
Don't want to go too off topic either but gold find barbs are the way better solution to amass gold in 1.00.

The biggest reason is that you don't have the '/players' command and therefore the nodrop chance is to high to reliably finding staves, rods or wands (with decent staff mods) and the simple fact that gold drop don't increase with the amount of players in 1.00. Therefore you have the ability to gain maximum gold with a stable map seed with champions nearby both of the WP's in Act 4.

My gold find barb have 950% GF and if I remember correctly got up to a maximum of 24000 gold piles from each champion. :)
 

imakeigloospat

Diabloii.Net Member
It was in hell indeed. Due to how overpowered the barb is in 1.00 (or rather, how OP WW is..) one can kill champions in hell rather easily.

My level 96 barb is using the following gear when doing gold runs:

Tarnhelm
Skull Cap
Defense: 8
Durability: 56 of 90
Required Strength: 15
75% Extra Gold From Monsters
49% Better Chance of Getting Magic Item
+1 To All Skills

Wraith Talisman
Amulet
Required Level: 67
+14 to Strength
Cold Resist 29%
119% Extra Gold From Monsters
6% Mana Stolen Per Hit
+1 to Necromancer Skill Levels
+2 to Barbarian Skill Levels

The Patriarch
Great Sword
One-Hand Damage: 12 to 18
Two-Hand Damage: 25 to 42
Durability: 116 of 250
Required Strength: 100
Required Dexterity: 60
Damage Reduced by 3
Magic Damage Reduced by 3
Hit blinds target
100% Extra Gold From Monsters

The Patriarch
Great Sword
One-Hand Damage: 12 to 18
Two-Hand Damage: 25 to 42
Durability: 82 of 250
Required Strength: 100
Required Dexterity: 60
Damage Reduced by 3
Magic Damage Reduced by 3
Hit blinds target
100% Extra Gold From Monsters

Rattlecage
Gothic Plate
Defense: 179
Durability: 189 of 255
Required Strength: 70
Hit Causes Monster to Flee
+45 to Attack Rating
25% Chance of Crushing Blow
+45 Defense

Chance Guards
Chain Gloves
Defense: 23
Durability: 69 of 80
Required Strength: 25
200% Extra Gold From Monsters
24% Better Chance of Getting Magic Item
+25 to Attack Rating
+15 Defense
+2 to Light Radius

Storm Turn
Ring
Required Level: 4
Poison Resist 6%
59% Extra Gold From Monsters
6% Life Stolen Per Hit
7% Mana Stolen Per Hit
+7 to Mana

Demon Clasp
Sash
Defense: 2
Durability: 7 of 12
Required Level: 41
+1 Cold Damage Min
+1 Cold Damage Max
Cold Duration: 125 seconds
Lightning Resist 32%
+45 to Life
119% Extra Gold From Monsters
Fire Resist 22%
+42% to Defense

Bone Knot
Ring
Required Level: 4
6% Life Stolen Per Hit
+18 to Attack Rating
+1 to Mana
59% Extra Gold From Monsters

Carrion Greave
Boots
Defense: 2
Durability: 60 of 60
Required Level: 18
Fastest Run/Walk
Lightning Resist 31%
Fire Resist 41%
119% Extra Gold From Monsters
¨

Obviously the gear is all out gold find so the gear is very mediocre (but maximum GF) but yet is more than enough to slay champion packs in hell act 4 more than fast enough. 25% CB and decent leech is all that is needed. One could arguably replace the weapons with an ancient axe with lots of damage but I never found it necessary and rather valued the 200% the weapons brought. And a way to speed things up too is to find stable chests that drop superior harpoons as they sell for a lot and are reliable.
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
I love that gear! Quick question: Find Item sucks, right? Which is why you accept cold damage on items?
 

imakeigloospat

Diabloii.Net Member
Yes, find item is unfortunately really bad because you can only find non-magical items (and not gold for instance, so best is wooden superior weapons with staff mods). :( And the cold damage really helps out decreasing DPS on the champions as well as keeping them clumped up! Cold damage is only possible on belts if I remember correctly..? Or perhaps gloves and amulets as well.

The rings I use can be gambled at a very low clvl (don't remember, but you will probably find it in your own affix table in the guide). You can only carry 50k early game but if you have a TCP/IP game you can just drop 1.5 million gold on the ground and gamble rings with all three unique rings on the low level gambler. Getting dual leech and GF is not too hard, but getting 59% GF took some time.

