Break Points and Formula's

Doppel

Banned
If i understand correctly these are the breakpoints of a bearsorc with a phaseblade:

Standard Attack Breakpoints
Frames----% WIAS
13---------0 %
12---------4 %
11---------13 %
10---------15 %
9----------24 %
8----------37 %
7----------52 %
6----------65 %
5----------93 %
4----------121 %
3----------204 %
2----------271 %
1----------537 %


So a phaseblade with 5 ias jewels (75 ias) and a shael (20 ias) with a total number of 95 ias is good enough to attack at 5 fps (and a phaseblade with 6 shaels or 120 ias also attacks at 5 fps wich seems to be correct when i test it because i can't see a difference between a 95 ias and a 120 ias phaseblade when using it as a bearsorc)
 

BASHFUL BABA

Diabloii.Net Member
If i understand correctly these are the breakpoints of a bearsorc with a phaseblade:

Standard Attack Breakpoints
Frames----% WIAS
13---------0 %
12---------4 %
11---------13 %
10---------15 %
9----------24 %
8----------37 %
7----------52 %
6----------65 %
5----------93 %
4----------121 %
3----------204 %
2----------271 %
1----------537 %


So a phaseblade with 5 ias jewels (75 ias) and a shael (20 ias) with a total number of 95 ias is good enough to attack at 5 fps (and a phaseblade with 6 shaels or 120 ias also attacks at 5 fps wich seems to be correct when i test it because i can't see a difference between a 95 ias and a 120 ias phaseblade when using it as a bearsorc)
If I equip IAS items other than the ones socketed in phase, it will count? Like 20 ias gloves, nosferatu's coil, a highlord's/cat's eye, etc.


 

sirpoopsalot

Diabloii.Net Member
Since I looked up the next delay breakpoints up not that long ago, and since they're not in this thread yet:

*most of the content is copied from the Assasin forum FAQ, edited for sorcs and clarity.*
*sorceress spells are highlighted*



NextDelay is a property that activates a hidden "hit timer" that limits how often any attack from that group (i.e. all the skills listed here) can damage a single target. So, the moment a certain skill from the list damages a monster, it prevents every other skill on the list from hitting the said monster for the original skill's NextDelay duration (whether from you or any other character).

Chain Lightning is a good example of a spell commonly hindered by next delay. If you have only two monsters standing close together and then cast CL, the first monster will be hit and then the CL will hit the other monster, and without additional targets the CL will target back to the first monster. However, the first monster was already successfully attacked with CL, which triggered the next delay timer. In many cases, 4 frames haven't elapsed since the first time CL hit that monster, so the 2nd attack will automatically miss.


Here's a list of all skills that are affected by NextDelay, and the lengths of them:

25-Frame Delay (1 second)
Shock Web
Blade Sentinel
Twister
Tornado

10-Frame Delay (0.4 seconds)
Volcano (initial eruption)

6-Frame Delay (0.24 seconds)
War Cry
Grim Ward

5-Frame Delay (0.2 seconds)
Fissure
Volcano (small fireball)

4-Frame Delay (0.16 seconds)
Multi Shot
Strafe
Lightning Strike
Chain Lightning
Nova
Frost Nova

Poison Nova
Shock Wave
Fist of Heavens (Holy Bolts)
Wake of Fire
Claws of Thunder (only 2nd and 3rd charge charges have Next Delay. 1st charge does not trigger Next Delay)
Phoenix Strike (only 2nd Chain Lightning and 3rd Chaos Orb charge have Next Delay. 1st charge does not trigger Next Delay)
Dragon Flight
Battle Cry
Battle Command
Battle Orders
 

sirpoopsalot

Diabloii.Net Member
I think you're missing the point of NextDelay entirely if you're expecting Meteor to be on the NextDelay list. Meteor does not have a NextDelay timer. At all.

I think I did a crappy job with the NextDelay example earlier, so I'll try again:

2 sorcs are questing along and they encounter a monster. They both cast Chain Lightning targeting the same monster, but one player has a slightly faster reaction/casting speed/whatever than the other, so his CL hits the monster first. The first CL to hit starts the NextDelay timer, which lasts for 4 frames (0.16 seconds). The second, slower sorcs, ChainLightning will automatically miss if it "hits" the monster within the 0.16 seconds of the first CL. If the NextDelay from the first CL has already run out when the second CL "hits", the monster will also receive the damage from the second spell (and reset the NextDelay timer again).

In other words, NextDelay limits how often a monster can receive damage from a certain type of spell. Some spells, like ChainLightning, are limitted in how often they can cause damage to a monster, so no matter how big a barrage of CL's, one monster will only receive damage every 0.16 seconds - at maximum. Some spells, like Tornado, have a longer NextDelay than most. Some spells, like Meteor, do not have any NextDelay whatsoever (good luck casting a barrage of Meteors though).


As for FCR... it works like normal for meteor and orb, or any timered spell.

FCR decreases the amount of time required for the casting animation to complete successfully. However, it doesn't affect the casting delay, so the overall benefit is decreased for FCR on skills with a casting delay.

So, you have a sorceress with 63 FCR and it casts Meteor (9-frame casting speed). After those 9 frames elapse your sorc is once again free to run around, cast a different spell, drink a potion, etc. However, when that time comes the 1.2 second casting delay kicks in, and your sorc cannot cast meteor again during that time.

If you jump up to 105 FCR the first action will be decreased to 8 frames before you can resume your other actions (potions, run, etc.), but the 1.2 second timer is not decreased.


As I said previously, casting delay and NextDelay are not the same thing. Although they both involve timers, they are not related. FYI, casting delays are commonly referred to as "timered" spells, but NextDelay is always referred to as NextDelay (it's timer is inherent to understanding how it technically works, but it's not really referred to in a NextDelay discussion).
 
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Boris The Invincible

Diabloii.Net Member
sorry, that i posted that after that nextdelay thing was just coincidence, i realise its obv not gonna affect non-chained things lol
so basically, FCR is less important for me if i use meteor/ orb more than fireball/ ice blast/whatever. I think i get it now, cheers for the long post
 

Doppel

Banned
Another question about breakpoints when shifting into a bear, IAS seems to be neither sorceres or werebear related (instead a formula specifically for the sorceress that shifts into a bear).
Now, my question is if Faster block rate, chance to block and faster hit recovery uses either the sorceress breakpoints when in bearform, or the werebear breakpoints when in bearform or like IAS a specific formula for the sorceress that changes into a werebear?
If its the last option then does someone have the breakpoint table for it?
 

rickster

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Break Points and Formula's

Anyone know the breakpoints for bows/crossbows? I want to figure out how much IAS I need for widowmaker ward bow.

The strategy compendium doesn't list them, neither do the 2 bow sorc guides.
 
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