Advice on a kicker.

bigD72

Diabloii.Net Member
Advice on a kicker.

She's mainly being built for the purpose of Clone killing and Uber Killing.

I skimmed over this fairly specific guide.

As I've never played a kicker before nor killed/seen an Uber, I was wondering if some of you in the know would care to enlighten me with tips, tatics, and general advice?

I'm still in the very early prelim stages of planning this one as I'm just now reaching the finishing of my sorc seen in another thread, and I'll be needing to build up keys and wealth again for a week or so before proceeding with this one.
 

tuxor

Diabloii.Net Member
i've read that guide before, last ladder i got really pumped to make it then realized i needed like 10 more HRs for it to be decent. yeah, if you're making it for clone/uber killing, just make sure you have good CB, i'm pretty sure it lists last wish in there as the best weapon, which is true, it's sweet on a kicker.
 

bigD72

Diabloii.Net Member
I figure I'll max DT, Fade, Venom, and Master.

Granted that max fade will be a bit useless as far as the resis go, but the hard points for the dr is nice and it's just icing on the cake for getting stacked resis.

I really don't think I'll have the opportunity to build something as nasty as with all those high runewords, but I think a Chains of Honor, Guillame's, Goreriders, and a few other cheaper items would be good enough.
 

Full_Circle

Diabloii.Net Member
Well, first of all, the build isn't going to be as good as a smiter at doing ubers, no matter what you do.

Additional comments on the build (Specifically for Uber-Running):

1) No point in maxing fade if you're using Last Wish. When you're running ubers, losing a bunch of levels of Fade when it triggers could get you killed, so I'd say 1 pt in Fade.

2) No point in running Guillaume's when you've already got 60-70 CB from Last Wish and 15% from Gores. Kiras will serve you better, giving you FHR, CBF, and some hawt resists.

3) Switch Weapon MUST BE DEMONLIMB. The Ubers are very hard to hit. You need all the AR you can get.

4) Your character should be at LEAST 85 before attempting Ubers. As mentioned, they are very hard to hit, and the difference between their level and yours makes up for a lot of this.

5) For running Ubers with a Non-Smiter, there's no such thing as a budget build. DClone, yes. Ubers, no. If you want a cheap build that can run Ubers, let me know, and I'll post it. Pbcoco built it this season. Works like a charm.

So anyway... what I'd do for gear basically:

Last Wish PB
Stormshield (Um)
Chains of Honor
Kiras (Um) --> Switch to Guillaumes for Non-Ubers
Laying of Hands
Verdungos
Gore Rider
Maras (or Metalgrid)
Raven Frost
Dwarf Star

Something like that...

edit: oh yeah, and don't forget to get outside BO.
 

Aldragon

Diabloii.Net Member
Full_Circle said:
Well, first of all, the build isn't going to be as good as a smiter at doing ubers, no matter what you do.

Additional comments on the build (Specifically for Uber-Running):

1) No point in maxing fade if you're using Last Wish. When you're running ubers, losing a bunch of levels of Fade when it triggers could get you killed, so I'd say 1 pt in Fade.

2) No point in running Guillaume's when you've already got 60-70 CB from Last Wish and 15% from Gores. Kiras will serve you better, giving you FHR, CBF, and some hawt resists.

3) Switch Weapon MUST BE DEMONLIMB. The Ubers are very hard to hit. You need all the AR you can get.

4) Your character should be at LEAST 85 before attempting Ubers. As mentioned, they are very hard to hit, and the difference between their level and yours makes up for a lot of this.

5) For running Ubers with a Non-Smiter, there's no such thing as a budget build. DClone, yes. Ubers, no. If you want a cheap build that can run Ubers, let me know, and I'll post it. Pbcoco built it this season. Works like a charm.

So anyway... what I'd do for gear basically:

Last Wish PB
Stormshield (Um)
Chains of Honor
Kiras (Um) --> Switch to Guillaumes for Non-Ubers
Laying of Hands
Verdungos
Gore Rider
Maras (or Metalgrid)
Raven Frost
Dwarf Star

Something like that...

edit: oh yeah, and don't forget to get outside BO.
Hmm i´d change loh for draculs and plz try a silence pb for wep and guillaumes.
Aldragon
 

LuckyDwarf

Diabloii.Net Member

bigD72

Diabloii.Net Member
bigD72 said:
I figure I'll max DT, Fade, Venom, and Master.

Granted that max fade will be a bit useless as far as the resis go, but the hard points for the dr is nice and it's just icing on the cake for getting stacked resis.

