A Dragon Claw Assassin

[Speedwrath]

A Dragon Claw Assassin

OK what do you guys think about this build:

Dragon Claw - 20 points
Tiger Strike - 20 points
Cobra Strike - 1 point
Claw Mastery - 20 points
Weapon Block - 10 points
Burst of Speed - 10 points
Mind Blast - 1 point

Remaining Points go to maxing Shadow Master.

With Natalya's Set and a Bartuc's Cutthroat on the other hand, how much damage do you think she'll be doing with Tiger Strike?

 

[Warrior of Light]

IMHO it is much better not to interrupt DC with TS or CS hits, — just DC all the way without charges.

Currently I’m making following Sin:

20 CM, 20 Venom, 20 Master after I’ll finish I’ll add 20 DC.

My level 52 untwinked HC Sin easily kill /players8 Baal in normal difficulty just with normal attack with level 24 venom and level 10 Shadow.

 

[Speedwrath]

But Tiger Strike will be boosting the damage by TONS, won't it? Also, Cobra Strike will be needed for like, desperate life leech or something.

And is level 20 Venom really worth it? I mean, if it is, I might not get any Shadows and work on maxing Venom. I'd have it at around level 10 by level 80, 15 if I only put 5 in Weapon Block.

 

[Origin]

But Tiger Strike will be boosting the damage by TONS, won't it? Also, Cobra Strike will be needed for like, desperate life leech or something.

And is level 20 Venom really worth it? I mean, if it is, I might not get any Shadows and work on maxing Venom. I'd have it at around level 10 by level 80, 15 if I only put 5 in Weapon Block.

keep in mind that to use tiger strike you have to make 3 "normal" hits first with no ED and relatively low AR and attack speed. in the end its not that huge of a damage boost as it seems. using only dc you get ED at every hit, tons more AR, better attack speed (i believe) and you save 20 skill points. tiger strike will total more damage all in all but the question is if the difference is big enough to warrant 20 skill points that could be put in shadow warrior/master or venom?

 

[BIGeyedBUG]

keep in mind that to use tiger strike you have to make 3 "normal" hits first with no ED and relatively low AR and attack speed. in the end its not that huge of a damage boost as it seems. using only dc you get ED at every hit, tons more AR, better attack speed (i believe) and you save 20 skill points. tiger strike will total more damage all in all but the question is if the difference is big enough to warrant 20 skill points that could be put in shadow warrior/master or venom?

Exactly.

Mathematically, the total damage over time gain by going 3TS/DC vs. DC is fairly small--around 20% And that's in an ideal situation. In actual game play, people overcharge, undercharge, and lose charges, so the real gain would be less.

And is level 20 Venom really worth it?

I've found maxed Venom to be very disappointing past NM in PvM. Maybe with +poison damage and/or -res gear it'd be different, but I haven't had the opportunity to try that.

You will want some sort of immune solution though. The first one on my list would be Death Sentry. A source of Amp or Decrep would be ideal.

 

[Speedwrath]

Do you guys have any idea of the damage I would be doing, though? With Bartuc's and Natalya's Mark, at slvl 26 Dragon Claw with 20 Claw Mastery?

 

[Dawnmaster]

I've found maxed Venom to be very disappointing past NM in PvM. Maybe with +poison damage and/or -res gear it'd be different, but I haven't had the opportunity to try that.

You will want some sort of immune solution though. The first one on my list would be Death Sentry. A source of Amp or Decrep would be ideal.

Well with the correct items to boost your poison damage, you'd be suprised how high it can get. Trangouls give 25% more poison damage. BUT that's for prebuff AND while dealing damage with it, so actually it isn't 25% but a total of 56% extra poison damage. Each facet can give 5% (or actually 10%) and bramble can give 25-50% which is infact 56-125%)

At lvl20 you'll deal a poison damage (over 0.4 seconds!) of 425-445
With +20 all skills (pretty easy to obtain) you'll have 1075-1095
Add a trangoul gloves (very cheap to get) and you deal 1679-1710

So 1679-1710 poison damage over 0.4 seconds (keep in mind that in pvm monsters don't have poison length reduced, only res and for pvp, there's a hell penalty of 100% length added before you can reduce it)

If you're filthy rich, you can even add a perfect bramble and lets say, 5 poison facets.

So 1075-1095 +100% (prebuff) = 2150-2190 +100% (total damage dealing) = 4300-4380 poison damage over 0.4 seconds without any synergies.

I'd say this skills is worth investing in, espescially since it can't be absorbed!

 

[Nazdakka]

Exactly.

Mathematically, the total damage over time gain by going 3TS/DC vs. DC is fairly small--around 20% And that's in an ideal situation. In actual game play, people overcharge, undercharge, and lose charges, so the real gain would be less.

Does that make TS not worth the effort for other builds? I know it's a different build, but I was thinking of making a C/C Nat's Assassin looking something like this:

20 TS
1 DC
20 Blades of Ice
20 Pheonix Strike
Rest in Shadow Tree

(BoI because I just know I'll get annoyed at mis-charging my PS)

Does TS suffer from the same problem in this build too?

 

[BIGeyedBUG]

Do you guys have any idea of the damage I would be doing, though? With Bartuc's and Natalya's Mark, at slvl 26 Dragon Claw with 20 Claw Mastery?

It depends on a lot of other factors. The best damage calc I know of is this one: http://dpw.bounceme.net/damage_calc.html

 

[BIGeyedBUG]

Does that make TS not worth the effort for other builds?

Not necessarily. For instance, an aspiring phys damage martial artist has little choice but to use TS if she's using anything other than two claws. Even the c/cer will do much better with TS if only her primary claw has great mods.

A lot of the real answer depends on how efficient you are charging up. That's not just a matter of skill (since TS doesn't take much) but also of factors like your CtH, sturdiness, connection, and tactics.

I was thinking of making a C/C Nat's Assassin looking something like this:

20 TS
1 DC
20 Blades of Ice
20 Pheonix Strike
Rest in Shadow Tree

(BoI because I just know I'll get annoyed at mis-charging my PS)

Well, I've used the Max TS/ 1 point DC release myself, and I like it. Not because it was terribly efficient, but because I find using exclusive DC to be monotonous...and hard on the ears.

A couple of things though. In 1.10+ it's sort of hard to justify dumping points in Tiger Strike when you've already got 20 points of synergy comitted for another elemental chargeup. I'm not saying it can't be a good approach, only that from a skills standpoint, Tiger Strike does relatively little to build on an elemental chargeup investment.

Also, I love BoI but it's not the most powerful skill in the world. It should be mentioned as well that Phoenix3 is the *least* difficult Phoenix charge to release, and overall more useful for freeze than BoI. BoI is tons better for concentrated damage though. My BoI Assassins tend to use BoI for cold damage and Phoenix3 for freeze except in specific circumstances like confined areas. In situations like the Maggot Lair, BoI really shines.