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2019 Spring RFL Sign-Up and Running Thread: 1st Round

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Grape, Feb 22, 2019.

  1. ffs

    ffs IncGamers Member

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    IMO 125 FCR is worth dropping a few skill levels, everything you do is based on FCR. Not just casting AD and CE but also the herding. Thing is with DWeb you need good FCR circlet and amulet, or include FCR rings. To be honest even without top end FCR gear I would go for 125, and include rings if need be. At least if you have a number of skillers. Your main damage is CE and its damage doesn’t scale with + skills, so it’s not all that bad losing a few PN levels.
     
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  2. sir_cyclops

    sir_cyclops IncGamers Member

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    Does anyone have a video of a super efficient trapper running cows? I'd bet there are way to use mindblast for herding.
     
  3. ffs

    ffs IncGamers Member

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  4. sir_cyclops

    sir_cyclops IncGamers Member

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    I've looked at, read, or referenced the Rune Bible so many times.. how did I miss the video demos!?
     
  5. LongingForDeath

    LongingForDeath IncGamers Member

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    Where do you think I found the video that I linked to above? ;)

    I will test a 125% FCR setup, but it will cost me +4 skills and a bunch of life and mana. That's quite a bit, considering I don't have that many skillers.

    Attract isn't an option for me at the moment, sadly, unless I respec or get him from level 90 to level 92.
     
  6. NanoMist

    NanoMist IncGamers Member

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    If I experimented with the trapper again, I'd focus more on Fire Blast as the guide suggests. If I recall correctly, those demo videos were more LS focused.
     
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  7. sir_cyclops

    sir_cyclops IncGamers Member

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    As in, youd make her a fire trapper with maxed DS? Interesting. Even without infinity?
     
  8. Hutton

    Hutton IncGamers Member

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    Made it to Act 5 Hell with the javazon this evening! So barring any disasters, I'll be ready in time!

    And by ready I obviously mean a little under geared!

    I think the main issue is going to be lack of CtA to keep the merc alive... I'm considering making a Delirium for me to wear to help keep him out on the taking front, and indeed myself if he dies. I won't really be chucking any javelins out until I've got a nice big herd piled up- so I don't think the proc will make gathering cows that much more difficult?

    Edit: I've also just realised round one starts next weekend, not this one coming. Oops.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2019
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  9. peytron

    peytron IncGamers Member

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    Well I decided to time 2 runs. First run I just ran around like an idiot and cleared the big packs as fast as I could, left the stragglers, and did not pick up anything. This took about 10 minutes.

    Second run I played my normal style, picked up the usual rares/gems, etc. I have a hard time leaving the stragglers but I did my best. Closer to 20 minutes.

    Obviously the first option is the best for this tournament, so I will practice that a bit more but more likely will stick with option 2.

    P.S. Is anyone running a Lightning Sorceress for this?
     
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  10. NanoMist

    NanoMist IncGamers Member

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    Nah, using the typical lightning trapper build is fine, lightning traps also synergize Fire Blast. Always Infinity. Maybe some slight adjustments to the equipment to maximize the fire damage. Similar to Necro, Assassin also wants to get those first couple of corpses ASAP.
     
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  11. Gripphon

    Gripphon IncGamers Member

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    Poison Nova damage is not important for necro, what matters is merc gear and CE range. Nova is there just to speed the killing of cows and getting first corpse a tiny bit.
     
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  12. ffs

    ffs IncGamers Member

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    I have been meaning for a while to build a K/T Sin with Stormlash, using only DS. In fact been theorycrafting different options quite a bit. My travel plans will not allow me to participate in round 1, but the build could be an idea for a cow runner as well. If someone would like to give it a shot, I’d be curious as to how it performs.

    Short version of what I had in mind, slightly adjusted for cows:

    2/20 circlet
    Stormlash 'Ber'
    Enigma
    Spirit 35
    Arach
    Magefist/TO
    FCR/double leech ring
    Raven
    Upped Gores
    Some +2/3 Trap/adds ammy

    Lash is great for CB, and with BoS it hits last BPs for both kicking and trap laying without additional IAS from gear. But both Schaefer's and CM should be decent alternatives, with different pros and cons.

    Cham'ed headpiece ofc enables an extra ring for optimisation. Other idea could be GFace for 100%CB. Needs 17+ FCR amulet to stay at 102 FCR, or 7+ with Cham'ed headpiece and 2x FCR rings.

