Charged bolt aiming

GodObelisk

Diabloii.Net Member
Charged bolt aiming

I hv a pure light sorc with max lightning, chain lightning, charged bolt.
My issue is on charged bolt, I heard that c.bolt is a good boss killer. However I dun seem to be able to aim all my c.bolt at the single boss (ie. Diablo, Baal).

Am I spamming it the wrong way. I tele on the target and spam away c.bolt. I see that many of the bolts diverge out and not hitting the boss.
Can someone teach me the correct way to spam c.bolt inorder to optimize the dmg to a single boss.

-gobly
 

melianor

D3 Wizard Moderator
GodObelisk said:
I hv a pure light sorc with max lightning, chain lightning, charged bolt.
My issue is on charged bolt, I heard that c.bolt is a good boss killer. However I dun seem to be able to aim all my c.bolt at the single boss (ie. Diablo, Baal).

Am I spamming it the wrong way. I tele on the target and spam away c.bolt. I see that many of the bolts diverge out and not hitting the boss.
Can someone teach me the correct way to spam c.bolt inorder to optimize the dmg to a single boss.

-gobly
You are not doing anything wrong. Tele right up to the boss, as close as you can get and just spam away. The bolts will go through the boss and travel on. They always travel in the same pattern, diverging out and making a big nasty carpet of death.

Be assured that all bolt hit the boss, but since they will possible have high resistances, some of the damage that comes from each single bolt, will be subtracted, since the boss is not hit by the sum of the whole damage that all bolts do.
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
I always though straight lightning was the boss killer, not CB? Maybe its just safer to sit back with lightning?
 

melianor

D3 Wizard Moderator
MageChick said:
I always though straight lightning was the boss killer, not CB? Maybe its just safer to sit back with lightning?
Hm, i once made a Charged Boltress and to me it seemed useing Charged Bolt upclose was alot faster, maybe not safer. With Merc all bosses concentrate mostly on him and you can do whatever you want, just looking to stay alive with some pots.
 

GodObelisk

Diabloii.Net Member
Thanks for the assurance that my c.bolts are hitting. Just feel strange that despite boss right in front, c.bolts still goes through as if missing.

MageChick said:
I always though straight lightning was the boss killer, not CB? Maybe its just safer to sit back with lightning?
I read from "cant remember where" that c.bolt actually does more dmg than lightning. Someone actually wrote a guide with calculation on the dmg done by c.bolt & lightning.

I would prefer to lightning the boss if I din go max block. With max block the option is open.

-gobly
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
Does c bolt have a "next delay" counter on it chain lightning? i.e. if chain lightning targets monster 1, then spreads to monster2, then spreads back to monster1 again, monster 1 won't be damaged the 2nd time. I forget the count, but if you're damaged by chain lightning, you can't be damaged again for a set number of frames.

Assuming that this isn't the case a damage comparison should be simple. just count the number of charged bolts and mutiply by the base damage to get a damage per cast measure. Then for both CB and L take your damage per cast and get a casts per second for a given FCR%.
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
number time

sample build (same as I did in the infinity or not comparison)

20 charged bolt
20 nova
20 lightning
20 chain lightning
20 lightning mastery
standard prereq's and essentials
+17 skills
140% FCR

So that's:
slvl 37 charged bolt with 20 synergy points (at 6% each) and slvl 37 LM for 482%
vs.
slvl 37 lightning with 60 synergy points (at 8% each) as slvl 37 LM for 482%

I'm going to ignore the non-mastery % to damage and -enemy resistance for a second as its identical for both builds and it will mean I can do all the numbers on a skill calculator.

CB = Lightning Damage: 544-569 and 24 total bolts. Avg:556.5 * 24 = 13586
Lightning = Lightning Damage: 33-27139 and 1 bolt. Avg:13586

You can already see that CB > L. But lets factor in the FCR to get a damage per second comparison.

CB at 8 frames per attack = 41,737
L at 12 frames per attack = 28,304

so yeah, I guess if all 24 charged bolts do damage, then it is clearly the better way to go. And of course you only have to hit the 105% FCR rate, not 117% for this to be valid. I guess If I ever get around to building my light sorc then I'll have to keep CB mapped to a key as well.

*goes to find charged boltress guide in the library to see if this info was already there*

yep, it was...

