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Abu Ghraib's lesson unlearned

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by llad12, Jun 3, 2005.

  1. llad12

    llad12 IncGamers Member

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    Abu Ghraib's lesson unlearned

    The Weekly Guardian

    Love him or hate him: Sy Hersh is one helluva investigative journalist ...

    Rip 'em a new one Sy ... :thumbsup:
     
  2. Suicidal Zebra

    Suicidal Zebra IncGamers Member

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  3. llad12

    llad12 IncGamers Member

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    If nothing else, America's image in the world is badly tarnished. Heads should have rolled on this scandal. Instead, a year and 10 investigations later, the men who should have been held ultimately responsible were promoted or let off scot free.

    So go ahead, sweep it under the rug, throw it out with the trash, ignore it, who cares? Right? It's old news, it's no longer important enough to capture your attention.

    Three more US soldiers died today in Iraq ... but that doesn't make much news either. It's nothing new. It's not as important as a Jackson sex scandal or what's on TV tonight.

    Have a good day.
     
  4. Suicidal Zebra

    Suicidal Zebra IncGamers Member

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    Yup, you betch'ya. I've got better things to worry about than the in's and outs of the American Militaries disciplinary system and when it comes down to it I trust them to get the job done properly in the fullness of time.

    Were I:

    1) Iraqi
    2) American
    3) A member of the US Armed Forces or
    4) A paid up member of AI.

    I may be more interested. But as things stand there are certain things in the political arena that I find both far more interesting and would have a greater impact on my own life and the life of those in other nations than the actions of a load of US contractors and a blip in military oversight.

    The actions perpetrated in Abu Ghraib were awful. They are however only factor relating to the success or failure of the mission in Iraq, and it is about time those other factors had the limelight.
     
  5. axeil

    axeil IncGamers Member

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    Llad I applaud your effort but you know that no one here will listen because God forbid anyone contradict the Premier...I mean President.

    I must admire Bush and his cronies for brainwashing all of us so well though.
     
  6. Ranger14

    Ranger14 IncGamers Member

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    *sigh* I am glad I have better things to do with my time than to find every article about what is wrong with our military and what is going on in Iraq. Why don't you post articles about the insurgents using civilians as shields and decoys and how they have killed our civilian and military personnel execution style? You always seem to want to make it sound like we are the bad guys. I just don't get it. I was recently reading an article on how innocent civilians are used in tactics against our troops by the insurgents...then we hear about how many civilians are killed by our troops...hmmm...I wonder why. No we aren't perfect, but I doubt any country's military is.

    Let's hear some about how our troops are handling these situations the best they can.

    http://www.voanews.com/english/IraqInsurgentTactics.cfm
     
  7. onionfarm

    onionfarm IncGamers Member

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    Their atrocities don't justify our atrocities.

    Off-topic: Suicide, I thought you had left or something? Anyway, good to see you posting again.
     
  8. Ranger14

    Ranger14 IncGamers Member

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    I never said they did. Then again, it is hard to judge how somoene acts when they have an insurgent prisoner and the day before their comrade was killed or they saw an innocent civilian killed by a car bomber. Tough to judge what they are going through over there. It doesn't make it right, but I certainly factor in more than what we see on the surface.

    We have some cases of wrong-doing and it is sad, but why focus on that? Let's look at what our military is dealing with and support them. At least the few atrocities that happen from our side aren't part of our normal strategy and status quo. The same can't be said for the other side.
     
  9. jimmyboy

    jimmyboy IncGamers Member

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    What's a US contractor?
     
  10. jimmyboy

    jimmyboy IncGamers Member

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    We focus on it, because the few bad apples will ruin the legacy of the rest if we refuse to correct it. When it's all and done, the world will remember US soldiers as torturers rather than liberators regardless of the good we may bring to Iraq.

    Whether it's few atrocities or not, we'll never know since the detainees are denied POW status. Guantalamo is still off limits. Prisoners are now transfered to 3rd world nations for torture to circumvent the Geneva convention and US laws. And new prisoners are made "ghosts." They have no record of ever existing and so their deaths are never recorded.
     
  11. Suicidal Zebra

    Suicidal Zebra IncGamers Member

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    Sorry, I was thinking of something else when I wrote 'contractors'. I meant Reservists.
     
  12. jimmyboy

    jimmyboy IncGamers Member

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    He he he.

    And all along I thought you were about to give us a scoop of some unreported actions by US mercenaries.

    You big teaser.
     
  13. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    Why in the world would you do something like that, Ranger? Don't tell me you actually think we're doing something beneficial to Iraq? Or that our military is in any way a force for doing good in the world? BUSH LIED CHILDREN DIED! Words to live by, and don't forget it!

    I still think it interesting that to find any coverage of this strange "other side" of which you speak. I think you've been going to far too many of those Evil Conservative web sites, and buying the lies they furnish on DVD. You should just sit back and let the soothing information from the NYT and NBC caress your brain.
     
  14. DaviddeJong

    DaviddeJong IncGamers Member

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  15. skihard

    skihard Banned

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    ain't that the truth?!?!?
     
  16. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    David, I keep forgetting that this board has many foreign readers - yes, it is complete sarcasm. I often use 'tags' like [/sarcasm]...
    I have spent over 1/2 my life assorted types of U.S. Gov't service, among which are 5 years as a U.S. Army officer on active duty, during which I served as an Infantry platoon leader in the first Gulf War. Ill and I feud very frequently on this sort of topic.

    EDIT - regarding deceased equines, couldn't agree more.
     
  17. DaviddeJong

    DaviddeJong IncGamers Member

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    I thought so......

    Just as confusing as the last time you were talking about the side-effects some Gulf-war-veterans were still experiencing from whatever kind of chemicals they used there (I thought you even mentioned "agent-orange") ..... I still don't know if you were saying that some of the soldiers that fought there have had these symptoms, (that I would only associate with Vietnam-veterans) or that you were just kidding.....

    David.
     
  18. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    Actually, I wasn't kidding, but you've got to realize that I tend towards using gallows humor as well. I suffered from severe symptoms of the so-called "Gulf War Syndrome", but only for a fairly limited amount of time. I tend to ascribe these to Pyrostigmine Bromide pills issued by the Army (without legal authorization and testing, of course), exposure to the oil fires everyone saw on the news, and being downwind from the dentonation of Saddam's (supposedly non-existent) WMD stockpiles.

    After I went to the VA hospital to be logged, evaluated, and put on the permanent record, the form letter I recieved claimed that I was not suffering from Agent Orange due to my tour in Vietnam. I would have had to be around 10 years old to have been exposed in 'Nam.
     
  19. Darnoc

    Darnoc IncGamers Member

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    Interesting that guantanimo came up; amnesty just released a report about all this. I found an atricle today though that I found interesting regarding terrorist rules when imprisoned and how to undermine the imprisoning nation. It puts a bit of perspective on things over there, and shows little is what it seems nowadays..

    http://www.techcentralstation.com/060305B.html
     
  20. DaviddeJong

    DaviddeJong IncGamers Member

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    Aah, yeah, that was the part I remembered.... but damn:

    So ****ed up that your own army made you take those pills you got sick from!!!

    David.
     

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