    Also Atma's is really an option. Low lvl AD but again it could help chaining CEs quickly even when only hitting a few monsters. It will trigger pretty often with >6.5 APS and 95% CtH. My gut feeling is that extra skills for higher CE radius are preferable, but worth checking out, could certainly be the better option.

    Merc: Might with Infinity, ebug forti, Andy. Infinity is pretty crucial I guess, not only for -res but also for 95% CtH.

    Inventory should be mostly Trap skillers for higher CE radius, maybe 1-2 MA to hit lvl 30 (6 kick) DT.

    Build:
    20 DT (24 or 30 after gear)
    20 DS
    FB x3 for sufficient DS shots (can’t test)
    CoS
    20 LS (just to buff DS Lightning damage a bit, won’t do much but plenty of spare skill points)

    Maybe Shadow Warrior to also lay some DS while kicking (and reducing own DS casts) is worthwhile, not sure and can’t test at the moment...

    Generally the build is based on the idea that maybe DT delivers the first corpse faster than LS, high CB helps with that. Then Static CtC for smooth CE chains quickly after the first corpse. That’s the idea at least. ;)
     
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  13. sir_cyclops

    sir_cyclops IncGamers Member

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    Ah, I love this idea. a lot. I sort of want to try it with Devi. Without infinity, I find myself unable to do p3. Merc cannot stay alive even with me jumping around with enigma. On p1, we kill fast enough to negate the issues. This might be a viable option. Do you not think lifetap is required to stay alive?

    Also, in regards to the merc staying alive, do you think delirium is better than andys visage? He's wearing non eth thresher insight, 900 def treach, and andys with 15 ias jewel. I have a Lo for fort but no ebug armor yet. And I haven't found an eth elite polearm on her yet.
     
  14. Luhkoh

    Luhkoh IncGamers Member

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    Does the cold dmg from ravenfrost get applied to kicks? You may not want that like with pitzerker. But love the idea. I dont see why it wouldnt be as good as or better than fireblast.
     
  15. ffs

    ffs IncGamers Member

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    @sir_cyclops personally I wouldn’t use Delirium on any cow runner because it screws up your herding. But of course others love it. Surely it adds a lot of safety and basically solves any survivability issues. CtA + ebug Forti makes Merc really safe enough though IMO.

    Re Sin survival: Don’t know, maybe it’s an issue even with good gear that would need to be addressed. I’d assume leech and Might is enough, though admittedly FCR/double leech rings aren’t easy to come by...

    But you could mix and match as required to include the necessary stats, if need be drop an FCR BP to make things easier.

    @Luhkoh yes cold dmg gets applied and Cham is the best option also because of that. In fact I wanted to build that character around a Cham-worthy circlet (edit: this beauty), but I figured those are pretty rare, hence the suggested Raven.

    But the occasional shattering shouldn’t be a big deal at all. For MF Barb it is, but that’s because you want to loot that specific corpse again to maximise MF efficiency. Generally it doesn’t happen often, and when it does the next corpse will be there quickly either way. Same for Merc: Forti is preferable despite cold damage IMO. On my 99er Necro I used it as well, the damage boost more than makes up for the occasional shattered corpse. All the way to 99 it didn’t bother me, and Necro really relies on him to deliver corpses quickly. ;)
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2019
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  16. NanoMist

    NanoMist IncGamers Member

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    Interesting discussion about Assassin running.. I've been working on a Dragon Tail/DS Cow runner the past few days, what timing.



    20 Dragon Tail
    20 Tiger Strike
    20 Death Sentry
    18 Fire Blast
    16 or 7 Burst of Speed (after +skills)
    1 Mind Blast
    Remainder in Lightning Sentry

    18 Fire Blast provides 6 more shots on DS for a total of 11 shots. During my test runs, I don't remember hearing any traps break, so less shots should be fine.