Introduction

The Chargedboltress is a totally fun character to play and she’s also quite powerful. With 500 dam per bolt, 24 bolts per cast and three casts per second, this gives a potential for 35.000 dam per second – as long as your bolts hit.
That’s one of the main difficulties for this type of sorceress: you need to be rather close to monsters to make sure they really take this damage instead of the bolts just vanishing in the distance.
 

rata

Diabloii.Net Member
charge bolt is by far the easiest way to kill bosses, with my infinity scythe it takes less than 5 secs to kill one..there's no way lightning or chain can beat it.:grin:
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
Hmm Charged Bolt also synergizes pretty quick, only 1 synergy. This could combine pretty well with Frozen Orb I think. (yes, this was mentioned in the stickied charged boltress guide, but I must have ignored it the first time)

20 Charged Bolt
1 Static
1 Telekenesis
20 Lightning
1 Teleport
20 Lightning Mastery
1-20 Ice Bolt (can't finish until level 98, ouch)
1 Frost Nova
1 Ice Blast
1 Glacial Spike
1 Blizzard
20 FO
1 CM
1 Warmth
109 total skills to complete. What the heck, why not add in 1 point in to frozen Armor just to get to level 99.

My usual tal set + spirit + magefists + 2x SOJ's + war trav's will get me +14 skills and +2 more on each mastery. I may have to add this in to the meteorb/blizzballer/FO&CL comparison I did a while ago. I like this better than FO&CL.

That's 35k damage per second from CB (not counting the -15% enenmy resistance from tal orb). This would also be about 1.5k per shard on your forzen orb (counting CM at -100%, and +15% from tal orb). You'd still have lightning as a ranged spell too (about 5k per attack average)
 

GodObelisk

Diabloii.Net Member
Ur comparison really motivates me on my light sorc. I will test again tonite with both CB & L.

For CB/FO build. U only hv 35K provided ur max LM as well. w/o LM it wont be 35K
 

melianor

D3 Wizard Moderator
105-200 FCR Charged Boltress would be awesome. I think i will try this CB/FO build. I hate using Chain Lightning. Though 200FCR only without Infinity which is not that good anymore then. The pure Lightning build i once made way back practically only used Charged Bolt and Lightning. Also my Archmage builds all use Charged Bolt over Lightning or Chain Lightning, since Charged Bolt is so easy to synergize.

Charged Bolt is not only good for bosses, but for large groups too, though you will have to place yourself and Merc accordingly.

If there was a delay or a reset, that when one bolt would hit and then the rest would not, nobody would have used it yet for bosses. Just my logic, but the damage from just one charged bolt would be pathetic, or do i understand you wrong with your analysis?
 

smeer

Diabloii.Net Member
melianor said:
105-200 FCR Charged Boltress would be awesome. I think i will try this CB/FO build. I hate using Chain Lightning. Though 200FCR only without Infinity which is not that good anymore then. The pure Lightning build i once made way back practically only used Charged Bolt and Lightning. Also my Archmage builds all use Charged Bolt over Lightning or Chain Lightning, since Charged Bolt is so easy to synergize.

Charged Bolt is not only good for bosses, but for large groups too, though you will have to place yourself and Merc accordingly.

If there was a delay or a reset, that when one bolt would hit and then the rest would not, nobody would have used it yet for bosses. Just my logic, but the damage from just one charged bolt would be pathetic, or do i understand you wrong with your analysis?
Is CB really so powerfull? The damage seems so low to me. At lvl 20 it only does 13-15 lightning damage (per bolt) and even if you have lvl 20 Lightning the bolts will do 2,2*13-2,2*15 or 28-33
Now that seems awfull low to me...even if you've got +15 lightning dmg and -105 lightning resistance from Griffon's Eye and Infinity (on merc)
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
yeah, I thought so too, but you are missing something. (actually a few things. don't feel bad, I missed them too)

Lvl 20 CB = 13-15 dmg per bolt.
+ 14 skills (a fairly moderate build) = 36-38 dmg per bolt
+ 20 synergy points (120%) = 80-84 dmg per bolt
+ 20 lightning mastery -> +14 all skills + 2 LM from tal orb -> slvl 36 LM -> 470% = 457-482 dmg per bolt
24 bolts bolts per cast = 10968 - 11568 damage per cast
25 frames per second / 8 frames per cast (at 105% FCR) ~ 35,000 damage per second.

