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An Introduction and Some Questions

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Chiastic, Mar 26, 2005.

  1. Chiastic

    Chiastic IncGamers Member

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    An Introduction and Some Questions

    Hi all,

    I quit playing D2 (classic) years ago and started back up recently when I ran across a copy of LoD for $5 in a bargain bin. Anyhow, I found out pretty quickly that bnet is even more of a cesspool of l33tn3ss than it was when I quit, so I decided to give SP a try.

    So far, so good, but I've gotten to the point now (lvl 78 frenzy barb) where I need to start figuring some stuff out that's been bugging me for awhile and I figure this is the place to ask. Ok, that wasn't much of an introduction, but small talk isn't really my thing. On to the questions (I apologize if they've been asked a million times before):

    1) Are +x% dmg/def sup eth items possible and if so, are the sup bonuses considered part of the items' base stats when applying the eth bonus? (I know that sup eth gear can have the +x% dur mod and that the bonus is calculated as part of the items' base before the eth durability penalty is calculated, but I've never seen any + dmg/def sup eth gear that I can remember and so I'm not really sure if it even exists.)

    2) What exactly does x% Deadly Strike mean? I know what DS itself is (and that it doesn't stack with crit strike), but I can't figure out what the percentage actually translates to in terms of real effects.

    3) For you SP PvM Frenzy Barbs out there: Is Shout worth any more than 1 point? I've maxed BO, Frenzy, my Mastery, sunk 10 points into Double Swing, and all the rest of the critical skills are good to go, so I'm trying to figure out what to do with the points I have left. Right now I'm kinda going back and forth between dumping into Shout for the huge def boost and milking the Frenzy synergies (DS and Taunt) for as much +% dmg as I can get. Which do you guys think would be the smarter thing to do?

    4) When does Hell difficulty become truly manageable and have the item drop rates been nerfed since D2C 1.07? I only ask the second question because I've been running NM WSK/Baal (full clears) for xp and gear continuously for nearly twenty levels (I'm up to /p8) and have yet to see a single piece of Ornate drop (not that I'm complaining about the Duriel's Shell, Travs and Raven Frost that I 've gotten, I'm just curious).

    5) This isn't really a gameplay question (and I hope it's appropriate to ask here. Just ignore it if it isn't), but does anybody know of a NoCD Loader specifically created for 1.10? I've been spoiled by all the new games that do full hd installs and I'd kinda like to have my one cd-rom back so I can load up some decent music for my marathon WSK sessions.

    Anyway, that's all I've got for you guys for the time being. Thanks in advance for all of your time. And please ask the Squid not to eat me or anything ;p
     
  2. shermo

    shermo IncGamers Member

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    welcome, hope you enjoy the place.

    As for your questions:

    1) The eth bonus is applied first before the %ed calculations are applied. For example: base 100 def eth armour with 15% ed. The makes it 150 base defence which is then increased by 15%. Total defence 172.5 = 172

    2) Deadly strike is a chance to do double damage. It takes your final physical damage and doubles it. Simple as that. Like you said, it doesn't work with critical strike so is less useful on barbs and zons

    If you don't have a chance for critical strike, over the course of many hits it will average out that; % deadly strike = % ed

    4) I normally start hell somewhere between 70 and 75. Hell is a lot harder than 1.09, and harder still for a melee build.
     
  3. frosty

    frosty IncGamers Member

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    For frenzy barbs, warcry is nice. Stunning them will stop them from hitting on you.

    For the loader, try google.
     
  4. Pico Dynamite

    Pico Dynamite IncGamers Member

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    Welcome to the SPF Chiastic! D2 classic is fun, I still play it sometimes when LoD gets boring ;)
     
  5. Chimaira

    Chimaira IncGamers Member

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    Welcome to the forum...

