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A deterrent against skill switching

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 Beta Forum' started by HardRock, Mar 18, 2012.

  1. HardRock

    HardRock IncGamers Member

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    A deterrent against skill switching

    Before patch 15, this was the tooltip of the buff that we get after killing Elites:

    Here's how it looks now:

    I guess now we know how we'll get rewarded for making good all-around builds.

    Thanks to Dorjan for posting the new datamined strings and to bjax for noticing the change.
     
  2. Apocalypse

    Apocalypse IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    i bet this change causes many people to complain. i personally like it.

    does the bonus mf/gf only work against bosses though or vs everything?
     
  3. HardRock

    HardRock IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I agree, this seems like a good change. I hope it stays.

    Good question. I think this new system wan't explained in detail yet, but based on the tooltip I'd say this buff affects everything, not just bosses.


     
  4. yovargas

    yovargas IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Very, very interesting but how the hell would you communicate something like this to the player?
     
  5. Xariov

    Xariov <a href="payments.php">IncGamers Site Pal</a><br>D

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Wow, this is awesome. Nice info HardRock/Dorjan. I was worried that in order to min/max our efficiency, we'd always be forced to swap to single target skills before bosses and to me, that's just a frustrating and definitely NOT FUN way of playing a game like this. You'd feel inferior if you didn't do it and quickly get tired of having to always remember to do it (not to mention party members complaining when you're using an AoE skill etc).

    I think it's a very important thing to be aware of with this type of design... to allow the versatility and the ability to change builds but to also avoid making it a mid-battle *requirement*.
     
  6. HardRock

    HardRock IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    A buff icon would work I think. Show the number of Elites killed as a stack counter and clear the buff on skill change. Seems easy enough.

    Also, buff stacks should be given party-wide, but clearing should work on a per player basis.


     
  7. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Oh. Nice. Very elegant.

    This is actually my favorite change in the last several months. Minimal gameplay impact, but incentivises perfecting a build over "best build for best situation."

    Whoever came up with that deserves a promotion.

    Need more details now, though. Is this additive with gear MF bonuses or multiplicative? Is this going to be part of the "make bosses worth killing by tying them to champion packs" solution? How hard are they gonna nerf item drops to compensate for this? Doe this buff have a cap?

    One potential downside with this method is that it might effectively deincentivise the convenient short play sessions, which is one of Diablo's strength as a game. I think for that reason and that reason alone this buff might apply only to boss kills.
     
  8. HardRock

    HardRock IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    It's not in the beta, so we don't know how this works exactly yet.

    My guess is (and I know you didn't ask :) ) that it stacks additively, so even with no MF you have an incentive to keep the buff up.

    It's definitely the new system Bashiok (or Jay?) mentioned.

    As for nerfing the drops, who knows. Since it's not enabled in the beta we have no way to tell if the drops will change or not.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2012
  9. DexA

    DexA IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    If you think about it, it is only an endgame feature since you'll be changing skills almost every time you level up. Now you kinda have to know WHEN to change skills to get most experience while leveling.
     
  10. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Heh. You know they could improve this system? By making you lose this a portion (or all) of this buff upon death. That way they could make the bonus cap higher, and make it even more important to commit to a build in terms of practicing it.
     
  11. reflexii

    reflexii IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I agree with konfeta here, losing all if you die would be awesome! Would certainly make a player WANT to survive, and not just die an respawn like nothing happened (d2 ladder reset blizzard sorceress mephisto runs with -100 res anyone?). This system will effectively reduce the passion that is bossrunning and push players into the direction of more killing of champions and gaining more mf/gf through longer gaming sessions.
     
  12. ShadoutMapes

    ShadoutMapes IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Holy ****, that is actually a decent concept.
    Maybe Blizzard did consider the respec whine to be true despite their arrogant responses.

    Losing it on death, and make it stack higher would be very neat too. Actually that is pretty much how Survival Bonus works in Sacred 2 (except it affects a lot of stuff in the game and takes days to max).

    It would suck if it only works on bosses though, and wouldn't that promote boss farming too much again, which Blizzard shouldn't be interested in.

    There is no reason it couldnt last through sessions. Other than Blizzard being annoying of course :p
    For example in WoW buffs last while being logged off, while debuffs disappear.


     
  13. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    Well, if it's centered to work on bosses, the buff would have to be consumed when used on bosses. This way you would need to build up the boss kill pay off with champion kills again instead of maxing out the stack and repeating bosses 'till blue in the face.

    Actually, why not just have two separate buffs. One tailored for bosses, other a general anti-skill switching buff.
     
  14. reflexii

    reflexii IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I actually like the idea that the buff would be on every monster and the buff would wear off if you leave the game or die. Makes more sense imo. With this you'd actually have to clear the whole game to keep the buffs up, not just run through some easy-ish area for your class in inferno over and over again.
     
  15. marshmallow

    marshmallow IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I'm glad to see they're willing to implement such a...well, not outside the box concept since people have talked about it before. But it's something you wouldn't expect to see in a big name corporate game like this. Maybe in a mod or something.

    I remember in a Blizzcon way back that Jay mentioned they had an idea to fix D2's repetitive runs (whether bosses or areas). I wonder if the valor thing was it?
     
  16. ShadoutMapes

    ShadoutMapes IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I wouldn't say this necessarily fix repetitive runs. People wold still find a good place to build up a stack of MF before an 'easy/fast' boss to use it on.
    To fully combat repetitiveness in end-game I still believe Blizzard would have to come up with new types of endgame, like random "daily" quests (Go to area X and kill boss Y for example) which buff MF during that quest only, and new gameplay modes (survival mode, endless dungeon, adjustable difficulty and whatever else people have proposed before).
     
  17. yovargas

    yovargas IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    This is an unusually imaginative solution for them and while I'll withhold my vote until we see the details, it's a very promising idea. Now if only they'd applied this kind of imagination to runes and skill dmg and the Barb/Monk dmg and......
     
  18. Ganoidyn

    Ganoidyn IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    ARE there any buffs that don't go away on death?


     
  19. Kintara

    Kintara IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    I like it. I was a little concerned the skill switching was clunky, but these refinements have been spot-on.
     
  20. Apocalypse

    Apocalypse IncGamers Member

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    Re: A deterrent against skill switching

    how would this work with shared mf? i mean if 4 of us are grouped and 3 of you are in town when i kill a boss or 2 am i really only getting 25% of the bonus? what if 4 of us kill 15 bosses and before the final act boss 3 dip out and 3 new people join, do i instantly get all that bonus mf i have earned cut by 75%? should the bonus mf also be shared? can they make item mf share and not the bonus mf?
     

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