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1.10 Frenzy Build

Discussion in 'Barbarian' started by Grandar King of Trolls, Feb 20, 2004.

  1. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    1.10 Frenzy Build

    I was just thinking about this and thought I would bounce it off of you guys. What if I made a frenzy build using two famine berserkers? Has this been done before? Forgive me if this has been posted before, but I haven't seen it if it has. If so, just skip this post.

    With the "ignore target defense", AR is completely unnecessary. So, since zerkers have rediculously low dex requirements (50 something) and you won't be using a shield, you can build the barb with all your stat points in str and vit and just use items to boost your dex.

    Now, the reason I am thinking about this in 1.10 is with synergies. Here are the main 4 skills I'm thinking of maxing out:

    Frenzy +20
    Taunt +20
    BO +20
    Shout +20

    The synergies here are cool, because the maxed taunt will give you another 160% damage to frenzy. Plus, you get a 43% or so nerf to most monsters with it. This is, I think, the perfect build for the howl/taunt combo. Berserk will get the shout synergy (as will BO and BC) so limited points there should be fine. And BC will get the BO synergy as well.

    Your leftover points can go in the normal places (BC, leap attack, iron skin, nat res, zerk). But you can also pump more into howl for the increased zerk damage and/or double swing for the increased frenzy damage. The bonus from howl is pretty obvious for the howl/taunt combo as well.

    With the added speed form frenzy, I think this is a completely viable build. We all know that strict melee can get boring after a while if you can't hit those AS breakpoints. And you should be able to take out the occasional PI without too much trouble. You can have sick defense and the only real weakness will be blocking. But you should be able to taunt long range attackers, have rediculous crowd control, and move fast enough to avoid most troubles. With enough mdr/pdr, you should be fine. Especially considering the enormous ammount of vit you can have and the ammount of free item spaces you'll have not worrying about AR or IAS.

    Thoughts? Suggestions?
     
  2. ploof

    ploof IncGamers Member

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    I say go for it, It sounds really awesome except I have one problem with it:

    no mastery. I know that as a frenzy barb you won't have much access to extra skill points, but I think you need to either pull them out of your arse or drop shout :p

    Shout is a very good synergy for beserk, allowing you to take out PI monsters quickly with only a single point in zerk itself, and it also gives you great defense and time synergies for your other cries...

    But I think the %critical strike, %ED and faster attack speed given by axe mastery is more important. just my opinion, though.

    And if you ever have any *extra* famine beserker axes lying around, and feel like giving one to me... let me know. please :flip:
     
  3. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    You bring up some very good points about not having axe mastery. I've never built a frenzy barb before, so is ias that important for one? I didn't even know that a mastery provided ias.

    I worry about defense with no shield so I am hesitant to do too much to shout. And like you said, the synergies from shout are awesome. Not to mention how party friendly this barb is going to be with all his cries (including taunt). Maybe 10 points in taunt and 10 in mastery? Is the 5% ed and critical strike better than the 8% ed from taunt? So far as I can tell, doing 10 mastery and 10 taunt will be at a cost of 30% ed.

    My other reason for not really picking a mastery is just what you said. Famine zerkers are pretty rare. Without a mastery, any end game weapon is fine. All you need is a couple jah's, which is much easier than putting together two famine zerkers.

    And I read that mixing up your weapons is good for frenzy barbs because of a bug that lets only the as of the primary weapon matter. I like the idea of having an end game barb who can pick up whatever he finds and start beating baddies over the head with it with reckless abandon.
     
  4. Cujo

    Cujo IncGamers Member

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    Instead of 20 in Taunt, Id suggest splitting them in 10DS and 10Taunt, since there are many mana burners, and a Frenzyed up DS is a good way to take care of them (no mana cost at lvl9+)..

    Shout vs. Warcry : Shout is most favored of those playing SC, since it has great synergies and good defense, whereas Warcry "only" produce stun to your enemies so they wont be able to hit you at all (recast often)..

    For the mastery, well its up to you, but I get by fine with only 1 point in mace and sword, since with ITD ar is not that important, and pumping synergies instead gives you more damage. The critical strike is easily made up for with some deadly strike (ex. gorerider and Highlords).
    BTW : mastery does not give IAS!

    also theres apparently this bug you mentioned with only left weapon ias counts, so get a fast weapon in left hand and slow/damaging weapon in right..
     