    3. I'd definitely spend more than 1 point in shout...The added defence is very nice when you don't have a shield...Also consider War Cry which is an excellent crowd control skill...Actually you should check out the barbarian forum they have an excellent frenzy guide..

    http://www.rpgforums.net/showthread.php?t=182586

    4. Hell doesn't really become manageable...1.10 is very difficult so you have to stay on your toes most of the time...more like the original Diablo where you had to break up groups into 1-2 monsters and then kill them. Of course if you get your hands on the really godly gear, it won't be to difficult, but still monsters hit very hard. Also as Shermo said lvl 70 is usually minimum level for entering Hell.

    Drop rates have been increased at least from 1.09 LOD to 1.10...I haven't really played classic but I think that the drop rates in 1.10 are very good, almost too good. Maybe you should try wearing some more magic find...also if you're only after items it might be best to run on a lower player settings since normal monsters almost never drop anything good, and the act bosses that drop all the loot, drop almost as good on lower player settings.
     
  6. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

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    Well i dont think i can add to what has been said about your questions already, so i'll just say hi, welcome to your home away from home.
    In here you will find more information about the game than any site or guide could tell you, more friendly people with the same addiction as we do, and more beer than at durf's birthday party in the EMB (see my signiture for link)
    I hope you stay and fit in nicely.
    *politely kicks Chiastic in the shins*
     
  7. Corrupted

    Corrupted IncGamers Member

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    In 1.06 Act bosses always dropped 2 magical items.
     
  8. Ragnarod

    Ragnarod DiabloII.Net Pal

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    Welcome to the forums, Chiastic

    I'm not sure you've gotten the answer you were looking for yet, I'll try to elaborate a bit on this. Basically, the percentage indicates the rate at which you can expect the Deadly Strike to kick in and double your physical damage, it works in the same way as Critical Strike in fact (you'll probably have noticed that the chance of critical strike granted by the weapon masteries increase as you put points into it, it's the same idea)

    As an example, if you had a 30% chance of deadly strike, 30% of your attacks will deal twice their regular physical damage, and the rest will deal their regular damage without any modifier. Were you to swing at a monster 100 times, 30 of your swings would deal double physical damage on average, hope it's clearer now :)

    Oh, and about ornate plates, they're no longer the end of all be they were in classic, with the addition of elite items with comparable (if not better) defense and lower requirements, but because of the Treasure Class (TC) system that regulates drops in 1.10, they are of a higher TC than several elite items, even if it's exceptional. Once you get to hell, you'll probably notice ornate plates dropping more often, don't worry about that
     
  9. Chiastic

    Chiastic IncGamers Member

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    Thanks for the replies, everyone. Sorry that I'm a little late getting back to this thread, but holiday stuff sorta got in the way of my D2-related time.

    @Ragnarod: See, that's what's confusing me about the Deadly Strike thing. I was kinda thinking along those lines until I noticed that the percentage on my Headstriker (playing untwinked can be a real pain) is well over 100% (I think 118%), so I figure that it can't be a "chance to use skill" kind of thing since it's pretty well impossible for DS to kick in 118% of the time.

    Or am I wrong? Also, is the Crit Strike 100% of the time bug still there (ie: DS is useless)?

    Anyhow, I hate to keep harassing you folks, but I've got a few more questions that've come up over the last couple of days.

    1) Is all the Realm/Ladder-only stuff enabled in SP? I've tried to figure this out on my own but some places say that it's all there and some places say that none of it is (and everything in between), so I'd kinda like to get a definitive answer on this one.

    2) Weapons. What should I be on the lookout for? Right now I'm using a Headstriker and a rare legend sword that I managed to dig up. The Headstriker is pretty pathetic but the legend sword really isn't that bad (+IAS, +ED, etc.). Either way though, I'm wondering what you guys think would be good end-game weps for a sword-mastery frenzy barb (I've managed to get up to level 83).

    3) I've been noticing lately that I kinda have to-hit problems in hell (mid to high 70s mostly). How much AR do I need to get it up into at least the high 80s (Frenzy AR is at 4996 before BC)? Or is it just a level thing?

