2019 Spring RFL Sign-Up and Running Thread: 1st Round

NanoMist

Diabloii.Net Member
I have been meaning for a while to build a K/T Sin with Stormlash, using only DS. In fact been theorycrafting different options quite a bit. My travel plans will not allow me to participate in round 1, but the build could be an idea for a cow runner as well. If someone would like to give it a shot, I’d be curious as to how it performs.

Short version of what I had in mind, slightly adjusted for cows:

2/20 circlet
Stormlash 'Ber'
Enigma
Spirit 35
Arach
Magefist/TO
FCR/double leech ring
Raven
Upped Gores
Some +2/3 Trap/adds ammy

Lash is great for CB, and with BoS it hits last BPs for both kicking and trap laying without additional IAS from gear. But both Schaefer's and CM should be decent alternatives, with different pros and cons.

Cham'ed headpiece ofc enables an extra ring for optimisation. Other idea could be GFace for 100%CB. Needs 17+ FCR amulet to stay at 102 FCR, or 7+ with Cham'ed headpiece and 2x FCR rings.

Also Atma's is really an option. Low lvl AD but again it could help chaining CEs quickly even when only hitting a few monsters. It will trigger pretty often with >6.5 APS and 95% CtH. My gut feeling is that extra skills for higher CE radius are preferable, but worth checking out, could certainly be the better option.

Merc: Might with Infinity, ebug forti, Andy. Infinity is pretty crucial I guess, not only for -res but also for 95% CtH.

Inventory should be mostly Trap skillers for higher CE radius, maybe 1-2 MA to hit lvl 30 (6 kick) DT.

Build:
20 DT (24 or 30 after gear)
20 DS
FB x3 for sufficient DS shots (can’t test)
CoS
20 LS (just to buff DS Lightning damage a bit, won’t do much but plenty of spare skill points)

Maybe Shadow Warrior to also lay some DS while kicking (and reducing own DS casts) is worthwhile, not sure and can’t test at the moment...

Generally the build is based on the idea that maybe DT delivers the first corpse faster than LS, high CB helps with that. Then Static CtC for smooth CE chains quickly after the first corpse. That’s the idea at least. ;)
After farming Meph for some more essences, I gave this a try. Mostly the same gear except no Ber rune in Stormlash, a 2 Skill/10 FCR/5 LS/5 MS ammy, and a 11 LS/6 MS ring for lots of leech. My 2/20 circlet also had 5 LS, so I had a total of 21% life steal going in. Charms were Vita/Elemental damage.

Here's the progression of my testing, if you want to read through the rambling:

I did a quick run with my current map, meaning I didn't switch to NM for a Might Merc. Staying with the Defiance Merc might've been a good choice because I took a beating in the Moo Moo Farm. Kick damage is just too low to leech back all the damage taken. Switching to Might merc wouldn't help enough. I tried Dracs but the 5% CTC Life Tap is just too inconsistent.

Survival issues aside, when it goes right, Cows drop fast. CTC static on Stormlash with Conviction has the entire group softened down to half health. It's hard to see, but it seems like I only need 2-3 corpses at most before the entire group of Cows fall over in unison. The issue is still getting those first few corpses- DT's lowish integer damage has a harder time finishing off a Cow as CB effectiveness falls off. This is usually where I start getting pummeled into the ground by 10+ Cows. Performing any sort of defensive repositioning behind the Merc is just too inefficient when I know that the Dragon Tail variant can just jump in and wreck without fear. Dragon Tail has knockback with the splash damage, allowing my previous build to stunlock entire groups of Cows. Not the case with Dragon Talon. The damage potential is there, but the survival is lacking... maybe I can revisit Phoenix?

Replacing Spirit with Phoenix took me down to the 65 FCR breakpoint, but it was well worth the life recovery. I was able to finish 4 runs at about 3:20 average, so things are looking up. Sometimes Redemption manages to steal away the first corpse, and other times cold damage shatters the corpse. Finding another target in the midst of 20+ cows triggered some NDEs.

When things go 'right', DTalon can take down Cows fast, but in tougher situations (massive cow groups from all sides), it's harder to recover. DTail has the splash knockback that can make any situation manageable, but DTalon does not have that luxury. K/T sin is a good cow runner, maybe a 3 minute caliber runner with a better setup and some practice, but she's rather stressful to play.

Edit:
Adding link to K/T Sin P5 Cow Demo Video.
 
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Hutton

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm just waiting for @Hutton to absolutely wreck all of the well-geared, experienced runners with his fresh Javazon.
Will heavily require the blessings of RNGesus!

Currently running 3-4 minutes on p1, but don't like my map- there's sometimes a massive empty bit.

Main issue is the moron tbh. Without CtA and Enigma he just gets rinsed constantly on p3, even with my Confuse procs and Decoy to help. He doesn't have any %DR either as I lost the Gaze I found for him in a rather unfortunate GoMule incident.
 

Vildecor

Diabloii.Net Member
I surprised myself. I managed a decent map and was able to run it in about 4 minutes on p3 the first couple of tries. I figure that's not too shabby for a Cow-running noob.
 
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Tatterson

Diabloii.Net Member
Will heavily require the blessings of RNGesus!

Currently running 3-4 minutes on p1, but don't like my map- there's sometimes a massive empty bit.

Main issue is the moron tbh. Without CtA and Enigma he just gets rinsed constantly on p3, even with my Confuse procs and Decoy to help. He doesn't have any %DR either as I lost the Gaze I found for him in a rather unfortunate GoMule incident.
I'd just leave the merc dead if hes not wearing an infinity
 

ffs

Diabloii.Net Member
Thanks for testing @NanoMist. I’ll check her out myself when I get back to running, but interesting to hear about the pros and cons you’ve encountered. Survival issues can be solved I think, but yeah, I’d also be surprised if she could come close to top runners.
 

