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An Unusual But Effective Character for PvM...

Discussion in 'Diablo 2 Community Forum' started by Papasmurf90, Mar 24, 2004.

  1. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    An Unusual But Effective Character for PvM...

    Hey,
    I quit right after 1.10 came out because the hell cows got too hard to kill (Yea, yea, I was being a big baby) and now I'm going to start again. Well, I always like characters that stuck out in the crowd and weren't your average whirl wind barb or nova sorc. So, now that I'm starting again I'm looking for a character that sticks out but is still effective, I was looking at the hammerdin or maybe a fire druid, but these are just ideas. So does anyone have any suggestions of an unusual character but that is still effective? Also, this if going to be for PvM only, no PvP. Thanks a million!
     
  2. sJw_shan

    sJw_shan IncGamers Member

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    Hammerdin isn't as unusual now, but it's also one of the most efficient and overall effective killers in d2 now. You don't need a ton of great equipment to make a hammerdin, and some items to aim for like wizardspike really aren't that expensive and can be bought for a few pgems at most.

    Also, summon necros (skeleton warriors mainly) are very effective now. In 1.09 monsters ripped apart skeletons in later difficulties, but skellies can get pretty tough now. In the beginning it might be tough to take on bosses like diablo, but a clay golem and decrep should make it easier. Or you can just play with others. One you can get more + gear, you'll find that your skeletons can take on any part of the game in hell. Make sure you get a might merc. With might and amp damage you should be able to plow through the game in single player, and tank anywhere in big games.

    *Another note about skellimancers is that you can also afford to have your own killing skill, because after maxing skeletal mastery, and skeletal warrior, you don't necessarily have to max out summon resist - in fact some people go one point. You can then work on a killing skill such as bone spirit + bone spear, or even poison nova. Having a high corpse explosion would work too.
     
  3. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    Thanks SJW, that really helped! So, hammerdins would be pretty effective for PvM? I always thought they were pretty cool...hmmmmm. Just one questions about them though, is it hard to hit monsters with hammers or does it get easier with practice?

    Also, I remember reading about a charged bolt sorc in 1.09. It was crazy, the sorc was shooting out like 50 bolts with one cast. I forget how the damage was though. Do you think this would be effective? I doubt it...

    I read The Dragoons guide on making a wind elementalist druid and it seemed pretty cool. Do you think this would be effective in PvM?

    Finally, I was readin that blizzard sorc's were kind of effective for PvM. Does anyone know if this is true? Thanks a million!
     
  4. rickcarson

    rickcarson IncGamers Member

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    Try the low level lightning trap which shoots charged bolts. You can get much higher theoretical damages than with the sorceress!! And it shoots around corners, requires fewer skill points... its all good.

    Plus you get a minion, your choice of good secondary attacks... etc etc.

    -------

    Hammerdin:
    Personally I found this *very* hard going once I hit Nightmare. I twinked some decent gear onto him, but be prepared to do strange things like grabbing 4 socket shields and pulling all the PDiamonds off your other chars :)

    --------

    Blizzard Sorc:
    Trashes the game. That is, right up until Hell Act 1, when you start running into lots of cold immunes. Then its a world of pain. I've played Orb sorcs as well, but Blizzard is more interesting. And there's a new belt with +2 to Blizzard you might want to look into.

    --------

    Another idea I'm toying with is the Shadow Assassin. The way Thorns works has changed, so you can now safely use Mind Blast to convert monsters without your Thorns merc auto-dying when they convert back. (For this one definitely consider *not* using the Shadow Master, use the Shadow Warrior instead... Nb the Shadow Master is quite disappointing to me, it seems to want to rain down Meteors - but only on Fire Immunes! On everything else it uses Shock Web and fire Blast :-(

    In the Shadow Tree they have some awesome skills.
    Cloak of Shadows = Dim Vision. (And if you don't know how good that is...)
    Fade has damage reduction.
    Mind Blast is a better version of Conversion.
     