    4) Armor: How good is +missle defense? Right now I'm looking to upgrade to either Stone or Gloom, and I basically wanna know which you folks think is better. In other words, is +30 resist all better than +300 missle defense or vice versa? Personally, I'm leaning towards Stone right now just because the Dim Vision on Gloom is going to wind up being almost more trouble than it's worth since it screws up Taunt (I have a Corpsemourn right now and the IM drives me nuts).

    5) Charms. Basically, what are the good ones to look for? I tried reading the charms guide on this site but frankly, there's so many mods that can spawn on the buggers that I really haven't been able to pin down what the good ones are (well, other than the +life skillers, heh).

    Anyway, that's it (hopefully). Thanks for all the help. Oh, and in case it's useful, here's my build as it stands:

    Level 83

    181 Str (base)

    136 Dex (base)

    183 Vit (base)

    10 Energy (base)

    20 points in Frenzy

    20 points in Battle Orders

    20 points in Sword Mastery

    7 points in War Cry (eventually 10)

    9 points in Double Attack (eventually 10)

    4 points in Shout (eventually 10)

    1 point in Taunt (Taunt gets everything that's left after I hit the targets on the above skills)

    Everything else has 1 point in it except for Grim Ward, Find Item, Increased Stamina and Increased Run/Walk Speed (all have 0, obviously ;p)
     
  10. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

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    Everything is excpet the recent runewords (check the arreat summit for a list of the new ones. Everything below 'stone' runeword is battle net only), diablo clone and annihlus charm (which is only dropped by the clone)

    I shouldnt think you'd need much AR with frenzy, but your dex is probably high enough for now. mid 70's is ok, but ideally could be higher. the best way to increase attack rating is charms or jewelry. dont waste loads more points in dex. the angelic ring and amulet set combo is recommended. loads of attack rating, MF, +1 to all skills. depends on what your wearing now though as to if its worth it.

    Missile defence (and any other +set amount def) is pretty useless in hell, since you have so much of it anyway, another 300 wont make a difference. It may be useful in normal, but beyond that, its a useless mod. 30 res all however, is a very nice mod if your in need of more.

    Well there are +tree skill grand charms, also, ones to look out for (mostly in small charm form if possible) are MF, life, res to all and high elemental things. however, it varies alot from build to build and what your other equipment is.
     
  11. tenaka

    tenaka IncGamers Member

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    Harrass aways. Thats what this forum is all about ... well that and beer.

    Everything except for the few newest runewords (made after 1.10 came out), the FE bug fix and DC/Annulis Charm are available in SP. *points to the FAQ*

    Chance to hit is based on a combo of AR and your lvl vs monster lvl. Something along the lines of (but don't qute me):
    (AR/Monster D)*(level/Monster level)*100%
    The number on your character screen does not take levels into account so it is not accurate. People have varying opinions on how much AR you need, my opinion is that if you don't think you are hitting often enough you need more, if you do think you are hitting enough then you have plenty :thumbsup:

    Resists are definitly better, unless you have maxed resists already. IMO your defense would have to go up a few thousand to be worth giving up resists.

    Yea its informative, but lengthy eh? For a frenzybarb I'd look for life, resists, possibly AR, skillers, MF and perhaps elemental damage depending on weapon. For meleeers I always like to have at least one cold damage sc even when using a HF merc.
     
  12. NSXdreamer

    NSXdreamer IncGamers Member

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    * I don't think def is useful on frenzy barb that much as you'll be on the move all the time, same goes for warcry.
    * 100% CS bug is fixed. Over 100% chance still means 100% chance of it happening.
    * as for ladder only stuff, yes, to some degree. We don't have the newly activated runewords (bnet only).
    * Headstriker is nice, especially if you upgrade it to conquest sword, however the range 1 on it is a pity.
    * Level is important in calculate to hit chance, but your AR is a bit low. I like to have around 10k for melee. Angelic amulet/ring combo is quite nice for large AR boost.
    * +def against missile is kinda useless, would probably bump your get hit chance down 1% if you do the math. I'd dfinately choose 30 more resist.
    * seeing that you are melee, probably +ar charm and +dmg charm. you can get up to 125 ar on a grand charm.
    * There are at least two no-cd loader that I know of work with 1.10, but I can't say it here or I'd get smacked by the mods. If you just don't want it to access CD during gameplay, copy any MPQ files that are not present in your d2 folder but are present on your LOD CD into d2 folder.
     