  5. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    I noticed that DS shares the same synergy for frenzy as taunt but didn't realize it could actually be useful. It does stand to reason that a quick mana leech attack could come in handy. However, is DS that effective? It has no ed and frenzy only costs 3 mana. And, in theory, I won't need the AR boost by end game. Maybe DS will help me keep going until I can equip this barb with some ITD weapons. I'll give it a shot in lower levels to see how I like it since it is a pre-req anyway.

    I'm a strictly SC player, so shout will be the way for me to go as per the shout vs warcry decision. Personal preference, I know, but the idea of clocking in 20 hours on a barb only to have some IM kill him in the chaos sanctuary or lag out just seems horrible to me. But I digress.

    I was thinking of using goreriders, etc with this barb in the long run, so the one point in mastery is what I was thinking about. But I probably won't do that until very late end game when I am pretty sure I have the weapons I will be sticking with for the end of this barb's career. Frenzy barbs are surprisingly tight builds.

    I won't be starting this build any time soon since I am pretty poor and Jah's aren't cheap. I'm just looking for opinions here and appreciate everything I have gotten so far. Thanks guys.
     
  6. Cujo

    Cujo IncGamers Member

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    In the early stages of the game DS is very effective, since it cost no mana at lvl9, and are far more effective than any other skills at that stage..(and later on in the game when frenzy is maxed, it will even handle manaburners quite easily in hell whith fully charged ias from Frenzy)
     
  7. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    That sounds like a good idea.

    Let's update this barb to:

    Frenzy +20
    DS +10
    Taunt +10
    Shout +20
    BO +20

    I wish I were rich and I'd start him up now. :) Anyone wanna trade a cracked sash for two Jah runes? ;)
     
  8. memememe173

    memememe173 IncGamers Member

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    use synergys of Frenzy instead of mastery (still have 1 point though)

    ITD dosn't work against bosses

    when did mastery start speeding up you attack rate?

    you only REALLY need 1 in WC if you don't mind casting it again or have the +skills (BK rings//cry charms etc)
     
  9. ploof

    ploof IncGamers Member

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    yeah i blew that one. Sorry everyone :uhhuh: i guess I had a brain fart.

    I agree with the 10 in DS instead of maxing taunt, as a maxed taunt is not really necessary anyways. When fighting mana thieves i find myself reverting to normal attack (by default, not choice) quite often, even if it's not something which is really noticeable. I get by with one in taunt on my conc barb just fine as a prereq for battlecry (which is VERY good, imo). I also use it occasionally to lure out those fuggin doom knights with their iron maiden.

    another thing: Shout won't help you against iron maiden, as you're the one killing yourself. I suppose if you have a very low AR you have a better chance of not killing yourself, since you wont be hitting anything, but a higher defense doesn't keep you from hitting enemies, but them from hitting you.

    I think that's right, if i'm wrong again, let me know. An effective counter to shout is using beserk, but with no shield it WILl put your defense at zero, and you will have to be careful even with maxed DR. Also, you have to remember that zerk will not let you leech, as you are doing purely magical damage...

    but you probably already knew all that :sleep:

    anyways, sorry for the misinformation, hope i'm not spreading more :innocent:
     
  10. Billweed

    Billweed Banned

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    I would use lower taunt/shout and max Beserk for the +20% Magic Dam while frenzying this way you don't have to slow down and switch to berserk on PI's (and if you do 1 hit kills and you get the defense back way fast).
    P.S. - on the bugged IAS the left hand weapon must be = or shorter range than the right hand one or you miss with the second hit just about every time. Thanks to Wiseman for this info:
    Frenzy attack speed is based solely on the first weapon WIAS and IAS.
    So the majority of optimum setups should use different weapons from the same class, with the exception of dual scourges probably, cuz using a weapon with lower range causes misses

    Examples
    Nords Shael / Shaeffers Lo
    Runemaster ShaelShaelShaelShaelxxxx / Runemaster OhmOhmLoBer...
    Fury Legend Sword / The Grandfather OH

    Yes, second weapon IAS DOESN´T MATTER at all, so socket properly.
    But... there is a bug about the order u equip weapons... first equip the primary weapon in the left hand and then the secondary in the right.
     