  5. lextalionis

    lextalionis IncGamers Member

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    I have heard of people playing charged boltresses. It sounds like you played a lot in 1.09, but are very new to the synergies in 1.10. There are a lot of new cookie cutter builds you will probably find very interesting.

    Are you soloing or do you play with others. If you play with others primarially then there are some really interesting, high damage single tree characters out there for you to try.

    Meteor/Fireball sorceress works really well. Blizzard is great against everything but CI's. Necro has the all bone build, which is surprisingly good since you have strong BA & BWs and you can power it up by throwing on a pair of Marrowalks. Trapassins are pretty good damage at a distance now. Windy is interesting and fun. Hammerdins will work pretty well. And you'll get a lot better at throwing those things, but even after a lot of practice, I'm not sure how to become an expert. I still miss...a lot.

    But there are a lot of new builds. FCs and Rabies WW is interesting.

    These are a list of the stronger builds, I"m sure I"m missing some strong bulids. But there are a whole host of weaker builds or strong defensive builds. Good luck
     
  6. spuddogg

    spuddogg IncGamers Member

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    If you can get ahold of a ribcracker unique quarterstaff (not too hard to find) try a staff barb.
    The staff does some serious damage (esp when upgraded to a walking stick) and has some very sweet mods to it and staves work for barb mace mastery.
    Folks trip out when they see a barb wielding a staff tearing stuff up.
     
  7. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    Thanks for all the help you guys. Do you know of any effective druid builds that involve casting spells? Also, what would you say are the top 3 most unusal sorc builds that are still effective? Just for the record, I play in multiplayer games. Thanks a ton!
     
  8. Huntingtons

    Huntingtons IncGamers Member

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    Was thinking of trying a blood necro, but with all the power of caster mobs i dont know if i dare try... Blood necro is, for those who dont know :p, a necro using blood golem (and other minions) and iron maiden... the dmg is returned as dmg from the golem and gives the necro life so he's unbeatable with Iron Maiden on the mobs :D will it work?
     
  9. Noodle

    Noodle Moderator

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    I'm digging the idea of a staff barb. I assume it's still a two handed weapon?

    Noodle
     
  10. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    I also just read the frost zealot guide that I'm really diggin. Any opinions on this build? Also, could someone explain to me how to use a meteorb sorc? I was kind of confused on how to use them. Thanks
     
  11. spuddogg

    spuddogg IncGamers Member

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    Yes it is 2-handed, but it has a +100% to defense mod, so that helps offset the loss of a shield somewhat.
     
  12. andyishuge

    andyishuge IncGamers Member

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    Freezealots (frost zealots) and Tesladins (lightning zealot) are both very fun characters to play. The Tesladin is a very offensive based character, and can deal mass amounts of damage. On the other hand, the freezealot doesn't deal as much damage but gets the added bonus of slowing all enemies by 50% at level 20.

    Personally, I'd say Freezealots are one of the most fun characters I've ever played. They can be tough in the beginning if you don't have good items, but once you get your damage up from maxing your synergy skills, (resist cold, sacrifice, salvation) they can be deadly.
     
  13. Hoyunah

    Hoyunah IncGamers Member

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    If you wanna make a caster druid u can always do a wind druid. Unfortunately too be any good in hell you gotta be really rich... I had a wind druid and freakin owned Nm baal i jus stood in the middle tornado wit Hurricane but in Act1 hell i have trouble killing zombies. I saw a really nice Wind druid jus recently doing baal runs. Said he did 3k and had Hoto, Enigma etc. so if you got the money to make a wind druid go ahead.
     
