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Another Fool's Question

Discussion in 'Assassin' started by w-igor, Aug 24, 2010.

  1. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Another Fool's Question

    I'm a Venom-oriented Ghost using Highlord and WSM Bug, Suwayyah Chaos and still looking for GT / RT Fury. I'm also looking for Fool's claws. And it's freaking HARD.

    It just doesn't exist. It's just impossible to find. Up until now I was looking for something like this:

    Fool's Feral
    40 ias
    2 soc (Um Um)
    and hopefully some skills like venom mb

    But there are NO claws like that on my realm. What else should I be looking for to enjoy good attack BP as well as good damage? Please give me some tips about what I should be looking for. Of course I will be using it with Chaos Suwa and HL. WSM bug can be used as well
     
  2. mephiztophelez

    mephiztophelez Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    top notch rare fools claws are one of the toughest items to get your hands on.

    try the following: gambling for blade-talons & claws. shopping anya and re-roll all magic runic talons and feral claws with 3x flawless (or even chipped iirc) gems.

    another method that may yield success for you is imbues. imbue a greater talon with a lvl89+ 'toon and you'll always get 3 staffmods.

    oh, and btw, until you get a high phys damage claw, don't bother using highlords.
     
  3. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    You'll have a better chance of finding it yourself unless your wealthy and trade on multiple forums. Even then, it might be 50/50.

    As for the HL, check your IAS after WSM bug. I wouldn't base highlord's usefulness solely on the deadly strike.
     
  4. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    Could you please explain in better detail how to find those claws myslef? I haven't ever done anything like that. Do I need a high level char to do that? Which claws exactly to buy from Anya (from gambling or just "shopping"?)? Should they be rare or white or blue? Which ones to re-roll? 3x pg + claw into the cube to re-roll it, right?

    And still, no matter HOW I will be looking for the claws - which ones are the keepers? For sure "Feral 40ias 2soc", but what are the other claws which will give me last BP and good dmg?
     
  5. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    Shopping is for nice blues, and re-rolling blues if you want. You can't get yellows from her aside from the class item she gives for the rescue. The whites are only sold in normal and aren't the kind you'd use for pvp.

    Gambling on the other hand, is all chance, but generally easier than actually hunting specifically for them in general kills. I personally go for Greater Talon/Runics but Feral's are solid too. You could go Greater Claw, but you end up sacrificing damage. Don't think anyone bothers with those, magical, but rare they can be upped to Feral.

    40ias Fool's is the "essential" part, everything else on top of that is icing on the cake. However, depending on setup, you can get away with 30ias or so.

    One way or re-rolling blues is to take a magical claw in the desired base and run it through the socketed magic item formula. I wouldn't recommend re-rolling with pgems since its easier and cheaper to just shop it if its blue.

    While the pskulls re-rolling rares works, its too expensive to be worthwhile.
     
  6. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    So even if it's only 40ias GT / RT / Feral with NO ADDS, it's worth keeping? Even if it's 1soc? On the other hand, maybe 30ias 2soc will be better than 40ias 1soc? Or maybe it's possible to get 30ias and with HL achieve a BP?

    http://img137.imageshack.us/i/screenshot031e.jpg/ - what do you think of this one?
    http://i35.tinypic.com/72ga5y.jpg - and those for example... suwa = bad, but 40ias and 2s = good. overall, good or bad? :) venom is nice as well...
    And what about this one? Runic Talon, Fools, 3 Mind Blast / 3weapon Block / 2 Dragon Flight
    EDIT: And I have one claws I've found myself:

    Rare Scissors Katar
    24-67 dmg
    40 ias
    13 to min dmg
    45 to max dmg (based on lvl)
    1486 to ar (based on lvl)
    5 leech life
    1 soc

    Maybe this one can be somehow upgraded and useful?

    EDIT 51: I think I found an almost PERFECT one (don't know the price though), this one is the best, right? (but please, tell me about the other claws well because I probably can't afford this one)

    Fool's GT
    40 ias
    2 soc
    3 mb
    3 venom
    1 df

    EDIT 99: yes, those dream claws are out of my league. Anyway, please tell me if I'm correct about them being so WONDERFUL
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2010
  7. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    Few more options:

    Fool's GT 40 ias 3 LS 1 DF (Um)
    Fool's GT 40 ias +dmg/lvl (every fool's has that?) 2 LS 2 DF
    Fool's GT 40 ias 2 soc 3 LS 1 BS 1 DF (Um Um) - looks cool except the stats: I will get none very useful though pay for +3LS. If the price is acceptable - take it?
    And those http://a.imageshack.us/img189/7528/foolwc.png

    Please tell me which of the claws I found are worth it and if possible, please tell me why they are or aren't good enough
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2010
  8. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    The primary purpose of a fool's claw is the fool's mod. The reason the IAS is desired as it "extends" the speed gap from your slower chaos claw. As you can socket both blues and rares, you're guaranteed at least one um for the OW.

    Since I was hoarding my HRs last season and no one on these forums had any nice fool's claws for sale, I was actually running with a lousy blue blade talon fools. Can't even remember if it had IAS at all on it, don't think I even socketed any ums as I was waiting for something better.