I really don't think I'll have the opportunity to build something as nasty as with all those high runewords, but I think a Chains of Honor, Guillame's, Goreriders, and a few other cheaper items would be good enough.
To comment to all those assuming I'll be using last wish. Like I said I skimmed over it, I know all about the fade and what not. I'll probably be using something silly like a crushflange mace or idk yet.
 

bigD72

Diabloii.Net Member
I just happen to have a chains of honor to my avaliability, but not a last wish. :rolleyes:

However, I have a second question after doing some more research. Reading that guide made it seem like a Kicker is the absolute best/fastest for uber and clone killing.

Could someone possibly make a tidy little post about why a Smiter would be better?
 

bigD72

Diabloii.Net Member
So most of the time the Smiter would be making use of Salvation?

I guess that's a pretty good point. 1 Point and ample +skills would put it around or over 100 resis.
 

Dix

Diabloii.Net Member
Thats what I do, I tried using fana but the increase in kill speed was 30 secs only, so I kill meph with salvation then switch to fana for the rest. It saves using a lot of resis charms, and allows cb to be easily stacked. A cheap setup that works well is:
Guillaume's (35 cb)
Duress (15 cb) (CoH is nice but I found I didn't need the resis)
Metalgrid
Ravenfrost
Dwarfstar or any rare
HOZ
Grief (nice if you can afford it)
TGods
Gores (15 cb)
Draculs (needed)
Remember this is a zealot build, only 1 point in smite is required.
I hope this helps :)
 

Full_Circle

Diabloii.Net Member
Plus, if necessary, a Smiter can use Fade (treachery/last wish), and a Smiter can also use a Paladin Shield Sanctuary. Generally, a Smiter runs Salvation until Mephisto is dead, then switches to Fanaticism.

Really, though, any character can get stacked resists if you really put the effort into it. It's the auto-hit that makes Smiters ideal. Smite also ignores block%, which the ubers have lots of, so even with perfect AR at level 99, a Kicker won't hit nearly as often as a Smiter at level 75.
 

Dix

Diabloii.Net Member
It almost seems that blizz forgot the stats of smite when designing uber tris...
 

HCKull

Diabloii.Net Member
bigD72 said:
Could someone possibly make a tidy little post about why a Smiter would be better?

In order to do Ubers you need to deal with the following:

1) Meph's lvl 23 conviction which does -135 or so to ur resists.

2) Hords of minions with immunes to every type of elemental damage, or physical damage and some that are immune to 4 of the 5.

3) Kill the big tough bosses with like 65,000 life or more, huge defense and dish out lots of physical and elemental damage.

4) Repairing your life as you take lots of damage.

The toughest is Meph's conviction because you recieve lots of elemental damage from him and his minions while fighting him. You need like 175+135 resists to survive by boosting resists. The other way is to override his conviction with a higher level of convicition which only pallys can do. Conviction will lower the bad guys resists and defenses by a huge amount.

You need to deliver lots of physical and elemental damage to take out the minions. IMHO, the best way to do this is with pally using zeal, grief phase blade, guill. face helm, gorerider boots, and high lords wrath amu. A sin should use dragon talon+venom with upped gorerider boots and guill. face helm, gorerider boots, and high lords wrath amu. This will be roughly equ to what a pally can do.

To take down the bosses you need to hit them, and to deliver crush blow to rapidly chop their huge life down. Pallys use smite to hit the big bosses because it always hits. A sin will have to settle for ignore target defense from their equipment and the large AR from dragon talon and other equip. This wont be as good as a smite though.

While you are taking on these guys you need to have someway of leaching live in order to survive all of the damage you take. Normal leach does not work for smite. Smiters have to use life tap from their equipment (last wish/exile/dracs). Life tap is really great because it give 1/2 the damage you inflict back to your life. A sin should be able to wear dracs and get a high level of life leach. You can get life tap from a wand, but it is not really a good solution for the ubers.

The main problem you will have is surviving Meph and his conviction. Here is how you could do that:

60 Fade
85 Um'd Kiras
65 COH
30 Maras

100 dual Jade Talons
or
70 sancturary shield
75 salvation weapon

Depending on fade is a problem. You have to be very careful not to let it end while you are engaged in combat.
 

PhatTrumpet

Diabloii.Net Member
Just a couple comments in response to the above:

1. It's lvl 20 Conviction, i.e. -125%.

2. You don't need to take out any minions; there are plenty of ways to simply negate them. My favorite is using Azurewrath as my main weapon. The Sanctuary aura repels undead for a sizeable radius, and the only monsters down there that aren't undead are the Balrogs. (Note that 'Lawbringer' actually grants a higher lvl Sanc, but the other mods are less desirable.) You can also simply have the BO Barb come down and cast Howl periodically. I believe the Necro curse Terror also works (either from a Necro friend or from wand charges), but I've never actually tried it.

3. The Sin actually can't rely on ITD; it doesn't work on bosses.
 
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