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Beast or Enigma?

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Arkardo, Nov 8, 2006.

  1. Arkardo

    Arkardo Diabloii.Net Member

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    Beast or Enigma?

    Hi all,

    I've been gathering wealth to trade high runes for either Beast or Enigma. So far, I've gathered an Ist and some Puls and Keysets that can add up to another Ist, enough for one high rune.

    What do you think my Summoner will benefit the most from? They're both about as expensive, so that's not really an issue here.

    And It's still not clear to me in what kind of armor to put my would-be Enigma in. What are the options, and why?

    Thank you, most kind people!
     
  2. Kirah

    Kirah Diabloii.Net Member

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    Welcome to the wild, wild world of the Undead!

    I've got to vote Enigma personally if I had to choose one or the other. A low strength 3 socket breast plate sounds good to me, but it depends on which three socket armor you're able to find/afford/have strength to equip.
    Yes the fanaticism allows faster hacking, faster casting (if you have mages), and all that, but Enigma will save your hide and increase your speed of both questing/MFing/playing so much. And if you magic find faster and kill faster you'll get better runes and items to put runes into so you can get that beast or faith weapon that you always wanted anyway! :grin:

    Good luck and Good hunting!
    Kirah
     
  3. bogie

    bogie Diabloii.Net Member

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    Yup, Kirah's got it. Get enigma first because it lets you get more wealth that much faster, then later you can grab a beast when your swimming in wealth.:azn:
     
  4. Dennis_KoreanGuy

    Dennis_KoreanGuy Diabloii.Net Member

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    Beast and Enigma are about the most important parts of a summoner gear, but if you had to choose, go with Enigma.

    I would think Beast is more expensive... anyways, Enigma's crowd control is much more important than anything Fanat provides.

    If you are planning to make your own enigma, go with Mage Plate.



     
  5. garion

    garion Diabloii.Net Member

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    id say enigma is by far one of the most important pieces in a summoners aresenal...yup..because it lets you reorg your army..and drop them off for fast attacks..or to reposition them(offensively/defensively)..etc...

    beast is not a critical piece for a summoner...its nice..but you could get and act 1 faith merc....also for fanta...but its fun if you like getting in on the action..especially as a were bear for kicks...(although my AR was always a bit crappy...but i think i had some CB on my nec i forget from where maybe the beast zerker...but yeah it helped on baal...)...

    i think a nice CTA on switch is nice too (1 bo is plenty)..back when i was actively playing, 1bo ctas were about a HR...so a nice inexpensive piece..thats lets you tank some stray ele dmg....

    * BP or MP is good for nigma =)
     
  6. zuke

    zuke Diabloii.Net Member

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    Definitely get Enigma. I have a lvl 91 fishymancer and haven't bothered with Beast. Your main attack is NOT the skellies killing all the baddies. Rather, they or your merc kills the first monster and you corpse explode the rest. Enigma is more useful because of how teleport lets you keep control of your army. This is especially important if you use any Revives (which will get lost without teleport).
     
  7. bogie

    bogie Diabloii.Net Member

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    Im of the strong beleif that beast is overated. I tend to spam teleport from nigma, so fcr becomes a big issue in staying alive, as does resists to survive those gloams. I therefore use hoto for the
    +3 all skills
    +30-40 resists
    +40 fcr

    Beats the extra dmg from Beast that I dont need because my mercs a tank and CE destroys all:laugh: .
     
  8. Dennis_KoreanGuy

    Dennis_KoreanGuy Diabloii.Net Member

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    but now you are overrating fcr. In PvP jumptele is important for summoners, and higher fcr = faster landage. But in PvM, mr.meph isn't going anywhere so high fcr is redundant.

    Just get 75% and you'll be fine.



     
  9. Eilo Rytyj

    Eilo Rytyj Diabloii.Net Member

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    Enigma!!!!

    You can perform just as well with AoKL until you can tweak your build to include a Beast. HotO isn't as good as either, +3 skills is a little lacking for your weapon slot.

    I'd rather run around with an AoKL at end-game, simply because I'm too lazy to keep switching to a higher +skills setup for prebuffing an army.

    FCR is less of an issue in PvM for a summoner. Trang's or Magefist gloves will provide 20%, Arachnid's has another 20%, AoKL has 10%. That'll net you the 48% breakpoint which is plenty for general teleporting and CE spamming needs.
     
  10. Arkardo

    Arkardo Diabloii.Net Member

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    OK, Enigma it is! You sure about the Mage Plate? How much should I expect to pay for a 15% ED one?

    EDIT: Nevermind, I looked it up. Wow, does such an armor cost 2 Ist? Guess I've more work left to do than I thought...
     
