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BvC strength question

Discussion in 'Barbarian' started by Mr Pato, Oct 17, 2006.

  1. Mr Pato

    Mr Pato IncGamers Member

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    BvC strength question

    I'm sure this question comes up too much, but I can't figure out how much base strength BvC needs. I'm getting 89 with fort, grief and doom, widow on switch, CoA, dracs, and OW belt for use against BvBs, but that seems high. And I seem to remember seeing something like 63 a lot. Please post how much base strength is needed and the gear set-up for which it is required. And also the gear set-up vs BvBs, because mine is probably wrong.
     
  2. Bigru

    Bigru IncGamers Member

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    well if your gonna use grief/doom combo with fort and coa, assuming you use draculs your still gonna need alot of life if im not wrong.

    potentially you could be using this setup no?

    coa ber ber
    highlords
    2x raven
    forti
    dungoes
    gores
    draculs (assume 15 str)
    20 stat anni
    20 stat torch

    174 str for coa, so 119 base str, which is awfully high, but if you want to use this setup at one time thats what ya need. ofc if you use arreats with fort then this is different.

    in which case your highest str req would be 138 (grief)
    138-75 =63 str.

    or maybe coa with enigma and dual doomsetc. which depends on your level, lets assume 92 (which will be my aim)

    92 gives 69 str from enigma, and asumming at some time you wont be using draculs, rather trangs for fcr you will get a total of 109 to str, which with our old 63 str gives 172 str, so you could press for 2-3 more levels so 63 str is all you need, which i think this is where it comes from.

    allthough im fairly knew to bvc's, so proove me wrong :).

    cheers

    bigru

    EDIT: just saw you used OW belt, so it would depend on the +str on that, +30 i beleive is max? in which case 89 is the best if you want grief/doom/fort/coa setup

    EDIT2: just wondering about your BvB setup, why doom? as far as i can see, that would only increase that amount of time your wws will be in contact with each other, and the main way of you beating a BvB is through ow and chipping away at them with widowmaker? allthough it would slow their run speed i suppose. I would personally either use storm/botd or grief/beast(solving your str problems), with the storm/botd route i would use arreats, dual 20 dex ravens, and possibly 40 ed 9 dex jewel in the ss, giving you pretty decent block id say. i would think with that setup you could get into 65-70 block with arround 70-80 base dex.
     
  3. Ce Olba

    Ce Olba Banned

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    Now, that will result in CRAPPY AR. As the only time a BvC uses Fortitude is versus smiters, some windies and hammerdins. Some people like to use Fortitude versus V/Ts too. And versus Smiters and Hammerdins, you NEED AR, either from Angelics or Hsarus.

    The highest STR and dex Setup a BvC will ever need will be like this:

    STR: CoA + Fortitude + Grief + Beast + Draculs + TGod's. Needs 118 - draculs - torch - anni. With perfect +stats on each, it's exactly 63 base STR.
    Dex: 117 - torch - anni - 20. With perfect +stats, 57. Why? It allows:
    arreat + any rings + widowmaker
    1 raven + any helm + widowmaker

    Which is all you will ever need.

    As for stuff like max block. Max block is a waste. Also, having enough STR to use Grief + Doom + Fortitude + CoA is a waste. If you insist on using this, go with a +30 str belt, resulting at 89 base STR. However, this setup is NEVER needed. If you want to use CoA + Doom versus smiters, use Enigma.

    A BvC should never duel versus BvBs. But if you insist, make a BvA or use stuff like:

    CoA
    Enigma
    fcr rings
    Draculs
    ow belt
    highlord's
    widowmaker
    grief+beast
    goreriders

    Target is to maintain high OW, decent FCR, teleport and high DR. Why? OW is the only way you will ever win. WW vs WW, you will ALWAYS lose, no matter what. So you have to use Widowmaker + OW. As for using Fortitude, that's foolish, as it forces you to play WW vs WW against of them. Fortitude and Widowmaker are only used versus some windies (some people like this) and hammerdins. As for FCR, it's for running away. And teleport is the way you will run away. High DR is to make sure you can take a couple of hits.
     
