Wyatt Cheng Addresses Melee and Ranged


It’s a known secret that melee heroes have the short end of the stick when it comes to the end game in Diablo III. We’ve seen countless people across the net create ranged characters that depart from their preference simply due to the fact that Inferno punishes close-quarters combat. During yesterday’s AMAA, the pink elephant that never seemed to be addressed was the disparity between the two. What are the developer’s thoughts on this glaring problem?

The question was brought up again on the official boards, and DiabloWikiLylirra passed it on to DiabloWikiWyatt Cheng. He responds in full, voicing their thoughts on the matter:

We thought this was a great question, too. Unfortunately, our developers were unable to address it with as much detail and depth as they wanted before the AMAA ended. They thought it was a really relevant concern, though, so when I brought up the topic again to Wyatt Cheng today, he took some time to write up the following response:

Can you please explain/reconcile the disparity between melee and ranged in this game?

I’ll state up front that I do think there’s a disparity between melee and ranged, and I would like to see that closed. I feel like if I talk a lot about thought processes and design philosophy and don’t state this up front people will lose the forest for the trees and conclude we think everything is fine. So I’ll say it again: melee vs. ranged disparity is not fine, changes are being made, and even if you disagree with the approach outlined below we can hopefully have the common ground that the current situation needs improvement.

It may not look like it on the surface, but a large number of the changes in 1.0.3 are actually targeted at closing the melee/ranged gap. Let me go through some of them.

Hardcore
I’m going to use Hardcore as a starting point. In Hardcore, there’s actually a reasonable distribution of classes, and I don’t think the melee vs. ranged disparity is as large. There are a lot of Hardcore players of every class in Inferno without a huge disparity. Why is this important? It’s because a significant portion of the melee/ranged disparity is related to a ranged character’s ability to progress even while dying. A melee player can throw themselves at a monster and die, doing almost no damage to an elite enemy. A ranged player can do a huge amount of damage to an elite enemy, die, respawn, and basically attrition the enemy down with repeated deaths. In the Hardcore environment where a single bad Mortar, Vortex, Jailer, or Reflects Damage will kill a glass cannon-ranged character, the disparity between ranged and melee is an order of magnitude less.

Repair Costs
One of the more controversial changes in 1.0.3 is the increased repair costs. The design intent of these increased repair costs is to make death more meaningful. One of the top arguments we see against the increased repair costs is “I’m already dying dozens of times to make any progress in Inferno. Don’t you see this is going to make this impossible?” This concern is most often brought up by ranged glass cannons. Many melee players respond “increased repair costs seem fine” because they haven’t been using death-zerging as a tactic. Melee can’t easily death-zerg an enemy down, but ranged can. I don’t think the answer is to make death-zerging more attractive for melee; I’d rather make death-zerging a less profitable strategy for ranged.

Enemy Health and Damage
We’re also looking to adjust the damage and health of enemies in Inferno Acts II, III, and IV. This is another change that is primarily for melee with secondary benefits for ranged. A lot of ranged are building glass cannon with the mentality “well, I’ll just try not to get hit at all.” So, reducing incoming damage when they weren’t taking any before isn’t significant for them, whereas reducing incoming damage for the melee is a big deal. For the ranged classes, I’m hoping that the incoming damage reduction will make some survival stats more appealing to ranged classes. While before the damage was so large it just felt pointless to try and mitigate any of it at all, after the change hopefully ranged classes will think “well, if I just put on a modest amount of survivability, I don’t get 1-shot, so that’s worth it.” There are some ranged players who are already doing this — stacking survivability so they don’t have to endlessly kite — and it just feels like the minimum amount of survivability to avoid the 1-shot is so large it’s unattainable. That’s one of the things 1.0.3 seeks to address.

Damage Reduction in Co-op
Another change which is targeted at improving life for melee is the reduction in co-op damage. Again, since many ranged players just build glass cannon and avoid damage completely, they didn’t really care if incoming damage went up as other players entered the game, but the melee characters really noticed. It was very easy for your life-on-hit to have you at a steady equilibrium, but as soon as another player entered the game your life-on-hit was no longer covering the incoming damage and death became imminent.

Additional Changes
And finally, there are always minor polish adjustments designed to help melee — such as the AI on some monsters (BEES!!!) being tweaked to run away less often, which again helps melee more than ranged. I actually spent some extra time the other day to make sure if a Sand Wasp runs away from you, and you start chasing the wasp, it doesn’t turn and shoot 4 bees in your face (hopefully that makes 1.0.3). I’m also working with one of our gameplay engineers to make it so if you sidestep the Dark Berserker’s power hit (where he brings his giant mace down), he doesn’t turn to track you as he swings (though that change probably won’t make 1.0.3). These kind of AI adjustments are things ranged players don’t even notice, but are huge for melee.

