Bring back potions & potion belt

[mjkittredge]

Bring back potions & potion belt

Out of all the things I've seen and read about Diablo 3, this has me the most worried of all.

Instead of the belt slots and potions that we're used to from Diablo 1 and Diablo 2, now we've got some red orbs on the ground, randomly dropped from monsters, that you walk over to restore your health.

Whose brainchild was this?

Firstly, the potion in the belt system works. Whether it was a big row like D1 or a 4 by 4 grid in D2 where they dropped down, I think overall people liked the setup. I know I did. Sure, it could use some tweaking, having to constantly pick up dropped potions after every minor skirmish was a bit tedious. Maybe a system like the innovative and brilliant one in Hellgate: London with gold drops on the ground, you walk near the gold and it automatically gets collected, sparing the player thousands upon thousands of clicks. Have that for dropped potions.

The proposed random health orb thing with D3 just doesn't sound right to me. The whole system of HP and monster damage and traps has to be built around this new gimmick. What will be the frequency? When will they drop? If one just doesn't, do you simply die? How much HP do they restore, and how quickly? Will it make things too easy, or too hard? I know, in the previous Diablos, the games were still very challenging even with a full stock of potions. Even the World of Warcraft mechanic of a potion cooldown period seems better than the random health orb idea.

Blizzard, as much as I love and trust them, is messing with a proven mechanic. They are experimenting, reinventing the wheel. From the videos, it looks like you have to play very defensively, running around a lot, avoiding and playing keep-away. No more standing toe to toe and duking it out with enemies, chugging potions.

What do other people think about this?

 

[knightmawko]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

I like it personally, the potions really slowed the action down if you're belt was small or if you were loaded with health and needed mana, I think they could do this rather well if they made mana regeneration quicker and more constant, also make health regen fastish, not like uber fast but to the point where you can run from one really strong enemy for a little bit and while you are running your health goes up.

 

[GoldenBird]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

That's the point.

They don't want Diablo 3 to be a jump in click fest like D2 became for the overpowered builds... it was all click click click chug chug chug click click click chug chug chug. You can just jump into a battle and keep saving yourself easily by chugging potions.

D3 is going to be a game of strategy somewhat, not just jumping into a group of monsters and spamming one spell or attack.

And don't worry, they're gonna balance it all out this time.

 

[mjkittredge]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

GoldenBird - don't you remember your first character in Hell difficulty, getting rocked even in act 1? Potions barely saved you, if at all. And against powerful unique monsters or a champion pack - forget it! The potions wouldn't regen fast enough. Turning a corner in the monastery barracks and getting barraged with arrows, a bunch of spearwomen in the dark woods running faster than a frenzy barb right at you. Potions might barely save you, if you were fast enough.

Saving yourself easily with potions? A lot of times no.

Town Portal in the middle of battle, especially a boss battle and the boss not regaining health, that seemed a bit much, but not potions.

I hope you're right about Blizz balancing it out. As long as the game is addictive fun, which it looks like it will be, I suppose I could get used to random health orbs. Just seems wacky and unecessary.

 

[bmj]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

The orbs instead of potions is a great change. It's effectively the same system we have now, just with less clicks, less wasted screen space, and less wasted inventory.

Why run around grabbing potions to stick on your belt, then clicking on them to heal, when you can just grab the orbs? Just pretend they're potions that get used automatically.

They're adding autopickup for gold already, and likely removing generic keys. A big theme of Diablo 3 appears to be streamlining, and removing all the little irritants from D2. More game play with less irritation seems good to me.

 

[korialstraz]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

Saving yourself easily with potions? A lot of times no.

I could easily collect a 4x4 belt worth of full juvs and more in inven/stash. If that doesn't save you then you're not a very good player :whistling:

 

[kavlor]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

I think its been established by Blizzard and people who have played the Demo that Health orbs do work.Health orbs aren't actually a new thing anyway Ive used them in games like Ultimate Alliance (and earlier titles on the N-gage)and didn't find it an Issue.

 

[bhugy]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

As goldenbird said, the devs are going to balance the heck out of health orbs. With them being a new concept to Diablo games, there's no way they would introduce them without making ABSOLUTELY SURE that they worked as well as or better than potions did.

Personally, I like the idea of health and mana globes. They accomplish the devs' intention to speed up and intensify gameplay.
Additionally, they free up the number keys, and I am entirely in favor of using the number keys to quick-cast spells. You'll be able to bust out a bunch of different skills in the thick of battle, rather than using the same spell over and over and over. This, in my mind, is a huge step toward making combat more strategy-based rather than spam-based.

I could see how situations could arise with the globe system where a player desperately needs health and there are no globes present. Assuming the player has no potions on hand, since potions are now apparently meant to be an emergency source of health, this would force the player to adjust their strategy mid-battle (which I see as a good thing). Instead of simply hacking into the thick of another zombie horde, a barb needing health would have to strafe the mob, picking off one zombie at a time until a globe dropped. Then they would have to leap to the globe, or clear a path in some way. Then they could commence eviscerating everything that moves. Overall, I see the globes as a way to encourage both more intense play and smarter play.