  4. matchuk

    matchuk IncGamers Member

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    im starting to wish i didnt build so vit base now, fort would do wonders vs gg smiters, but i dont think i really need fort yet vs dins i seem to do so well vs em with a hsarus setup
     
  5. mainaman

    mainaman IncGamers Member

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    You can kill hammerdins and most smiters with highlords and ravens equiped . no need of angelics or hsarus especially against hammerdins. Spirit hammerdins usually have 10-11k def , and hoz hammerdins have ~14 defence, these defences are hitable with 9-10k ar easily.
     
  6. matchuk

    matchuk IncGamers Member

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    well i still have ravens and highlords on to equip widow, my normal pub belt is arach and boots gores, so i want to be sure the times i desync and hit him while his desyncing i actually land so i just wear hsarus just in case for ar :p
     
  7. moonlike

    moonlike Banned

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    hsarus is just sexy for vita barbs!!!!

    10k def vs 10k ar is 50%cth for me its not easy hitable.
     
  8. Ce Olba

    Ce Olba Banned

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    50% Chance to Hit not counting any Blocking. With Blocking it's 12.5%s, which is BAD.

    Also, what kind of a smiter or a hammerdin has only 10k defense? Hammerdins should have more like 15-20k, smiter 20-50k. Now, 10k AR versus 20k defense at the same level with 75% blocking gives you 8.4% chance to hit. Now is that nice? Or how about 10k AR versus 29k defense? 6.4% chance to hit. Now now, that's quite bad, cripples your effective damage from 8.5% to 5.4%s. Now, is that "cool"?
     
  9. mainaman

    mainaman IncGamers Member

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    spirit hammerdin , the only legit and cheap way to go for 125 fcr, have about 11k def. i have one of those and i have asked many ppl that went the spirit way and they all are in the 11k def range.
    i also had 75 fcr hoz hammerdin before i rebuilt, and he had ~17k def.

    when i duel hammerdins i use highlords+ravens with fortitude or enigma depending on their style , if they desynch their block goes down as many of us here know then with 10k ar you hit them easy, add dmg from fortitude for example and it is 3 hit kill most of the time.
    hsarus is not needed to duel hammerdins . it is good against smiters but you lose some run speed which might be actually helpful. for the high def ones angelics +50 dr is perfectly sufficient
     
  10. Mr Pato

    Mr Pato IncGamers Member

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    thanks guys
    great info
     
  11. dmngd

    dmngd IncGamers Member

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    I've found that using eni versus smiters is better than forti because the frw helps a lot when they use holy freeze.
     
  12. SicHalo

    SicHalo IncGamers Member

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    i dissagree with this i would rather use an arch or special belt and either have max dr or have 20% fcr from arch and be able to use the dracs instead of trang, as OW is good but in pub not the best solution.

    Using 2 fcr rings means u will have crap AR when it comes to ww a 30k defence max block bvb.


    if u want to beat smiters quick forti does the job if they are good with namelocking tele-smite then more frw is needed especially with the ones that flash HF.



     
  13. Ce Olba

    Ce Olba Banned

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    Did you not notice that I was talking about trying to duel BvBs? Not publics. As for the BB, it's not nice to recommend realm-specific stuff, specially since we know it's europe-only. And you will spend most of your time running when dueling a BvB anyways.

    Well, you are not gonna duel too many BvBs anyways WW vs WW, or are you? Good luck trying.

    Fact.



     
  14. SicHalo

    SicHalo IncGamers Member

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    well bb or normal dr belt (verdungos)

    But this is also the reason why I have not lost to pub bvb in a long time.


    And no i usually target a whirl sometimes when they run but its still benificial to have an ar setup incase its a whirlwind confrontation, obviously u don't try and match a bvb whirl for whirl like a standard bvb fight, but there could be times where u hit the barb in 2 full passes of whirls then tele off and ga again.
     

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