A Disturbing Story Becomes Even More ****ed Up

PlagueBearer

Diabloii.Net Member
WildBerry said:
Well, duh.

You obviously haven't hung around a lot with people who have cognitive disorders - i.e. are "bat-****" crazy. It might be pretty difficult, and they might very well act unexpected, but they, as well as any people, have or at least themselves believe that they have reasons for what they're doing. It's whether we can relate to these reasons what their insanity calls to question.

Now, if anyone isn't interested in going where the fence is it at it's lowest... any guesses on the reason?
My point is, with this kind of person it could be anything. Her cats might have told her to do it. God may have given her a revelation. She might have thought that killing children is the way people get pregant. She might have written herself a note, forgotten it, and misinterpreted "buy milk" to be code for "Kill your neighbor and her children."

Now, the article says she claimed that the fetus was her baby which she gave birth to stillborn. If she had an abortion then wanted to cover it up in a totally bat-**** crazy kind of way, then this makes some kind of sense. However, it doesnt explain the other children she stuffed into the washer. For those we must simply assume she is bat-**** crazy.
 

caddad

Diabloii.Net Member
dondrei said:
I'm sure we can all agree that that statement was grossly insensitive and opportunistic regardless of our religious convictions or otherwise.
I'd never agree to that. The only insensitivity I see is you being so blindingly against any organized religion you can't accept these people dealing with this in a way that is beneficial to them.

If it helps even one person heal it's worthwhile for a community to get together to do so.

-D2netDad
 

PatMaGroin

Diabloii.Net Member
D2netDad said:
I'd never agree to that. The only insensitivity I see is you being so blindingly against any organized religion you can't accept these people dealing with this in a way that is beneficial to them.

If it helps even one person heal it's worthwhile for a community to get together to do so.

-D2netDad
I agree.

It's no different from when, say, a member of a sports team dies, and the coach says that hopefully the team can come together as they get through it.
 

Bortaz

Banned
D2netDad said:
I'd never agree to that. The only insensitivity I see is you being so blindingly against any organized religion you can't accept these people dealing with this in a way that is beneficial to them.

If it helps even one person heal it's worthwhile for a community to get together to do so.

-D2netDad

Well said, Dad.
 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
Stoutwood said:
Crap, Wikipedia can't even help me on this? Explain the joke to us non-Australians please.
Well, PFS almost had it. Napisan (washing powder stain remover) ran a series of adverts where they sent people around to people's houses with a bottle of Napisan and gave them the Napisan challenge - to use it with one load of washing and a competitor with another and then compare the results.

I think they were staged.

D2netDad said:
I'd never agree to that. The only insensitivity I see is you being so blindingly against any organized religion you can't accept these people dealing with this in a way that is beneficial to them.

If it helps even one person heal it's worthwhile for a community to get together to do so.

-D2netDad
I object to this wording: "This is an opportunity for people to turn to God". Ooh, quick, while they're traumatised, let's convert them to our religion! Predatory, ghoulish and insensitive.

And this: "Who else can explain things like this?". How does God explain things like this?

"Hey, God; why do bad things happen to good people?"

"Because shut up, that's why."

I have nothing against people turning to their religion to comfort them if they choose to do so, that's their affair. But I strongly object to people using their grief to indoctrinate them in this opportunistic way - like I said, that person was a vulture.
 

SaroDarksbane

Diabloii.Net Site Pal
dondrei said:
I object to this wording: "This is an opportunity for people to turn to God". Ooh, quick, while they're traumatised, let's convert them to our religion! Predatory, ghoulish and insensitive.

And this: "Who else can explain things like this?". How does God explain things like this?

"Hey, God; why do bad things happen to good people?"

"Because shut up, that's why."

I have nothing against people turning to their religion to comfort them if they choose to do so, that's their affair. But I strongly object to people using their grief to indoctrinate them in this opportunistic way - like I said, that person was a vulture.
Bleh.

So a reporter went to a church that people were flocking to in the wake of such a horrible crime, and they asked him why, and he said it was because they were looking for an explanation and it was an opportunity to turn to God. Big deal.

If he had stood up on a podium in the public square and started shouting that people should come to his church, then you'd be right, but I see no need to demonize a man that was asked a question by the press and answered it.
 
Turning to God does not mean going out a recruiting the traumatized. It means people should look to God to help get through the pain. I can turn to God and I believe 24/7/365.

Donny, you have some vendetta against religion and what you do is no worse than that person(who as you've been told was at a church. . .) is doing.
 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
SaroDarksbane said:
Bleh.

So a reporter went to a church that people were flocking to in the wake of such a horrible crime, and they asked him why, and he said it was because they were looking for an explanation and it was an opportunity to turn to God. Big deal.