Regarding the whole "reinventing the wheel" thing, modern rubber tires are a far cry from the big stone circles of caveman days, and I think tires work pretty gosh darn well.

 

[mjkittredge]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

I don't know what control scheme you've set up for Diablo 2 Bhuggy that only has you spamming one spell over and over again. I've got it so that my skills are on the F1 through F12 keys, also on the number keys 5, 6, and 7. The potions are keys 1 2 3 4. I've got my left pinky on the number 1 button for health potions, the other fingers over the F1 - F4 buttons. I'm able to switch between multiple skills quickly and easily.

Now, with Diablo 3, I'll have to use the mousewheel to switch skills? Ugh, no thanks. I hope I'll be able to set them up the way I'm used to.

And do they have to abandon the potion system? Can the globes not work in conjunction with potions?

Well, the game could be a year away from release. Blizz has a lot of time to rethink things, redesign systems, it's not set in stone. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

[Farmrush]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

I don't know what control scheme you've set up for Diablo 2 Bhuggy that only has you spamming one spell over and over again. I've got it so that my skills are on the F1 through F12 keys, also on the number keys 5, 6, and 7. The potions are keys 1 2 3 4. I've got my left pinky on the number 1 button for health potions, the other fingers over the F1 - F4 buttons. I'm able to switch between multiple skills quickly and easily.

Now, with Diablo 3, I'll have to use the mousewheel to switch skills? Ugh, no thanks. I hope I'll be able to set them up the way I'm used to.

And do they have to abandon the potion system? Can the globes not work in conjunction with potions?

Well, the game could be a year away from release. Blizz has a lot of time to rethink things, redesign systems, it's not set in stone. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

You can use the number keys to hotbar skills in Diablo 3. This was demonstrated. Presumably you can change this to your preference as well. I personally like the mousewheel to be involved because I find it very quick and easy.

They do have potions in D3. They've stated this, but said that they would take a much lesser role than in D2.

They think the system was broken, and so do a lot of players. I'd much rather have interesting strategic combat that is based on timing my spells than hoping I could hit my [1] key before I ran out of health. I think at this point the health orb system is fairly set. Not completely, but the cement is drying pretty fast and I can't imagine them changing it now.

 

[mjkittredge]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

I think the part of potions that was broken was that they didn't have a universal potion button for each type, like in Sacred 2. In that game, you hit one button for health potions, and it uses them from your stacks in inventory, no collapsing belt slots. Theres one separate button for each type.

Most diablo players I know stick to health, rejuve and mana potions in the belt slot, so the useful stamina, thawing and antidote potions get neglected - who wants to give up a belt slot for them? Opening the inventory to click on them manually is a nuisance.

 

[Grug]

Re: Bring back potions & potion belt

As goldenbird said, the devs are going to balance the heck out of health orbs. With them being a new concept to Diablo games, there's no way they would introduce them without making ABSOLUTELY SURE that they worked as well as or better than potions did.

Personally, I like the idea of health and mana globes. They accomplish the devs' intention to speed up and intensify gameplay.
Additionally, they free up the number keys, and I am entirely in favor of using the number keys to quick-cast spells. You'll be able to bust out a bunch of different skills in the thick of battle, rather than using the same spell over and over and over. This, in my mind, is a huge step toward making combat more strategy-based rather than spam-based.

I could see how situations could arise with the globe system where a player desperately needs health and there are no globes present. Assuming the player has no potions on hand, since potions are now apparently meant to be an emergency source of health, this would force the player to adjust their strategy mid-battle (which I see as a good thing). Instead of simply hacking into the thick of another zombie horde, a barb needing health would have to strafe the mob, picking off one zombie at a time until a globe dropped. Then they would have to leap to the globe, or clear a path in some way. Then they could commence eviscerating everything that moves. Overall, I see the globes as a way to encourage both more intense play and smarter play.

Regarding the whole "reinventing the wheel" thing, modern rubber tires are a far cry from the big stone circles of caveman days, and I think tires work pretty gosh darn well.

Dude, you and I are one of the few people that use the correct term Globes. I thank you for that.

Globes are good. It encourages fighting. If you're a Barbarian in the thick of it, an enemy will drop a globe next you you. If you're a wizard hanging out in the back, you'll be far from globes but you hopefully won't need them as much.

OP, all those things you ask can be easily determined through playtesting. Plus we know a few things about them now.
-Globes can be seen by everyone and will affect everyone in the party when grabbed. Skills and items can adjust the percentage healed, as well as drop frequency.
-Minions might drop globes on death. Bosses will usually have summoned minions to drop globe, but Critical Hits on the boss also have a chance to produce a Globe.
-Potions are meant for emergency. They will be rarer.

In summary: No.