Another adjustment being made is increasing both the maximum range and the dead zone of Mortar. Mortar was specifically designed to be an anti-range affix, but many ranged players would just stand even farther away, whereas melee would sometimes get caught in the cross-fire of two Mortars. Increasing the maximum range and the dead zone helps with both of these.

We’ll be including this response in the AMAA transcript, as well (just in case some players don’t find this thread).

His response seems somewhat of an amalgamation of already expressed changes re-appropriated for this specific question. However, it explains additional reasons as to why they’re making the changes they’re making. Death zerging is definitely a tactic that is a problem when it comes to appropriate hero progression. I personally feel that it would be eliminated if they unified death penalties rather than spread out the cost that feels much more severe. Currently, Inferno deaths can include one or more of the following: resurrection timer increase, monster health-regeneration to max (this seems to be a hidden modification on some mobs – not all seem to do this), enrage timer, and durability loss.

That is a lot of penalties for death. With that weighing on your shoulders when death tolls, I feel more frustration than anything else. It is possible that it will balance out with tuning, but how they’re addressing it from the current standpoint seems somewhat inadequate. There is a fine line between “just right” and “completely frustrating” when it comes to death. We’ll all have to experience 1.0.3 before coming to any conclusions about these tweaks, but the current death penalties seem to be at odds with their original design philosophy of reducing the severity of death and to “get people back to demon killing.”

Do you think this adequately addresses the matter? What would you suggest as an alternative if it is not?

Comments

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  1. This isn’t even close. Reducing the amount of times an enemy will flee doesn’t help when they have no limit to how far/long they will flee, nor the ridiculous amount of damage specific enemies have (heralds of pestilence, sand wasps, burning skeleton mages, etc).

    The AI has some serious issues, as does monster combinations. Some monsters already have disastrously dangerous abilities (hello Morlu Mage who already has like, four intrinsic boss modifiers).

    They’re looking at minor tweaks when some shit just needs to be removed. Mortar is completely broken. It’s not that the range “isn’t right” it’s that it is buggier than all hell. I won’t get in-depth (here) about it but they have a lot of work to do in order to make end-game fun, even though end-game is just smashing your face against elites. 

    • They do have a limit on how far they can flee though right? I mean, if you just turn back for a second, they stop running so then you charge at them before they get the chance to run again…I guess this is what they’re thinking about changing, the cooldown in the AI between times the monster can choose to run away from you once it has stopped doing so.

    • There are definately limits to how far they run. I personally don’t care about them runnign away unless i’m trying to kill them fast. Considering the massive dmg they usually do I let them run and take a little break to kill whatever else may be around or i just kite them in the opposite direction so they don’t run me into more mobs.

      What really bugs me though is the massive range (my opinion) the morlu mages’ meteor attacks have. As far as I can tell i’m out of the visual range of the blast radius effect but still taking a massive hit from it. (same with those exploding grotesque things whatever they’re called)

      however it was definately hilarious to watch my barb bounce around like a beachball against an elite and champion pack of morlu who had vortex and were extra fast. (it was only hell so i was still able to take them out slowly)

    • I agree. What they stated solves very little of the actual problems. It’s why I dropped my barbarian, went with a wizard, and life is so much easier now.

    • They addressed the main issue I’ve had with mortar – you can’t min-range it the way you’re supposed to be able to. Don’t understand why you’re saying it’s “completely broken”. My main issue with it is that there are some areas with ledges or stairways where you can’t see the monster do its casting animation, which makes it difficult or impossible to dodge the mortar in time. Otherwise – and aside from the issue they discussed with overlapping areas – it’s not that bad.

      I’m also not sure how you can judge the changes to monster AI before you’ve experienced them.

    • I believe he stated that this patch helps this in small ways but i got the feeling that another patch with bigger changes, more changes would come. At least thats my hope anyway…..

  2. If in Blizzard’s game you suck from start, you will suck forever. And this text is proof of that.
    Glass-cannons will stay glass-canon, melee will charge a wall.
     
     

  3. Some melee players sure do cry a lot. There are tons of “anti-range” packs in inferno that give ranged players NO CHANCE of defeating. Wizards are constantly jerked into melee range, teleported on top of, or jailed and beaten.  There is something wrong with game design that requires a wizard to invest as much in vitality as a barbarian and to have as good of an armor rating. Barbs are meant to stand toe to toe with monstes. Most wizards are not.