I used Blinkbat's Form for more walk/run speed and lighter armor for even more speed but eventually liked the Rattlecage more. A big reason for this is that one of the most important aspect of this 'low damage weapon build' is that the champions you take on don't have many nearby monsters. If they are crowded with maggots or monsters in general your WW hits will be spread out and slow you down tremendously. The fleeing effect on Rattlecage helps preventing this somewhat if there are limited amounts of monsters, but of course the best way to prevent this altogether is to find isolated 4x champion packs. :)

Gold finding in 1.00 was rarely mentioned in the sparse discussions of this old patch, but I believe this has got to be the cheesiest way to obtain wealth in Diablo 2. Especially if one is into trading. We're literally talking farming many SoJ's per hour. I would usually get around 5 SoJ's an hour with my barb when I had this completed setup, but one could get many more if one were lucky with the gambling.

And of course, the big prize comes when you start investing in gambling rare rings and amulets in particular. And of course, if you have time to spend on gambling 'cheap' base items you can get rare items such as these that I have on my 1.13d blizzard sorc in classic. ;)

Beast Veil
Cap
Defense: 3
Durability: 10 of 12
Required Level: 41
Fingerprint: 0x27c94467
Item Level: 58
Version: Legacy (pre 1.08)
+20% Faster Hit Recovery
+11 to Dexterity
+97 to Life
Cold Resist +21%
Lightning Resist +43%
Fire Resist +26%
1 Sockets (1 used)
Socketed: Perfect Ruby

Perfect Ruby
Required Level: 18
Version: UNKNOWN
Weapons: Adds 15 - 20 Fire Damage
Armor: +38 to Life
Shields: Fire Resist +40%

Hailstone Jack
Quilted Armor
Defense: 8
Durability: 14 of 20
Required Level: 41
Required Strength: 12
Fingerprint: 0x1c4f6c72
Item Level: 58
Version: Legacy (pre 1.08)
+20% Faster Hit Recovery
+13 to Dexterity
+89 to Life
Cold Resist +25%
Lightning Resist +49%
Fire Resist +27%
1 Sockets (1 used)
Socketed: Perfect Ruby

Perfect Ruby
Required Level: 18
Version: UNKNOWN
Weapons: Adds 15 - 20 Fire Damage
Armor: +38 to Life
Shields: Fire Resist +40%

Raven Spur
Boots
Defense: 2
Durability: 12 of 12
Required Level: 1
Fingerprint: 0x44275c77
Item Level: 28
Version: Legacy (pre 1.08)
+30% Faster Run/Walk
+20% Faster Hit Recovery
+18 to Strength
Cold Resist +40%
Lightning Resist +43%
Fire Resist +31%
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
SICK!! Can you make me a screenshot of just the hovertext for me to use in my general guide? And maybe some goldfind items? I think those could push a chunk of people reluctant to time travel over the brink.

On topic:
I'm making the second excel sheet now, but it looks like NM is the better difficulty to run. Mainly because all of the best rare affixes are already available (except +2 skills on amulets ofc) and the seed seems more truncated. Rats. Hitting NM require concentration on my part, since I just about always work with hell. And I like to drink and play =(
 

imakeigloospat

Diabloii.Net Member
Would love to help. I will need to install Diablo 2 though but I will let you know when I have taken some pictures. I have a lot of really great items that I obtained from 1.00 in the 5+ years I played it almost exclusively as you can probably imagine. :)

On topic:
Good point about the rare affixes. Many are available very early in fact!
 

Treeharl

Diabloii.Net Member
Okay so I managed to reach hell Cow King finally! Did 10 runs sofar all 10 new patterns, no conclusions for me yet... Rather run normal instead of hell helvete, if you want decent rares with goldfind etc. Cow King normal drops ivll 31 which is enough for colossus on helms armors and belts(59 life) all 49 res on boots.
 

helvete

Diabloii.Net Member
Yeah, maybe even normal. That's something for a 1.00 Cow King miniguide; what affixes can and can't drop from normal and nm. Not being able to spawn certain affixes is a good thing. A little more hassle if you want to make gold by selling his drops, but that's probably not worth the time.
 

Treeharl

Diabloii.Net Member
Okay 50 runs done but it looks rather disapointing unfortuniatly. I got atleast 25 different patterns and if I add the questionmark patterns well over 30!.
Question mark patterns are patterns I am not sure I walked the correct way to the king or I died in the process so the seed might have changed for those.

The colors add a personal qualifiction of the quality of the pattern.
Green: Good to exelent pattern, would love to match those. (Good)
Orange: The first super item has a niche and should be picked up, but is most of the time useless. (Moderate
Purple: The first super item is nearly useless and could be picked up very situationally. (Bad)
Red: The first super item is an item which I don't want the unique version in my inventory. It is not worth pickiing up. (Terrible)

cow runs hell.jpg
 
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