  11. Eilo Rytyj

    Eilo Rytyj Diabloii.Net Member

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    I made my Fishy's Enigma in a 15% ed Breast Plate I found and socketed via Larzuk. For PvM I doubt you'd need any higher. Rolled with 773 def too, 852 def, 2 from perfect :grin:. I was happy at the time, first time I made an Enigma.

    In other words: don't go spending too much on a base armour for it, it doesn't need to be absolutely perfect. Find a Breast Plate, Ring Mail, Light Plate, Mage Plate, whatever, as long as it's got low strength requirements.

    OT: He's got 30 base str but 155 str after items... I guess Tgods as a belt isn't the most conventional, but it's all I got atm and probably the best thing until Arachs.
     
  12. arbing

    arbing Diabloii.Net Member

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    you don't need superior armor for PVM and PVP for a summonor, def is useless for him 1) your def will suck anyways either in superior armor or not 2) your army is most likely to shield you from damage in pvm so why bother 3) the repair cost is very high on a superior armor and you have to collect rals if you want to repair them. So it's better to use a cheap 3 socket breast plate it's every where (esp. when you join a cow game)
     
  13. kaervek

    kaervek Diabloii.Net Member

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    I would suggest either mage plate or an elite light armor (any will do). I'm not really a big fan of beast. I'd have to carry it instead of my merc and i like to have a Lem'd or Ist'd ali baba on main. The damage bonus from beast is very small when you consider a might merc with pride weapon is already adding ~500% dmg. The IAS i think is a bit iffy with skeletons due to their AI being designed for a certain amount of action frames anyway.

    Defence, while not *that* important, is still nice to have. enigma, up'd homo and a defiance merc will get you a respectable amount of defence even in hell. Makes teleporting down to meph a lot easier
     
  14. Arkardo

    Arkardo Diabloii.Net Member

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    OK, thank you very much for your input. I think I'll go with a superior Breast Plate, because they're relatively cheap to get and it increases it's trade value very much (in case I ever want to trade it away) than a normal one. That's a good idea, no?

    About Beast: some people say it's not really needed, because your Merc already does the most damage, but Beast also increases the Merc's damage and attack speed, so wouldn't that be more useful than HOTO? HOTO "only" offers resist and +3 skills, which let you have one more skeleton and mage, increase CE and Curse Radius. With Beast you have one skeleton less, but your others and your Merc will do way more damage. Your resist can be filled to 75% all by other means (Homonculus, Umed helm, Torch, Annihilus, Mara's. Expensive, yes, but we're talking about perfect Summoners, which is my ultimate goal). This is just my theory, though.

    Just to be sure, I don't only want to MF, but also do Uber Tristam. Will that change anything?

    EDIT: just want to relavate that "perfect" statement. I'm not going to max defense, simply because it's too costly for me.
     
  15. garion

    garion Diabloii.Net Member

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    i know turbulentturtle (a very good forumner) on west has a 15% BP he is planning to put up for sale...:grin:



     
  16. garion

    garion Diabloii.Net Member

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    eh..ive done both..and its not a huge difference...with or without beast...

    i mean there is an improvement..but im not sure if its worth the trouble of not having the nice aokl =)...either way its ok..depends on your budget



     
  17. bogie

    bogie Diabloii.Net Member

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    Besides, damage is not WAY more than with hoto. If you prebuff with AoKL for beast, you come up around 200 dmg ahead than HOTO with AoKL prebuff. Considering that my skeles already destroy hell and that my merc does most damage, I really dont consider losing out on 30+ resists, +3 skills, and fcr a good deal.
     
  18. Arkardo

    Arkardo Diabloii.Net Member

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    Yes, but I want to be capable taking on the Ubers, or at least the Mini-Ubers.

    Anyway, I made my Enigma in a Mage Plate; I don't think a 10 higher strength requirement hurts... Man, I've already fallen in love with the beautiful Enigma. Such a powerful peace of equipment. I've tried in on my Concentrate Barb using a Spectral Shard for fcr. I ran the Countess and Nilhathak in the same time I did just the Countess.

    Oh, and what about the weapon for my Merc? Basically it's the same question as before. Should I use Pride? The Cham (freezes target) in it might hurt my MF speed though...
     
  19. HYKO

    HYKO Diabloii.Net Member

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    You don't need beast to beat mini uber, or uber. It's a nice boost, just not essesntial I guess..



     
  20. arbing

    arbing Diabloii.Net Member

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    i still dont know why you would use a "SUPERIOR" breast plate, it's totally pointless.... even with a elite superior armor (let alone a breast plate), your necro's def would SUCK due to no defence mulitplier skills (unlike pally and barbs). It only increase the repair cost and nothing more, the def. increase is more or less like nothing. Plus NO a superior breast plate will NOT increase it's trade value unless it's 15% and perfect def. (that's for collectors mostly). For vast majority they would perfer a non superior one due to low repair cost and they don't have to spend their ral runes everytime their armor is about to break.



     

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