NanoMist

Diabloii.Net Member
Here's the 4 run demo of the K/T Sin running P5 Cows. Also adding the video to my previous post for completeness.


I took a little more care with the herding and defensive positioning behind the Merc, allowing me to focus down a Cow with less trouble. I think it's also important to stack all 5 DS together for focused damage, ideally against the Cow being kicked.
 

Hutton

Diabloii.Net Member
I'd just leave the merc dead if hes not wearing an infinity
Yeah, he's only got an Insight. Not even an ethereal one at that!

I do have a socketed Andy's and the materials for an e-bug Fortitude available for him, so tempted to give that a try?

Playing on Hardcore without a merc just feels super weird and uncomfortable. But yeah, I'll ditch him for now if required. I don't really fancy 20 hours at players 1 :\
 

ffs

Diabloii.Net Member
Nice vid @NanoMist. Pretty much the gameplay I had in mind. I see what you mean about finishing Cows off.

Personally I’m not quite sold on Defiance and Phoenix for her though. Same as for other melee physical damage dealers, higher leech from Might should be more beneficial for her survivability. Also seems indeed raw damage is kind of low, so boosting kick damage should help with overall clear speed. Might aura also gives Merc more punch to deliver corpses if the Sin has to reposition.

Love the originality of using Phoenix with a CE char. :) But in the end it seems it slows things down for this build, while its upside only kicks in once there are corpses (and you’d rather not have it kick in with the first corpses). Apart from that and lower FCR, the fire storm proc can also delay the next DT sequence if it triggers on a late kick (this thing). No biggie, but it further complicates getting that first corpse.

If a defensive shield is indeed required, I’d assume Stormshield does the job without getting in the way of offense. Phoenix could be used on CtA switch, if not going with Spirit for 102 FCR.

Upon checking with a CtH calc I realised Infinity is actually not that essential for 95% CtH, e.g. some 150 Dex is enough for a lvl 95 char with just skill bonus. So could be worthwhile even trying with a Reaper's Merc, seeing as maybe powering up the kicks is more important than helping Static and DS with Infinity. Reaper's also adds a lot of safety.

Anyway, just some ideas. Generally the gameplay looks just as fun as I had hoped, definitely will play around with her. :) Thanks for giving it a go!
 
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Gripphon

Diabloii.Net Member
Frost Nova sorc anyone? She is solid and more safe than Nova sorc. Static x3, Blizzard on self and spam until everything is dead.
 

Gripphon

Diabloii.Net Member
Nova + Blizzard sorc
sub 2:30 runner for p5, fastest sorc I tried

Equipment:
Griffon's with lightning facet
Enigma (for life per kill)
Death's Fathom with cold facet
Spirit
2/10 amulet
Arachnid
Beta bkwb (Soj otherwise)
1.07 mana per kill ring
Dracul's Grasp (for life per kill)
Silkweave boots (mana per kill)

Switch: Cta + Spirit (Phoenix alternative, but you have potions...)

Merc:
Infinity + Fortitude + Andy

Skills:
Warmth 1
Telekinesis 1
Static - enough for 24 area
Nova - 20
Lightning Mastery - 20
Frost Armor - 1
Cold Mastery - 1
Blizzard 20
rest into synergies for Blizzard

Technique:
Get in between cows packs, static x3, Blizzard self, teleport on self to get merc to you and force cows to get to you, Nova them to death
 

LongingForDeath

Diabloii.Net Member
Did 18 timed runs so far. Average time was 4:04, best time was 3:25. Not as bad as I thought it would be, but still some room for improvement. Haven't tried the 125% FCR setup yet. I'm also considering cubing up 2 Ohm runes to make a Fortitude for the merc, as I feel that would make getting that first corpse a lot faster. Respec'ing to max Amplify Damage instead of all PNova synergies is also worth thinking about, since I'm not really happy with the AD radius at the moment (14.6 Yards).
 

Gripphon

Diabloii.Net Member
CE and Amplify damage are the core of necro build and are best maxed. Losing time on recasting Amplify because its range is too low is not optimal. Revives are next on the food chain of imprtance because not only they make running much safer, but they also do some damage helping to get corpses faster. PNova is just a backup skill which doesn't have much importance. It allows slightly faster first and second corpse then CE takes over everything.

20 Amplify Damage
20 CE
1 Revive
1 Iron Golem (optional)
1 Bone Armor
rest into PNova and synergies.
 

pharphis

Diabloii.Net Site Pal
do revives really do any dmg? I thought they were basically useless because of monster HP compared to player HP
 

T72on1

Diabloii.Net Member
CE and Amplify damage are the core of necro build and are best maxed. Losing time on recasting Amplify because its range is too low is not optimal. Revives are next on the food chain of imprtance because not only they make running much safer, but they also do some damage helping to get corpses faster. PNova is just a backup skill which doesn't have much importance. It allows slightly faster first and second corpse then CE takes over everything.

20 Amplify Damage
20 CE
1 Revive
1 Iron Golem (optional)
1 Bone Armor
rest into PNova and synergies.
I don't agree. Maxed Amp means you have to stay away from the cow king further, which is less efficient. Recasting you can do while the merc is creating the first corpse. And new monsters often keep on appoaching, in which case you have to recast anyway.

Revives work counterproductive because they spread out packs of cows. 95% of the time, the merc survives just fine without them anyway. The few times he doesn't, it's a matter of better teleporting or maybe using Decrep. I haven't done the latter, bus think it will be enough in those last 5%.
 
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