That's a little better than your average meterob fireball and this does not include extra damage from griffons or eschuta and it does not account for -enemy resistance either.
 

melianor

D3 Wizard Moderator
MageChick said:
yeah, I thought so too, but you are missing something. (actually a few things. don't feel bad, I missed them too)

Lvl 20 CB = 13-15 dmg per bolt.
+ 14 skills (a fairly moderate build) = 36-38 dmg per bolt
+ 20 synergy points (120%) = 80-84 dmg per bolt
+ 20 lightning mastery -> +14 all skills + 2 LM from tal orb -> slvl 36 LM -> 470% = 457-482 dmg per bolt
24 bolts bolts per cast = 10968 - 11568 damage per cast
25 frames per second / 8 frames per cast (at 105% FCR) ~ 35,000 damage per second.

That's a little better than your average meterob fireball and this does not include extra damage from griffons or eschuta and it does not account for -enemy resistance either.
Wanted to say the same thing, but got drawn away from my post. CB is raw power and you can cultivate that skill from the start. Combining it with FO is a damn great idea.

I will try a variant of your build suggestion MageChick and replace FO with Iceblast and BLizzard :) Also will look for 3 Lightning Facets to put in Helmet, Orb and Armor.
 

smeer

Diabloii.Net Member
MageChick said:
yeah, I thought so too, but you are missing something. (actually a few things. don't feel bad, I missed them too)

Lvl 20 CB = 13-15 dmg per bolt.
+ 14 skills (a fairly moderate build) = 36-38 dmg per bolt
+ 20 synergy points (120%) = 80-84 dmg per bolt
+ 20 lightning mastery -> +14 all skills + 2 LM from tal orb -> slvl 36 LM -> 470% = 457-482 dmg per bolt
24 bolts bolts per cast = 10968 - 11568 damage per cast
25 frames per second / 8 frames per cast (at 105% FCR) ~ 35,000 damage per second.

That's a little better than your average meterob fireball and this does not include extra damage from griffons or eschuta and it does not account for -enemy resistance either.
Hmmm yes I can see the picture here...One question though isnt it 117 fcr for lightning or is CB an exception?
 

MageChick

Diabloii.Net Member
yeah, you've still got about 40 skill points to use, so that should give you a decent attack somewhere. Blizzard/IB should work too.

First look at a skill calculator says thats about a 3k blizzard (+14 all skills, tal build) not counting the extra 15% from tal orb or any -enemy resistance. If you stick to 1 pt in CM it will take until lvl 95 to finish. Would you still use an infinity merc? That could help you keep your CM to only 1 point.

@smeer: 117% is only for Lightning and Chain Lightning (and inferno) - all other lightning spells are at normal break points.
 

melianor

D3 Wizard Moderator
MageChick said:
yeah, you've still got about 40 skill points to use, so that should give you a decent attack somewhere. Blizzard/IB should work too.

First look at a skill calculator says thats about a 3k blizzard (+14 all skills, tal build) not counting the extra 15% from tal orb or any -enemy resistance. If you stick to 1 pt in CM it will take until lvl 95 to finish. Would you still use an infinity merc? That could help you keep your CM to only 1 point.

@smeer: 117% is only for Lightning and Chain Lightning (and inferno) - all other lightning spells are at normal break points.
I don't have an Infinity. But from my experience with Archmage builds 1pt CM with +skills, even if i don't get to the slvl17 point is good enough. Also +14skills +2 CM from Orb = slvl16, so i am close :D. I won't go til lvl95 though. Mainly i looking for something new that i have not played yet and can afford. Otherwise i would get Infinity and play a pure Lightsorc.

I confirm the FCR BPs for Lightning tree. The higher ones are only for L and CL.
 

smeer

Diabloii.Net Member
MageChick said:
+ 14 skills (a fairly moderate build) = 36-38 dmg per bolt
I thought the damage of lvl 34 CB would be 27-29, or maybe 28-30 (if there is another "extra hop" after lvl 32 like there is after lvl 16).

How do you calculate 36-38?

Maybe we should create a new thread with a poll:
Whats the best skill for a lightning sorc for killing both bosses and groups:
CB, Lightning, CL or Nova?

edit:
AFAIK a monster can't be hit twice (or more in a short time). I believe it's called next frame delay. If this is true then how come people say a boss is hit multiple times by CB. The same thing counts for groups. If it's true monsters cant be hit twice (or more in a short period of time), then 35k lightning damage isn't as impressive as it seems...
 
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