  14. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    Do you have to be REALLY rich to make an effective wind druid, or just kind of effective? Another thing, you mentioned that blizzard sorcs suck when they get to CI's, couldn't you just get a different skill from another tree? Also, could someone please explain how to use a meteorb sorc? I get other chars, there kind of obvious but this one confuses me a little. I read the guide and it was kind of hard for me to understand. Do you like cast meteor and use orb to slow them down? Finally, which is better, a frost zealot or a tesladin and do you need godly equipment for them to be good? Ok, so I think I got them figured out now. Here they are:

    Skellimancer
    Frost Zealot/Tesladin (Whichever is better...)
    Conc Barb (Concentration
    Meteorb
    Blizzard Sorc
    Hammerdin

    Ok, I think thats all of them. Now, if possible could you make to lists, one that is the most effective killer with only average equipment and which is the most effective with good equipment. Hopefully they will look something like this:

    Godly Equipment
    1)
    2)
    3)
    4)
    5)
    6)

    Average Equipment
    1)
    2)
    3)
    4)
    5)
    6)

    I know this is asking a lot so if you don't want to, don't feel obliged, but it would be GREAT if you could. Thanks a million!
     
  15. royalesse

    royalesse IncGamers Member

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    Dude all those are in the guides that you already read. Most guides give 3 levels of equipment so you should have an idea of what they require. You mentioned unusual builds when you first started this thread... I hate to break it to you about 90% of the guides have become cookie cutters. So you're not going to find an unusual build in there.

    If you're doing PvM for fun then just think about characters that you had fun with in the past and build the one that most resembles them.

    If you're doing PvM for MF then I suggest that you actually make 2 characters. Make one for NM and one for Hell. The reason being that Hell MFers are usually doing Area runs. They go to a lvl 85 area and kill things and through sheer volume something REALLY nice drops every once and a while. NM MF is centered around Boss runs and requires you to ignore all the monsters get to the boss and kill it. So in NM MF teleporting and running fast is a lot more important.

    Personally I like to use an Enchantress for NM and a Skellimancer for Hell. Both don't require a lot of equipment and are ideal for the types of runs that they do. As the enchantress i stuck a bunch of Crushing blow on my merc and I just teleport him to the boss and he actually kills him for me. Enchant rocks NM but you need a lot of + skills equipment for Hell but that's ok cause you're not going to hell with her. THe skellimancer is perfect for area runs since you are surrounded by meat shields. Amp damage will get rid of most of the Phys immunes for you. Some say the speed is slow but for other builds to kill faster they need vastly superior equipment.

    Both of these builds for what you'll be using them for can basically go through naked. You don't even need a specific Act 2 Merc (although Might mercs are marginally faster).

    Typical Enchantress build:

    20 Warmth
    20 Enchant
    20 Fire Mastery
    1 Static
    1 Telekinesis
    1 Teleport

    Skellimancer w/ Poison backup
    20 Skeleton Warrior
    20 Skele Mastery
    20 Poison Nova
    20 Poison Explosion
    1 in every curse
    1 in pre-reqs, Clay golem, Golem Mastery, Summon Resist, corpse explosion, & bone armor
    Summon Mages & revives: to taste

    Start with an Act 2 Prayer merc, when you get to NM get a Might Merc.

    Playing tips: Use teleport a lot on the enchantress to position your merc on top of you. As the Skelemancer, the main damage will be your skeletons (i.e. physical) so be sure to use Amplify damage (Amp Dam will also get rid of most phys immunes). Poison nova is more to speed things up and give you a 2nd damage for Physical Resistant monsters. Learn how to use all your curses.
     
  16. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    None of them are unusual builds? Oh well, I don't really care. I think there all pretty cool. Well, I'm not going to be doing MF that much so what do you think would be a good character for PvM that can still kill large groups effectively without godly equipment? I kind of like the frost zealot or tesladin but I'm open to all the other builds too, but which do you think is better, the frost zealot or tesladin? Thanks a ton!
     
  17. weregamer

    weregamer IncGamers Member

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    I thought the point of your original question was an *unusual* but effective character. Building a hammerdin, skellymancer, or trapsin is not going to be that remarkable. These are effective, easy to play, relatively untweaked builds and unless the b.net people are too busy screwing each other over and calling each other noobs, there should be hundreds of each of them already, as well as most anything else so effective it gets a build guide written.