    Eth Lacerator
    Enigma
    Phoenix
    Griffon's (15 IAS)
    2/10 FCR Ammy
    Raven Frost
    10 FCR/AR/Life/Mana Ring
    3 MA 20 IAS Gloves
    Arachnid Mesh
    Shadow Dancer
    7x MA GCs

    Merc(Defiance): Infinity/Fortitude/Andy

    I went for the 65 FCR breakpoint on main switch. I did not have a 2/15+ FCR Ammy, otherwise I would have went with a 2/20 or 3/20 circlet instead of Griffon's. With 35 off-weapon IAS, level 16 BoS is required for 7 FPA Dragon Tail. An alternative option would be to use fire facet(s) in the helm, leaving 20 off-weapon IAS and a level 7 BoS for 8 FPA Dragon Tail. The Griffon's I borrowed from my Zon already had the IAS jewel, so I went with that option. A 2/17+ FCR Ammy would allow for 102 FCR breakpoint on CTA switch.

    Defiance Merc is all about survival when facing cows in melee. Other defensive skills such as Holy Freeze or Confuse just causes issues with herding. The built-in knockback feature in DTail may cause issues with chaining DTail, but it's a nice defensive feature. It's a bit tough in the beginning of the Cow run if Rakanishu curses you, I use Mind Blast to help out.

    Due to DTail's fire damage scaling off of the physical damage, Lacerator was much needed for the Amp. The hit causes monster to flee isn't as annoying as I thought it'd be when charging up tiger strike. Phoenix also plays a big part: Massive ED boost to the physical damage base, -EFR for the fire splash damage, and Redemption for life & mana recovery.

    The biggest question mark I had going into testing was the corpse struggle between Redemption and Death Sentry. There's enough time between aura 'pulses' for the DS to sneak in a few shots most of the time. Dragon Tail also drops enough corpses (5-10?) that this isn't much of an issue. I drop at least 3 DS, up to 5 if cows are still moving.

    I ran on P5 for more comfortable running- P7 is noticeably harder and I'm not certain if P7 running is more efficient. Dragon Tail with 3 TS charges will always one-shot an Amp'd Cow. Fortunately, Amp comes quick most of the time. The LCS damage is 22K-35K, but when enemy resistances (-63% FR & -50% DR) are factored in, this damage becomes 54K-86K.

    Not sure if I'll run this build in the RFL, but it was fun theorycrafting and testing this build for sure. Pure caster builds are still more relaxing though.
     
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  17. BeLikeLebron

    BeLikeLebron IncGamers Member

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    @NanoMist That's one of the coolest assassin builds I've seen. What an impressive balance between DS/Redemption, flee/amp/chargeup initial hits, Charged Strike/Dragon Tail. The way you achieved high enough -EFR and -physical res and the IAS+FCR balance is impressive. This is a really creative build and actually seems to work well! Super cool use of phoenix and Lacerator. Assassins are really cool as you can use a bunch of different skill sets and tactics and switches weapons all the time, I love that about them. It's not as relaxed but if you want to stay engaged in the game that's definitely the way to go. If I want to watch a movie or something while I farm I always usually choose my AT blizzard sorc anyway lol. More hands off and can focus on other things while playing. Thanks for the creativity you put into this build! I'll shamelessly copy you when my single player toons are rich enough for a phoenix.

    Man. You would think what backwards thinking would try to match up corpse explosion/DS with Redemption and things like Fleeing monsters with physical attacks but it somehow all works and works well. Major props! Thanks for sharing!
     
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  18. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    Incredibly impressive, @NanoMist !!! Thanks for sharing. I agree with everything @BeLikeLebron said there.

    Looking at your resists, where FE/LE/CE bosses ever a problem? Or is it just a matter of taking on the pack from the other side and let the DS take the boss out?

    I think you should run that build for RFL1. I mean, maybe you'd give us a slight edge, but even then you'll win the RFL big time. Everyone knows that ;). And what am I talking, slight edge? 3 minute runs are still fast, so ... !?

    Edit: ok, watched the video some more. Make that 2:35 runs :confused:. I really should up my ante ... a lot. I only wanted to do some practice runs a few days before start of the RFL, but I guess I'll start practicing this evening.

    Btw, congrats on the Mal ;).
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2019
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  19. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    Btw, on gathering the leg ... The way you do it in the video, is it how you usually do it? Buy some tomes, put them in the stash, and use one every time? Last year I did some of that, but sometimes also just went to Akara to buy one tome every run, because I had the feeling that didn't really have an impact on my run times. How does everybody here go about that aspect of cow running?
     
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  20. maxicek

    maxicek Moderator Single Player

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    @T72on1 I bought batches of four tomes I think as that was the space I had in Inventory.

    @NanoMist Nice work, I may have to try that one.
     
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