    Now they want to force ranged characters to go to to toe with every mortar pack around (and there are way too many of those.) Bleh, what are they smoking?

    • I suspect you play ranged characters.  Having played both I do find the issues with melee to be more troublesome and the changes listed seem fair.

    • Sounds like someone is mad they won’t be able to death zerg anymore.

      • I tried a build as DH with shadow gloom, you can take 2/3 hits from act3 inferno elites sometimes, but it’s frustrating to not see what’s coming at all so you aren’t even able to activate your dmg reduction skill and get mostly one-shot (like those tongue-asswipes/a firechain dragon from above in your face/etc..). And now maybe mortars aswell when they can shoot across a whole screen? (DH: 70k dmg 4,4k health 300res to all.)
        I thought it was a fun skill build, just not viable enough if you don’t have top top end gear.

    • Wizards have a number of tricks up their sleeve to overcome the few challenges thrown their way – especially when compared to the large number of challenges melee has to deal with. If you’re not using defensive abilities on your wizard, perhaps the problem isn’t with the game, but rather with you.

  4. i really wanted to point out something i found on the other thread, which my comment mightve gone unnoticed as it was the 40th post or something………… This is regarding the Diablo 3 Q&A and the “summary” you guys made.

    [start of my comment]
    just want to point out: 
    This was my decision, and I’ll start by saying that Wyatt and Andrew have talked me out of it. In a future patch (not 1.0.3) we’ll add this.  
    That was from blue…… it says NOT 1.0.3, but your summary says guaranteed 1.0.3:
    Guaranteed decent drops on first kills in NM and Hell will be coming in 1.0.3  
    Might wanna change that………… ?  

    [end of my comment]

    Hopefully a mod can point out if im wrong, or fix it before soemone else read only the bullet points and got the wrong idea……….

    • I actually didn’t write in those bullet points – my original article was edited (twice) with additional information and eventually re-appropriated to a completely new article (authored by Elly). I’ll take a look at it and change whatever is necessary.

      EDIT: seems that the bullet points do say ‘not’ – not sure if that was edited in, but it should be correct now either way.

  5. If only his skill as a designer was a fraction of his skill at defending his bad design decisions.
     
    Unleash the nerf-hounds!

  6. Wow what a shock, 5 comments, 4 whining and ungrateful. 

    I read these with a massive smile plastered across my face because it means melee might now stand a chance past Act 1 inferno without investing a massive amount of time to farm gold (I mean MASSIVE) and overgear on the AH.

    Don’t get me wrong, I don’t want Inferno to be nerfed to be easy, but it needs to be just hard enough that you’re always thinking ‘hmm…if I’d done that a bit differently, I might not have died’ rather than just giving up and switching to a ranged character. These changes seem to be moving in that direction

    • Worst of all they have not even try the changes.
      It is no secret that player always want to insane over the top buff to their class/race. Judging from my experience in Starcraft BW/2.

  7. I was really hoping they’d point out the rather obvious fact that melee-range skills should be doing far, far more damage than ranged ones. But even in close range, Barb/Monk can’t pour out nearly as much damage as the ranged classes can. Name anything the Barb/Monk can do that compares in DPS to Nether Tentacles or Dire Bats or Blizzard??

    • But isn’t that part of the trade off we get for not dying in a single or a couple of hits? It’d be pretty crazy if we could match DPS with the glass cannon characters and just sit there taking hits…

      • That’s part of the trade off, yes, but the other part is simply being much more dangerous up close than the other chars. Since you can’t hit monsters 40 yards away, you gotta be able to tear up the ones 10 yards away.

        • the other part is already traded off with your 33% (i think it was) passive damage reduction no? i play all chars so i can really tell the diff in the ability of taking hits between the DH and wiz to the barb and monk……. Tbh i have easier times playing the barbs and monks than the ranged. Granted im not in inferno yet, but the diff is there for me. I dont play hardcore, but dying is not an enjoyment for me.

          There are also much more effects from barb and monk skills that helps with survivability, such as dmg reduction, dodge for monks, knockbacks, stuns, healing. sure it means less DPS, but those tricks are lacking from DHs and wiz.

          • Yep all melee get a 30% damage reduction for being melee characters, a wizard and a barb with the same life get blasted with an AOE attack the Wizard dies and the barb can stil have 30% of his life left.

