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Bear vs Wolves for PvM

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Genraek, Apr 23, 2008.

  1. Genraek

    Genraek IncGamers Member

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    Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    Ok so I'm rebuilding my shaman druid (Volcano maxed, along with molten boulder and fissure, then the remaining points in firestorm. Also uses a Bear)

    Before, when I played on Bnet, I had bear maxed, since I built him to duel and had a blast doing it. But now I want to rebuild him and gear him out (gonna make him a naked guardian first though ) And I was wondering about something, how do wolves compare to bear in PvM. When I'd PvP on him, bear was great for whacking at people and taking blasts, but will he do decent in PvM damage-wise? Would it be better to just max out dire wolves instead?


    Just how do the two compare to each other, pros/cons would be awesome.



    EDIT: Forgot to mention, Bear was maxed before, and I'd be spending 20 points on a pet now.
     
  2. HC Gunther

    HC Gunther IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    Bears are great at fighting one toughie at a time. Wolves are better when facing a large number of monsters. I suggest you read Insane Wayne and jiansonz' exploits in the Green with Envy Tournament.
     
  3. TopHatCat64

    TopHatCat64 IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    In my travels with my Hunter Druid (Maxed DW, Maxed Grizzly), I found that dire wolves tore through Normal and Nightmare like a chainsaw. Once I hit Hell however, my wolves slowed down a lot and grizzly was a much more effective tank.

    If you're mainly killing with fire skills and just need a tank, I'd go with 20 in Grizzly.
     
  4. Insane Wayne

    Insane Wayne IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    Maxed Bear will do pretty good damage, but his knockback might wreak havoc with your fire skills. Imagine it pushing monsters away from your fissures/volcano. Even a single knockback will render your volcano useless. Not good. jiansonz had the successful idea to negate the knockback by using an ice mage. If you'd like to use a different merc, you'll need another solution. Be aware that an unsynergized bear will be limited to ~1000 life. Also, I find the bear's leash to be too tight, an issue if paired with a melee merc. (Bear gets tugged away leaving the merc exposed).

    I prefer Maxed dire wolves (with 1 point in Grizz). 3 wolves, each with ~800 life. However their damage will be poor (it's much improved with a Might merc, but still nothing special). If I need a massive tank against a tough boss, I summon a Grizz (which will have 4000+ life and huge regen thanks to wolf synergy.) The trade-off is that its resists and damage will suck, but the huge life pool will allow it to tank well. I prefer this method because I'm not concerned with minion damage. I just want them to tank, keeping monsters still, while I blast fire spells and merc pitches in.
     
  5. Genraek

    Genraek IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    I love these forums because so many of the posts are insightful and helpful.


    Anyways, enough brown nosing, what I'd like from my pet is to be able to tank, but be able to deal a noticeable amount of damage, not a lot like a build based around it, but enough that it's well worth the mana to summon it.

    In regards to the merc, I always feel bound to using a Act 2 one (auras ftw :( ) so getting a chance to use an act 3 one would be amazing, the one thing holding me back form the thought is I wanna do this guy (my first HC char in FOREVER) a naked guardian, so mana is going to be a problem. Along with needing tanks, and a merc with insight and random mana-steal gear would be REALLY helpful.

    Tanking-wise the maxed DW and using the 1-point griz to tank sounds awesome, but I'm afraid the damage will be lackluster at best, although the health will be well worth the point investment..... Decisions....
     
  6. Insane Wayne

    Insane Wayne IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    Hmm, sounds like you may be trying to do too many things at once? (Or maybe I'm just confused about your plans...)

    Druid fire spells are fairly cheap to cast, and most are delayed by a timer. One of my HC druids (with significantly restricted gear) used maxed Volcano/Boulder/Firestorm. I never had too much of a problem with running low on mana. The blue potions I found in the field usually sufficed. I'm not sure you really need the boost from Insight.

    I don't understand. How can a naked character leech mana? What is your definition of "naked"? Even if you're equipped with mana-steal, how does that fit with a caster character? You want to be casting spells full-time, right? Not messing with physical attacks/AR/damage.

    If you really want strong minion damage, you'll have to go with grizzly. It'll be durable enough through Norm and NM, but in Hell it will die often without the wolf +life synergy. Regardless, I don't see that much opportunity for significant minion damage contributing to your attacks. With 70+ points in Fire skills, you'll destroy all non-FIs pretty quickly. Plus, your desert merc's elite Insight weapon will vastly outhit your Grizzly.



     
  7. Genraek

    Genraek IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM




    You're right about me being unclear. I do appreciate the info you've given with the scattered info you have. When I said mana steal gear, I was actually meaning merc with LIFE steal, as I will be using a geared merc, and a merc with insight and life steal gear is quite a valuable ally. (Note: I wrote mana when I meant to write life about 6-7 times writign that alone.... I'm otu of it today I guess)


    The comments about insight are true though, looking into it, the mana costs are fairly low and fixed, I've just been having mana problems with how far I've gotten and I didn't look into it too much.

    I think I am going to go with 20 in DW and just 1 in grizzly though.


     
  8. Insane Wayne

    Insane Wayne IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    OK, I understand now.
    Yes, you definitely want to have some merc life leech to go with his weapon. Preferably you'll upgrade his Insight to an elite weapon when appropriate. Even if you don't need the Meditation aura, it will be handy. Mana is frequently a problem for young casters, even with cheap spells. Natural mana pool growth, via leveling, makes it easier as the game progresses. A couple Serpent GCs or a Bahamut's Ring will work wonders (if you allow charms/jewelry on your naked character (the definition of "naked" varies)).

    Anyway, good luck with your Druid. He should be Hell-viable no matter what route you take with the summons.
     
  9. neumein

    neumein IncGamers Member

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    Re: Bear vs Wolves for PvM

    I've made a Fire/Summoner Shaman before, but with a melee' twist. I used Lawbringer RW, along with 1pt shape shift skills, to great effect. The Decrepify broke most PIs I came across, and the elemental damage wore down the ones it couldn't. With the decrepify going, things were slowed down considerably, adding another layer of safety for my wolves/myself. as well as the nice damage boost.
     

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