are mages worth it?

gordongraydon

Diabloii.Net Member
are mages worth it?

i keep getting conflicting views on if mages are worth it. neone have ne concrete suggestions

(by lvl 75 i will have about +13 skills)

thx for replying
 

omgwtfbbqpwned

Diabloii.Net Member
a) You have an Enigma
b) Your Act II Might Town Guard mercenary carries an Infinity, not Pride
c) You want to fight ubers
d) You enjoy pk'ing/bm duels
e) You feel giddy seeing another 7 - 15 Skeletons frolicking on your screen

The more of these that match you, the more likely Mages will be good for you.

Likewise, as less and less of these conditions match you, the less likely Mages will please you.
 

bogie

Diabloii.Net Member
Ill take the stance that mages are good no matter what.
1) They add extra damage
2) No other use for skill points
3) Cold mages slow enemies and bosses
4) Fire and Lightning mages do good damage
5) They pwn in duels, they can supply most of your dmg against high def chars
6)Poison mages give you prevent monster heal as they cant heal while poisoned
7) They tend to "hang back" from the fighting, letting them act as behind the line bodyguards against sneaky enemies

Thats 7 concrete reasons to get mages, not much of a defense against them :cool:

Bogie
 

Kirah

Diabloii.Net Member
I'd second bogie's list and add

6a) the poison lasts for an ungodly long time (somewhere around 10 minutes or so if I recall correctly). Plenty of time to TP back and get extra supplies!

Good luck and good hunting!
Kirah
 

Jackson

Diabloii.Net Member
Most people say "no" to mages because they need the skill points for something else (ie/ not pure summoning necro). However, if you ARE a pure summoner, I don't see any reason why you wouldn't have mages... I mean, where else are you going to put your points?

You *can* max golem mastery for a nice Iron Golem, but ehhhh.......
 

DrSoup

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm backing up the "yes" crowd if you are a pure summoner. Even after maxing all the "necessary" skills you'll still end up with plenty of left over skill points. I had a pretty impressive necro (lvl 87, AoKL, homunc, enigma, and other goodies), and I could still barely do Arcane without my mages because there's just so many phys. immunes.
 

tmd turka

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm backing up the "yes" crowd if you are a pure summoner. Even after maxing all the "necessary" skills you'll still end up with plenty of left over skill points. I had a pretty impressive necro (lvl 87, AoKL, homunc, enigma, and other goodies), and I could still barely do Arcane without my mages because there's just so many phys. immunes.
Amp damage? (Would solve your phycial immune issue)

I can't really justify mages without a decent amount invested in lower resists. That curse is what makes there damage worthwhile. What you really need to ask yourself, is a mage > a revive. Revives may have a piss poor AI but they are dam sturdy tanks. With enough plus to skill gear one point into mages might be enough. I focus on skeles and revies on my summoners but I normally have at least 6 mages from + skill gear.

What we should do is compare the damage of maxed mages, maxed skele mastery, and maxed lower reists with maxed skeles, maxed skele mastery, amp damage, and a might merc aura. That would be a fari damage comparison.



 

DaemonAkuma

Diabloii.Net Member
Sounds like over complication of a relatively easy issue.

Why ever putmore than 1 pt into a curse? Cast amp so merc/ironG/and skellies can have a field day, and with Convictin aura you're still looking at BEUATIFUL damage. If you were to sacrifice Amp for Lowe rres, you're causing your skellies to do ~1/2 the damage they would be. I'd bet that would far outplay any benefit of lower resist. Although I'm also far too lazy to do the calculation and would be the first to congratulate you if you are correct. But still, mages are valuable mostly bc of their poison (as stated earlier, in uber that is beyond simply being helpful) and ice=cold. I don't know for sure but I'd guess that Infinity's -Lite Resist would even further benefit the already lowered res on lite. Granted this only helps ~1/4 of your mages, but those can do a good amount then. Besides, I have mages and revives. Nothing is more enjoyable than having skellies golem merc and urdars hammering the heck out of something while mages and souls/knights/spear throwers snipe the piss out of it from the back row, as well as distenegrating anything that tries to ambush me from behind.
 