          • “Granted, I am not in Inferno yet…”

            That’s where I stopped reading…no offense.

    • I agree with this. Kind of seems common sense that great risk should match great reward. 

      Barbarian and Monk do not generate much Fury or Spirit without dealing hits at close range, therefore making it hard to deal damage without taking damage in most cases.

      The low risk of WD, Wiz and DH being able to regenerate resource while running and kiting should be matched with less rewarding damage output. 

    • Earthquake.
      2065% damage.
      ’nuff said. 

      • DPS – Damage Per Second. 2065% dmg over 2 mins is crap.

        • 2000% damage over 75 seconds, more like.
          And no, it isn’t crap.
          It is bursty as hell and I am one rotationing 95% of act 1 inferno elites in my low dps tank gear.
          🙂  

          • I’m not saying that’s not a useful skill, giant spike bursts have their purpose, but they need good “stead stream of damage” skills too, a la Nether Tentacles. The poor Monk in particular is screwed in this regard.

          • Haha I remember those days :>

            I assume you also have WoB in a slot? Pro-tip, try to do without earthquake, you can definitely do just fine with one long CD ability in act 1 Inferno with some decent resist all gear, and it gives you another slot for a more fun skill you can use more often 🙂

          • when you succeed with that build in Act 2 Inferno, please let me know, unless you’ve spent 7m on AH, then – please – don’t…

        • Frenzy/revenge with provocation.
          It may not be fast, but if you’re building tanky then you can’t forget that we have a lot more survivability than these coward ranging classes 😉
          Monks can stay alive for so long against impossible mobs that it’s not funny.
          Every class has its boons and flaws, you just have to compensate with the appropriate skills and passives. 

        • It’s 2000% damage over 8 seconds with a 75-120 second cooldown. The big thing though is that it’s AOE with 18 yard radius. Totally burst damage like inert said and perfect for certain situations. WotB is definately better single target DPS though.

          • ^ 250% damage for 8 seconds over a large AOE (that the base skill, runed versions add even more damage). Nothing else in game does that much damage in terms of DPS, the closest i can find on unruned version is 220% and that an other barb skill.
            WotB is not unless your talking about the rune insanity version, but then I raise you WotB + Runed Earthquake (250+X)*2 dps.

    • Well they’re supposedly revising life leech penalties, so perhaps that will keep us alive like it did in the previous Diablos and pretty much any other ARPG. Combine good % life leech with high damage, and then you can arrive at the build you’re describing.
       
      Here’s an FYI on current Life Leech vs. Life on Hit:
      Life leeches 100% in Normal, less in later difficulties down to just 20% in Inferno. The trick is that life leech isn’t reduced by AoE skills like Life on Hit i.e if Seismic Slam has 5 percussions, each one of those only grants 1/5th of your total life on hit, but life leech gives you the full x%.

  8. “I’m also working with one of our gameplay engineers to make it so if you sidestep the Dark Berserker’s power hit (where he brings his giant mace down), he doesn’t turn to track you as he swings (though that change probably won’t make 1.0.3)”.

    I has a question.
    Why won’t this make 1.0.3?
    There is a huge dark berserker purple boss mob guarding the bridge in act 2 before Caldeum that has the same move, and that doesn’t follow you when you move around him in melee range; he smashes straight in front of him.
    Why don’t they just copy and paste his AI onto the smaller zerkers?
    The first time I fought a small berserker, I got one hit because I thought they were just smaller versions of the big guy. 

  9. Unless they successfully fix the melee and ranged gap, or else melee will suffer even more from the increase in the repair cost because they just die more in the process.
    They should just not release these two fix together, release the increase in repair cost fix until they are sure of the melee and ranged gap truly being reduced.

  10. I like these upcoming changes….. Also, isn’t anyone bothered by the beginning statement “it’s a known secret…”? Igood enjoy a seriously funny oxymoron 🙂

    • You’re not the only one who facepalmed at “it’s a known secret.”

      It would also be nice if Nizaris actually knew how death penalties worked rather than spewing speculation. Elite enrages are not related to deaths; a reset to full health will happen to any monster left alone for too long and also isn’t (directly) related to death.

  11. All I can say is that I’m glad they’re actually considering HC play in all of this. I read the first bit about range vs melee not being where they want it and was all ready to get annoyed that they weren’t considering the fact that the most progressed HC players (that keep us up to date on their progress and didn’t get there via WP bug) so far are the melee ones.