    While my fury was fine for the usual suspects, the whole reason you get a fool's is that you will miss so frequently against barbs and paladins. Unlike Sass, I didn't have the patience to learn to beat barbs regularly, not to mention my gear wasn't impressive, effectively bargain bin. Still managed to get a lot more kills than deaths, and took a number of pali's down. Granted I could have won even more by just holding down the MB button ;)

    My dream Fool's claw would probably be this:

    Fool's (essential prefix)
    +2 sin skills (witch-hunter's prefix)

    Toss up between
    Mechanic's (2 sockets) or
    Cruel prefix

    Suffixes:

    Quickness (40IAS)
    Bear (knockback)

    and one of these
    Transcendence (15-20 min dmg)
    Slaughter (15-20 Max dmg)
    Restoration (self-repair if eth claw)

    As for staff mods, I'd want +3 venom, +3 Weaponblock (clawblock), +3 SM or MB

    I'm not a fan of dflight on a ghost

    Every fool's has damage based on level, that's part of the mod. But remember the main purpose of a fool's is to land a hit so that OW and venom can wear down your high def target - high def targets are rarely going to stay stunlocked and are dangerous to stay in close proximity - whether it be hammers, smite, or a stronger ww.

    As for choosing your claw, as long as it's a greater talon/runic or Feral Claws with 40IAS and Fool's its fine. Everything else on top of that is "bonus". The Suwwayah won't work for pvp, but it workd for a dclaw sin in pvm.
     
  9. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    Thanks Secksegai! Just to make totally sure, I should be looking ONLY for GT 40ias or Feral 40ias? Even when I use HL and find a claw which is 2soc 30ias and GODLY mods (let's say 3 venom 3 mb slaughter or something), the 40ias GT/Feral with no adds will be better?
     
  10. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    The difference between GT/Runic is damage/stat req - GT is the exceptional, Runic is the elite. Exceptional has lower base damage and lower requirements

    Ferals have a slightly higher base damage at the cost of being slower. - This one you really want to pay attention to the IAS.

    I'm not entire sure of what you mean by your last sentence. The essential mods are the Fool's and 4Oias, anything else is a bonus (as in making the claw even better).
     
  11. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    You said I need to pay attention to the IAS with Feral Claws. But from what I understand the ONLY claws I should be looking for are 40 IAS. I'd REALLY like to understand that IAS thing... Because it looks like no matter which claw I use (slow Feral? faster GT?) and no matter which amu I use ("slow" Mara? 20ias HL?), 40 IAS is still the thing I must have in the claw in each case

    As far as I know (and I know close to nothing), there are 4 sources of IAS for WW Ghosts:

    1) Claw type (very slow Suwa, slow Feral, fast GT / RT - please correct me if I'm wrong)
    2) Claw mods (it can have 40 IAS)
    3) Highlord or not
    4) Sockets (so I can socket it with 15ias)

    So let's say I take the slowest veriant possible, but with 40ias: Feral Claw 40IAS without using HL - will it hit the break poing?
    And let's say on the other hand that I have the FASTEST variant possible, but WITHOUT 40IAS: Greater Talon 2soc (let's say it's even dual 15ias jool'd), using HL, but it's only 30 IAS - will that hit the bp?

    I'd like to understand the mechanics behind it or at least get an easy to follow guide like:
    GT/RT - can be 30 IAS if you use HL
    Feral - must be 40 IAS no matter what amu you use
    Suwa - you can't do anything to hit the BP if you use Chaos Suwayyah already

    or something like this
     
  12. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    Basically, you can use a combination of tienje's guide and the diablo speed calc to get the IAS numbers you need.

    Damage and speed are the factors in deciding what to use.
    GT/RT are -30 base
    Feral is -20 base

    Honestly its easier to just use the calc, note his has checkboxes for primary/secondary claw type to factor in the wsm bug.

    You could technically use cat's eye, but highlord's is superior thus not mentioned.

    The primary reason for sockets is for the OW as it can only be increased a few ways.
     
  13. w-igor

    w-igor Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    I have never used a calc like that before. And since I really don't want to make multiple HRs worth mistake, could you please tell me is there any safe and worthy way to use 30 ias instead of 40 ias fool's?
     
  14. SeCKSEgai

    SeCKSEgai Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Another Fool's Question

    While I saw the other thread - in order to prevent expensive mistakes, the key is understanding the mechanics. Especially since a patch could suddenly fix the wsm bug, it's important to know the basics of why and how it works. Being able to use the calc (the only reason I don't link it directly is I don't know if this site has anything against that one). It is mostly in German, but there's an English button and from there its fairly straightforward.

    As average weapon speed is a major factor in any c/c sin build, it's important to understand as a ghost. I've seen ghosts in the past make mistakes simply because they don't understand that dynamic.

    And as for the 30ias feral and HL, didn't Sass already tell you the 20ias on HL was enough days ago? (I know all the speed gets confusing, but that's the only reason I bothered to learn it myself - I still use Tienje's guide for reference though).
     

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