  11. Cujo

    Cujo IncGamers Member

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    IMO the 20%magical dmg wont be enough to take down the PI's, It will sure be faster to switch to beserk (with only 1point +200%added from shout), and besides that you will loose 19 points which means youll have to take away 152%enh damage from Frenzy.. ;)
     
  12. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    I didn't realize that ITD didn't work on bosses. Still, for the most part, it seems like the best way to get the most damage out of a frenzy barb with a heck of a titan build. I am also still leaning towards the taunt/ds over extra points in zerk, myself. The ed seems to be a bonus over the occasional problem of IM or PI's. Let's face it, they are the thorn in the side of all barbs, but they aren't most of the enemies in the game. I have to switch to zerk for IM casting monsters with my conc barb right now. I have to start slurping down pots a lot, but that is better than dieing. Besides, a little binge drinking from time to time clears out inventory space. :)

    As for PI's, I team up with a necro and have them ad them to break it for me. His bone spirit doesn't hurt much either. But that is just my style of barb play. I don't really like to solo with them.

    I will definitely take into consideration the diffent weapon ideas you guys are tossing out, though. I need to do some research on them, actually. But the whole reason I came up with this build is for the ITD mod. It is the best way to boost your chance to hit and a frenzy build using them allows an extremely liberal placement of stat points. Maybe jah's in good uniques is the way to go.
     
  13. memememe173

    memememe173 IncGamers Member

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    you can put 1 point in Battle Cry (prereq for Warcry) and use on bosses, itll help a bit
     
  14. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    Good point. That should help with ITD not working w/bosses.
     
  15. homeyman1976

    homeyman1976 IncGamers Member

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    Here is my frenzy build
    410 str
    base dex
    base vit
    base eng

    skills
    20 Frenzy
    20 Taunt
    20 mace mastery
    20 double swing
    20 berzerk
    1 in BO, Shout, and Battle command

    Equipment
    2 shaffaers
    arreats face
    ik gloves, belt, shoes
    cathans X2
    highlords
    Enigma Archon plate

    Weapon switch
    2 echoing weapons

    i have 600hps with bo and when i echo its 1100

    My Ar is 8k
    my def is 9k
    i do 2-3.5k damg 1 H


    i do well except for fire enchanted bosses. They explode with some POWER!

    I am thinking about adding to vit but im not sure if i should. He is going to be PvP.

    Hope this helps
    -Homeyman
     
  16. Grandar King of Trolls

    Grandar King of Trolls IncGamers Member

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    Well, that certainly tells me what kind of max damage I can expect to see from a frenzy build. Max synergies and str. What level is this your barb now? Have you reached all those goals? That is over 100 skill points.
     
  17. the_tree

    the_tree IncGamers Member

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    I have heard that before, but I would swear that it's not true. What was happening with my Barb was that the first hand would hit real fast, then my off hand would go all matrix-like towards the enemy, hit, then the first hand would hit real fast again, then matrix and so on. Very frustrating.
     
  18. homeyman1976

    homeyman1976 IncGamers Member

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    I am currently at lvl 80 im working now on maxing Double swing
    i am at a stand still cause of vitality issues. I dont think i need to place points in vit. But i gotta find a way to get more life than 1100hps

    Charms are so far my best bet.

    so yes the damg can get better than what i got now. just add 19(skills)*8% from double strike to my damg.

    also 1 in iron skin and natural resistance.

    -Homeyman
     
  19. homeyman1976

    homeyman1976 IncGamers Member

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    I really think the 20 points in berserk are well worth 20% magic damg when u do 2.5-3.5k Damg. First you dont slow down. Second when i do switch to beserk for some reason its not as effective as Frenzy. Only for stationary single targets. the way i play now PI are not even bothering me at all. they go down fast and i only do phy damg so i know its the 20% magic damg doing the work. Speed Killz. and i still have my 9k def.

    All i need now is maybe 15-20 Small charms of vita's. then ill pwn :yep: :buddies: :worship:
    -Homeyman
     
  20. CyberHawk

    CyberHawk IncGamers Member

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    I kinda went the ITD way myself, with 2 amn'd Lightsabres, but all I seem to do was just swing and swing, and not kill anything. Maybe it was the low damage output, I dont know.
    I thought maybe going with something like elemental damage. Like dual Glimmershed axes. They have lots of extra damage on them?
    I would love to rebuild my frenzybarb also, and some these stat/skill placements with synergies has got me feeling all warm again.:) But still back with the weapon problem. I have a serious problem with gathering runes, aint happening. :rant: So I'm always planning on alot of uniques instead. But just aint working like i thought it would.
     

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