Demonic Angel Rules

Diabloii.Net Member
Go with 20 RSM. They do great damage if your merc uses infinty and can prevent monster heal and slow them. They are way worth it, i made a summoner with out them and couldnt kill worth crap in hell, and that was with ~13 + skills.
 

Tempy

Diabloii.Net Member
Amp damage? (Would solve your phycial immune issue)

I can't really justify mages without a decent amount invested in lower resists. That curse is what makes there damage worthwhile. What you really need to ask yourself, is a mage > a revive. Revives may have a piss poor AI but they are dam sturdy tanks. With enough plus to skill gear one point into mages might be enough. I focus on skeles and revies on my summoners but I normally have at least 6 mages from + skill gear.

What we should do is compare the damage of maxed mages, maxed skele mastery, and maxed lower reists with maxed skeles, maxed skele mastery, amp damage, and a might merc aura. That would be a fari damage comparison.
Even with just 1 point in revive, I can have more revives than I ever care to create. There's just not enough good monsters to revive usually, unless you want to hold back on CE a lot (which I only do when I want urdars).

As for mages, I initially just maxed it because I was going to have a ton of spare points, and I figured more summons = more damage/damage diverted from me = good.

You can definitely notice the mage's value when dealing with phys immune packs. Even when amp breaks phys immunity (which is true for almost all mobs), your skelly warrior damage against them won't be very good. Meanwhile your mages can go to town, for me, the difference in killing speed between not having mages and having mages on those was huge.

Then they offer nice utility such as freezing effect from the cold mages (Fighting baal with gumby + decrep + cold mage is funny as hell to watch, tho I find that you can usually just get away with amp on baal) and incredibly long PMH from the poison mages.



 

Perfect Hatred

Diabloii.Net Member
Once upon a time I posted this:

My feelings exactly! A summoner should definitely max out skelly mages. Why?

1.Free extra damage

2. Mages have 6 minutes or more of poison damage duration to prevent monster heal even when you are in town or out resurrecting your army after a retreat from battle.

3. Cold mages have crazy chill duration, on Hell usually 6-7 seconds to slow monsters down.

4. extra tanks to keep the master safe :wink3:

5. Mages attack from a distance and so can never be blocked by crowding and prevented from attacking enemies like your melee skellies.

And it isnt like there are any other good skills to put the skillpoints into after you max out the 3 fishymancer skills. Pointless to go bone/poison attacks since you can get synergies properly, Bone armour is annoying to recast all the time and isnt worth it after the marrowwalk bug was fixed, curses are marginally improves by additional skillpoints if you have high + all skills already.


 

garion

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm backing up the "yes" crowd if you are a pure summoner. Even after maxing all the "necessary" skills you'll still end up with plenty of left over skill points. I had a pretty impressive necro (lvl 87, AoKL, homunc, enigma, and other goodies), and I could still barely do Arcane without my mages because there's just so many phys. immunes.
um...a simple amp dmg curse will take care of the phys immunes....without without mages they shouldn't be an issue....

in any case as a pure summoner i say go all out for mages...however if you are planning to be a hybrid 20 pts is too much to sink into mages....



 

Zarniwoop

Diabloii.Net Member
Dim vision is always worth at least 10 points.

It's the only curse I would ever put more than 1 pt into.
 

DaemonAkuma

Diabloii.Net Member
1 just 1 pointed it and, sadly, have never used it. I just tele stack right into a crowd of souls and they're reduced to ash in a few moments anyway...I usually get shocked 1, maybe 2. Even before my massive res I would just tele and then run away...of course, I just realized in both of this scenarios I had teleport...so I guess if I did not, Dim Vision would allow me to get up there to them. I just rebuttled myself :| But anywho, still not more than 1 pt, although I respect peoples' decisions to do so. It is simply a variation of an extraordinarily effective killing machine :)
 

etits

Diabloii.Net Member
i'd go mages. More skellies, better.

And even tho it's a bit bm, They do work well in pvp when your enemy has high defence, or he doesn't really know what element to resist or sorb on. ^^
 

DaemonAkuma

Diabloii.Net Member
Mages are awesome for pvp. I forget the forumla, but someone in a different thread calculated the damage potential they have per cast and I believe it was around 7.5K or more, and that's the mages alone (not counting merc, golem, and [more importantly] revives).
 
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