  13. Chiastic

    Chiastic IncGamers Member

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    Sorry to dredge this thread up again, but I've come up with a couple more questions for you folks.

    About mods on weapons, are certain effects like IAS and +AR not global (don't affect both weapons if you're dual-wielding, unlike the same mods on armor and jewelry)? I'm pretty sure that they aren't from personal experience, but I just want to make sure I'm not retarded. Anyway, if I'm right, does the same thing apply to other mods like CB and DS?

    About AR itself, how is bonus AR from items calculated? I guess what I'm trying to figure out is why the AR from +% AR items (Arreat's/Atma's Scarab, etc.) doesn't seem to get the bonuses from Frenzy/Mastery, nor does the actual bonus they DO give seem to be equal to the given percentage the items supposedly add. Maybe the bonus is calculated from your base AR and then added onto your total after the items/skills bonus has already been applied?

    Lastly, on a sorta unrelated ATMA note, is the drop calc for act bosses accurate? I ran Hell Meph about a zillion times on both p1 and p3 and didn't really notice any difference in the drop frequency (I averaged between 4 and 5 drops a run on both settings, including pots/scrolls/gold).

    Anyway, thanks for all your time (again).

    Chi
     
  14. HBeachBabe

    HBeachBabe IncGamers Member

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    the charm guide condensed:
    here are the charms to actively look for/keep

    small: Fine (but only the better ones)
    Serpents - +mana, useful for spellcasters
    Shimmering, Sapphire, Ruby, Amber, Emerald - res all, and the 10/11% res to single elements
    Boreal, Smoking, Arcing, Toxic- the 2nd highest elemental damage ones
    Hibernal, Flaming, Shocking, Pestilent- highest elemental damage ones, Hell Baal/Diablo only for the most part
    of good luck, of life - magic find & life, always useful

    large: (hibernal, flaming, shocking, pestilent, steel, sharp) all nice but not critical. the only real large charms to be on the look out for are any with +4/5 str or dex

    grand: stalwart (over 60 def), steel (over 100 AR), sharp, shimmering (13+), all +1 to a skill tree
     
  15. Chiastic

    Chiastic IncGamers Member

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    Thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for =)

    On to other things, to actually give an example for my AR question in my last post (since I don't think I was clear at all), I've got a Visionary Armet I found the other day (that I stashed since it's the only time I've ever seen that prefix) that gives an 87% AR bonus. Without a helm, my Frenzy Barb clocks in at 11299 AR. With the Vis helm, he bounces up to 13482. If you do the math quick (and even if you don't), you'll see that the 2183 AR bonus it gives is nowhere near 87% of the normal 11299 (it's about 19.3% if you're curious).

    Not that I'm complaining. AR is AR, but I am kinda curious what the deal is there.

    EDIT: Ok, I've partially figured it out after some testing. The +% AR mod is calculated from your base AR (naked, normal attack) plus whatever +AR items you have. It seems to completely ignore the AR bonuses from skills (possibly other +% AR items as well?). Which kinda sucks but oh well =)
     
  16. Hrus

    Hrus IncGamers Member

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    I think that AR is calculated this way: (total plain AR from DEX and items) * (100+%AR from items + %AR from skills)/100. Try to calculate if this is true.

    If you have 2 weapons the IAS, CB, DS, OW, AR, leech... are applied only from the weapon you are actually swinging with. Bonuses not connected with attacking (+STR,+skills,+mana,+resistances) are applied from both weapons.