    The exception is the guide written because somebody was surprised how well an unusual build performed, or how much fun they had playing with it. I've seen a few of these that caught my interest, and they might appeal to you for their unusualness:

    Blade Fury Assassin
    Booyaka (aka Boingbarb)
    Charged Boltress
    Ranger (bow paladin)
    Arrowless Amazon (only Magic Arrow and passive skills)
    Throwbarb


    Then there are the ideas that make a character who is an asset to a coooperative party, but can't solo Hell on his/her own:

    Cleric (Holy Bolt + Auras paladin)
    Single-tree sorceresses of any kind
    Singer (Warcries barb - some versions are soloable but equipment-dependent, but the party-friendly one is awesome in his role)

    Also, sadly, there are the also-rans. These ideas just don't do well enough - at least, that anybody has written about. Maybe one of these would fit your style so well that you end up writing a guide about how to make it work.

    Non-wind pure-caster druid
    Fire Trapper assassin (works great PvP, hopeless PvM)
    Templar (Fist of the Heavens Paladin - also great Pvp and hopeless PvP)
    TankSorc (doesn't work because Energy Shield takes damage *before* resistance, absorb, etc.)

    I'm sure I'm missing/forgetting some others. The fact is, in 1.10 if you are interested only in cooperative PvM (probably on passworded TCP/IP games), or otherwise not unduly daunted by the new improved Hell difficulty, you can pick almost any skill of almost any character and build a reasonably-effective character around it and its synergies.
     
  18. Papasmurf90

    Papasmurf90 IncGamers Member

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    Yea, I was looking around the forums and I noticed that a lot of the builds a liked are quite common. Oh well, I think there pretty cool. You did mention something about a charged boltress. Could you please explain more on this build and possibly skill distribution? Also, out of the six that I listed earlier (Frost Zealot/Tesladin, Conc Barb, Meteorb Sorc, Blizzard Sorc, Hammerdin, and Elemental Wind Caster Druid) could you still list them like I asked with the list? Also, if you noticed, I replaced the skellimancer with the Elemental Wind Caster Druid because I like that build better than the skellimancer and I forgot to include it. Thanks a million!
     
  19. foxnews

    foxnews IncGamers Member

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    try a hydradin

    my pally is a hydradin and pretty much owns hell. It's mainly a new take on a vengeance pally. Build a vengeance pally utilizing synergies and stuff. Then when you get to a high enough level, try to get a dragon scale. Get a fire facet jewel in as many items as you can.. Then you can cast hydra( although it wont be a very high level hydra, conviction helps with this) and switch back N forth with hydra and vengeance. Put a few levels in fire resist, cold resist, and lightning resist... and enjoy.
     
  20. Kitriara

    Kitriara IncGamers Member

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    Apeople for those big lists for each of those is a lot work as you mentioned, considering that that information is available in the guide sections of each forum. Go the top of each one in the "stickies" and there are links to each guide with far more information than we could provide here.

    However, I will give a brief answer on the paladins you mentioned since that is my area of expertise in this game!

    Frost Zealots and Tesladins are both great due to the fact that they dont rely on their weapon damage to bring the pain - their damage comes from their skills.

    To do a damage comparison, here are the synergized damages of each at level 20:

    Frost: 998 - 1025 (1011 avg)
    Telsa: 1 - 3931 (1965 avg)

    As has been the case since Blizzard introduced lightning, lightning skills always have higher damage potential balanced out by the fact that it's range goes all the way down to 1.

    Of course, with Frost Zealots you have the fact that all of the enemies are slowed over 50% - invaluable if you play hardcore.

    If you are item-poor, the one thing that is nice about the Telsadin is that you can put together their ideal weapon - a Crescent Moon runeword - fairly easily. You'll be able to get or trade the runes for it simply by completing the hellforge quests, which is quite nice, especially considering that CM has -35% lightning on it, making you even more powerful.

    Anyways, there are Tesladin and Frost Zealot guides over in the paladin forum (if you check the Frost one make sure you read the 3.0 version) and are both really fun.

    Plus, you wanted something unusual, and I will say that despite people on these forums talking about them a lot, I've actually NEVER played in a game with another Frost Zealot and only twice with Tesladins, so you'll likely stand out =)
     

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