If he had stood up on a podium in the public square and started shouting that people should come to his church, then you'd be right, but I see no need to demonize a man that was asked a question by the press and answered it.
I'm not saying they're proselytising, I object to the fact that this person said that this tragic and disgusting event was an opportunity to convert people. Specifically convert people, not comfort them.

I mean, how would you feel if a bunch of soldiers were killed in Iraq and some anti-war people said "this is a great opportunity to bring people around to our point of view"?

{KOW}Spazed said:
Turning to God does not mean going out a recruiting the traumatized. It means people should look to God to help get through the pain. I can turn to God and I believe 24/7/365.
They aren't talking about existing Christians turning to God, she said specifically that it was an opportunity to convert people who weren't. If that's not what she meant then she should've chosen her words better.

What would you say if someone said "This is a great opportunity to turn people to atheism. How else can you explain something like this? Clearly there is no God."?

I know, you'd say they had a vendetta against religion...

{KOW}Spazed said:
Donny, you have some vendetta against religion and what you do is no worse than that person(who as you've been told was at a church. . .) is doing.
I object to the way some religious people and organisations choose to operate.
 

PatMaGroin

Diabloii.Net Member
dondrei said:
I'm not saying they're proselytising, I object to the fact that this person said that this tragic and disgusting event was an opportunity to convert people. Specifically convert people, not comfort them.

They aren't talking about existing Christians turning to God, she said specifically that it was an opportunity to convert people who weren't. If that's not what she meant then she should've chosen her words better.
I'm curious, where does it 'specifically' say anything about converting anyone?

From the article:
On Sunday, the community turned to prayer to understand the slayings at a service for the slain family.

"This is an opportunity for people to turn to God," said Debra Kenton, a member of the New Life Community Church.
Saying that it's a good time to 'turn to God' doesn't necessarilly mean converting people. If you're having problems in your personal life and need someone to talk to, you might 'turn to your best friend.' This does not mean you randomly befriend someone in light of the circumstances, but you go to this person you already know, to either get advice or help in the coping process.

Stop trying to villify people because they practice organized religion. You made something out of the most mundane, ordinary thing. Just admit that you misinterpreted what she said and let it go.
 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
PatMaGroin said:
I'm curious, where does it 'specifically' say anything about converting anyone?

From the article:

Saying that it's a good time to 'turn to God' doesn't necessarilly mean converting people. If you're having problems in your personal life and need someone to talk to, you might 'turn to your best friend.' This does not mean you randomly befriend someone in light of the circumstances, but you go to this person you already know, to either get advice or help in the coping process.
If that's what she meant, then it's okay.
 

SalivaMonster

Diabloii.Net Member
There is no point in arguing further because....

What I think what exactly happened is: the AP reporter asked the church guy a whole lot of questions, the church guy talked about a whole lot of things, and subsequently the reporter wrote 1-2 paragraph about his comments, which undoubtedly resulted in oversimplification. The editor think what the church guy say is irrelevant so he retain the bit of it to dramatise the story, further cut down his comment to the effect that its basically a misquote.

As someone who work in news business for over a decade, I DON'T BELIEVE A FRACTION OF WHAT THE REPORTER WROTE AS A TRUE REPRESENTATION OF WHAT WAS REALLY SAID. So unless you go directly to the church guy and ask what he really said, there is no point arguing over a piece of ****.
 

Bortaz

Banned
What do you mean, 'if'? It says right there in the article (the same one that made nary a mention of conversion) that the people were in church, and she stated flat out what she meant...it was an opportunity to turn to God.
 

Stoutwood

Diabloii.Net Member
dondrei said:
I mean, how would you feel if a bunch of soldiers were killed in Iraq and some anti-war people said "this is a great opportunity to bring people around to our point of view"?
I don't remember how I used to feel. I was desensitized about 500 Ilad12 threads ago.

SalivaMonster said:
What I think what exactly happened is: the AP reporter asked the church guy a whole lot of questions, the church guy talked about a whole lot of things, and subsequently the reporter wrote 1-2 paragraph about his comments, which undoubtedly resulted in oversimplification. The editor think what the church guy say is irrelevant so he retain the bit of it to dramatise the story, further cut down his comment to the effect that its basically a misquote.

As someone who work in news business for over a decade, I DON'T BELIEVE A FRACTION OF WHAT THE REPORTER WROTE AS A TRUE REPRESENTATION OF WHAT WAS REALLY SAID. So unless you go directly to the church guy and ask what he really said, there is no point arguing over a piece of ****.
That's a good point. I remember when my brother got interviewed by the paper, the "quote" that showed up in print was nothing like what he actually said. That was Associated Press too.
 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
Bortaz said:
What do you mean, 'if'? It says right there in the article (the same one that made nary a mention of conversion) that the people were in church, and she stated flat out what she meant...it was an opportunity to turn to God.
I think the confusion was the phrase "turn to God"

Stoutwood said:
I don't remember how I used to feel. I was desensitized about 500 Ilad12 threads ago.
True.
 
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