    AFAIK Atma is accurate. And try to do more runs on P1/P3. On P3 it's almost allways 6 items (including gold piles and potions), on P1 it's more like 5 items, sometimes only 4 from Meph.

    And the charms: I keep the charms with another mods as Faster-run/walk, faster hit recovery, +STR/DEX, if they have some other affix.

    EDIT: I have found the right to hit formula:
    100 * AR / (AR + DR) * 2 * alvl / (alvl + dlvl)
    AR = Attack Rating; alvl = Level of Attacker; dlvl = Level of Defender; DR = Defense Rating
    Note: Attacks will never have less than 5% chance to hit nor more than 95% chance to hit.
     
  17. HBeachBabe

    HBeachBabe IncGamers Member

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    also, to return to the question of Critical Strike/Deadly Strike. While they don't stack per se, it still helps to have lots of both. Basically, each is checked independently but damage will only be doubled once even if both are triggered, so 50% DS and 50% CS don't equal 100% chance of double damage, but neither does it mean only 50%. The formula for your true chance to do double damage is DS%+(CS%*(1-DS%)). So if both are at 50% you get: .5+(.5*(1-.5))=.5+(.5*.5))=.5+.25=75% chance of doing double damage

    Think of Crit Strike as a backup for DS - that all failed DSes still have a chance at Crit Striking.
     
  18. BFD

    BFD IncGamers Member

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    Welcome aboard.
     
  19. batuchka

    batuchka IncGamers Member

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    Hiya mate! Found the 'calling' strong and returned eh hehe. Hmm i am not sure what mastery you choose but since u play SP then these axes would be really sweet yet affordable for a frenzy barb:

    1) 'Crescent Moon' Berserker Axe
    Static/ias/open wounds/ITD for shael-um-tir!

    2) Upgraded Butcher's Pupil Small Crescent
    Deadly Strike/Indestrctible/ias/open wounds - mmm

    Also you might consider putting a point in 'Find Item' as you coud hork high lvl monsters/areas in Hell like Pindleskin and The Pit at Tamoe Highlands @@. Also how do you deal with PIs? Perhaps since u have high dex so %blocking is kindda decent then go with a point in Berserk and having a nice shield that has high blocking/resists? A 2 p-diamonded moser's round shield would be a cheap yet effective choice if you can't find a Stormshield :D Oh if you really do not ant to put a point into it consider the 'Passion' runeword which i find excellent for my new non-barb melee chars (pallys/druids/ect) to deal with PIs on switch with its +1 Berserk :p Hope my suggestions were somewhat useful to you and happy playing!
     
  20. Chiastic

    Chiastic IncGamers Member

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    Thanks for the advice, but sadly I went with sword mastery so the axes are out. I'm pretty sure that Crescent works in swords too though, so I'll look into it (as soon as I work up the ambition to run Countess a zillion times for the stupid Um).

    Affordability of items isn't really an issue for me at this point since I've run Hell Meph at least a good five thousand times over the last month and a half or so. You know you've done that run too many times when you've gotten four SoJs from the bugger.

    Anyway, I never bothered putting a point into IF. When I feel like horking, I just stick a couple of Heart Carvers on switch and let +skills do the rest. As for PIs, I just straight-up tank 'em and let the elemental/magic damage on my Lightsabres and the three Toxic sc's I've found do the dirty work. I used to do the zerk thing with a shael'd Flamebellow/Stormshield on switch but it was more trouble than it was worth (and even then I ditched the SS early on because I wanted the extra damage from using the Flamebellow 2-handed and because blocklock sucks). The only time I use zerk anymore is for dealing with Ob Knights. Oh, I also tried carrying around a ctc/charged Amp Damage ammy and switching to it whenever I came across PI critters since Amp will break the immunity for most of them, but that was even more of a hassle than zerk (even though it actually worked surprisingly well).
     

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