  12. Right now it’s that in hardcore, death represent a loss of hours and hours of effort, while in softcore deaths are nothing at all. I understand the whole point is that softcore shouldn’t penalize it as much as hardcore, but right now deaths are nothing but a trivial amount of gold and, assuming a short walk distance, an even more trivial amount of time. I think you’d have to increase death penalties tenfold to get softcore to even 2% the frustration of hardcore… and that would be about the right level to have it at.

  13. Wow, never thought I’d see the day where someone complains about too many death penalties.

    I’m pretty sure I read an article on this very site about the concerning lack of death penalties…  

  14. If anything the death penalties are not severe enough in SC, not after 1.0.3 either. It should be increased substantially to make death meaningful.
    Maybe making Nephalem Valor go away on death wasn’t such a bad idea after all?

    I’m not so sure about the alleged difference between melee and range really. Barbs can become insanely strong with good enough gear, making most ranged chars envious.
    The problem is, as Cheng seems to argue, not that melee chars are weaker currently, but that the game allows for suicidal glass cannon builds.

    They should probably try to address that – by having harsher death penalties and lower the effectiveness of burst damage in general – rather than make it a matter of balance between melee and ranged.

    • Lose NV on death? Perhaps one stack per death would be fair.

      • These might be too much of a nerf to ranges classes though. I don’t think you can expect people with low health pools to not just get surprise 1-shotted occasionally – although I’m totally up for incentivising people to not die anywhere near as often, it makes the game much more fun!

        • Ranged classes shouldn’t get oneshotted occasionally unless they play badly. Hopefully 1.0.3 rebalancing and probably also later patches will help with that.

          When they make inferno easier, they ought to penalize mistakes harder as well.
          Otherwise we will just end up with an easier inferno which people continues to graveyard rush.

  15. The only issue I have with death atm is that friggin’ timer increase. It’s a pain having to watch a champ pack that you’ve died to a number of times ‘camp’ on your respawn point and heal back to full health while you’re forced to watch and wait for 20+ seconds.

    That all being said, that is essentially death-zerging, so I guess there will be a ‘I’m calling it quits’ point much earlier than that in 1.0.3. 

    • Some champs have their hp back in no time, others stay at the hp you left them with no matter how long you take to track them down and how many times you die. Havent figured out yet what dictates this ingame, but I wish they wouldnt heal back to full hp, it just sucks like that.

      And they want to increase range and dead zone of mortar? What do they mean by deadzone, its aoe radius? And they better fix its damage output, im at 82% mitigation and 55k hp and it takes 4-5 of them to take me out. Ouch

      • So, the mortars shot after patch higher and wider. So you can as melee run to the mobs and wouldnt be hit from the mortas with there ranged attack. If so, the wider attack would/could hit the ranged chars the they stand on sreenborder for example.
        Its good, but i hate this mortars, they do so much dmg. Is the monstertype light light enchanted mobs in D2 with fast or strong attributes.  Bähhhh

      • Dead-zone = the area immediately around the mob which if you stand in, mortar just goes over your head and doesn’t hit you. Right now, on Hell and Inferno, it’s a bit too small to let melee characters use it

  16. I love the method with which they think. The only thing that is unfortunate for the wizards/DH/WD is those glass-cannon-invested people will be set back for a while and will have to work up another set of gear to farm efficiently in higher difficulty acts. I’ve seen certain people already do it though, especially in hardcore streams like Krippi’s WD. It’s just frustrating to watch people glass cannon zerg Act 4 inferno down with mediocre (but yes, high dps) gear while I continue to get pummeled in Act 2 Inferno with 800 resists but no stormshield/string of ears, ~800LoH, etc.

  17. Glad they’re buffing the death penalties. Dying is a pretty trivial matter as it is. Death-zerging is a huge problem that needs fixing.

  18. Well, duh… ranged is generally better in all games, for the pretty obvious reason that they CAN HIT WITHOUT BEING HIT, which is kind of powerful…
    Just like a gun is better than a sword, it’s that simple.
    Also, casters are almost always better than non-casters, for the same obvious reason that the ability to change reality is generally more useful than the ability to shoot peas.
     
    You have to be an idiot or ignorant of RPG conventions to play a melee class or a non-caster in any hard game, unless you are really sure that it’s indeed better.
     

  19. I don’t see how “nerfing” caster chars will help melee char to survive.  💡
    Have I missed something ?

    • ^ The changes to the way mobs who are to help Melee out. Dead zone on mortar = melee don’t need to worry when they are beating on the guy. AI changes IE wasp not turning round and PB shotting us with 4 bees etc.

  20. If u had read, atm nothing/minimal changes for caster or ranged chars. There are some changes in the “game mechanic”, so that will help melees and dont affect ranged.

    • Hum…to be precise :
      I see the “general game mecanic measure” to mainly make the life harder for casters and I still don’t see how it will help melee char.
       

  21. I dunno why but i found this part hilarious.

    “I actually spent some extra time the other day to make sure if a Sand Wasp runs away from you, and you start chasing the wasp, it doesn’t turn and shoot 4 bees in your face ”

    In soviet sanctuary, bees kite you!

    • Yeah that made me laugh too – it’s so true, when you finally think you’ve caught up with one of them, only to by 4 shotted at the last second

  22. Beez with the Fast stat were a PITA, I’m glad they are nerfing Beez’s behavior.

  23. I don’t like the idea of increasing the range on Mortar, I already feel it’s one of the hardest affixes for ranged to deal with, mostly because of how often they throw the mortars, you literally can’t stand still for a millisecond.

  24. following the HC forums the disparity seems to be the reverse…. All the inferno firsts are being done by barb/monk (from what it looks like). And just the other day didn’t we have a class breakdown for HC that showed Barb/monk as the two most play HC classes?
    I’m playing A barb currently in HC, and I never really felt like my sorc buddy had it any easier than me (especially since i have tools like zerker rage, leap, and heal-charge plus a 30% flat reduction built in)
    I’m actually more concerned for my ranged brothers and sisters because of the increased number of CC related mob affixes (vortex,jail,frozen) likely to occur. But I do realize that HC makes up only 4% of the charactes (coming from the article posted earlier) so I guess it doesn’t make a lot of sense to balance around that

  25. HC play pretty much does suggest the exact opposite, reinforcing that the classes difference in terms of progress and easy of play is minimal IF anything ranged have it harder. I play both a monk and dh in hc, and the dh has a much tougher and more dangerous time. Do no SC players wonder why the most progressed chars in HC are all barbs and monks? Why the pros are all rolling monks and barbs constantly 😛

  26. I’ve played both barb and wizard in inferno acts 2-3. Its just gear. Get the right gear. 

    Wizard can kite sure but you have to run around all over the place. Its best to find a circle to kite in so you can grab health orbs. If you don’t have enough damage it can get annoying but I guess you can still power through and kill stuff undergeared.

    Barb, sure you need enough gear to stand in melee range but with that gear you get to stick around and avoid bad stuff while easily grabbing orbs and healing yourself with skills.

    I dont really find it broken. I find people what to whine so it gets nerfed so they can beat it…. then they are free to whine that there is nothing left to do in the game.

    I’m against an inferno nerf. 

  27. I play HC and can say that while i mostly have higher survavility than my ranged fellows my dmg output just sucks.
    The real conclusion to this is that ranged are the dps and melee the punching-bag-tank.

    So yes, they told us Diablo 3 would not have the “Trinity” system (tank, healer, dps), and they actually said the truth, they removed the healer class…. All hail the Bipolarity.

  28. The whole “melee has it bad” is a myth. In Inferno, ALL classes have it rough, melee or ranged, just cause Inferno is a troll fest that removes all control away from the player. But if any single class has it the worst, it is, yes, you guessed it, a RANGED char – that char being the Demon Hunter. Very, very poorly designed class. Almost anything 2-shots them, and unlike their Wizard and Barb counter parts, DH’s have no “tanking” abilities or damage reduction passives/defense skills to that allow them to mitigate damage. Barb has Revenge, Ignore Pain, War Cry, etc….Wiz of course has Force Armor, better all around defensive skills, and in general is a less item dependent class than the DH is.

    The reason for this is, Dex only gives dodge bonuses to the DH, which is utterly useless on Inferno. Strength gives to armor and Intelligence contributes to resistances, which are far more useful. This makes DH the most item dependent class in the game, since they are required to search for items that give to armor and resist all bonuses since their main stat does not contribute to either of these things. Wiz is also a fragile class, but at least they can take some hits – almost anything in Inferno can 2-shot a DH.

    So all this talk that melee has it harder, is just not so. Even in nightmare and hell, my DH had a very difficult time. My Barb on the other hand, has been quite dominant thus far, with the Wiz coming somewhere between the two, but probably closer to Barb.

  29. lol is this a joke, barbs and monks are the best endgame tanks, i saw a barb stand toe to toe with izzy and his health never dropped below 100%

    learn2gear

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