Wizard’s Arcane Power on Crit on the “Wyatt” Board


Clothes may make the man, but in Diablo 3 and Reaper of Souls, gear makes the Nephalem, and one of the most important affixes is the Wizard’s Arcane Power on Crit, or “APoC.” That affix does what it sounds like; instantly generating X amount of the Wizard’s resource each time a crit is DiabloWikiproc‘ed. Of course it’s more complicated than that, with different skills carrying different (hidden) proc rates, which are adjusted to match the power and amount of proc chances for each skill. A free skill that hits lots of enemies per cast has to have a low proc coefficient or else it would instantly refill via DiabloWikiAPoC. Expensive skills that only hit a few enemies can have a higher proc chance. And so on.

That skill-balancing complexity was largely worked out over the course of Diablo 3, but it’s become an issue again in Reaper of Souls thanks to numerous game changes and new types of Wizard gear. Wyatt Cheng provided some insight into the mathematical and other issues the developers are grappling with in a series of posts on Reddit, and you can read them below:

We are indeed experimenting with a reduction of AP-on-Crit.

At the moment the default AP regen is 10/s. A standard AP-On-Crit loadout increases this easily to 22 or more and it was definitely heading into the territory of spamming expensive spenders non-stop right out of the gate. Reaching that point should be a state you aspire to and work towards (usually with some legendary items or a sweet set bonus) – not something that’s handed out virtually for free.

It completely negates the use of Signature spells, and we do strive for a rhythm of alternating between your left and right mouse buttons, as well as all 6 skills on your bar. It’s okay if the most dedicated players reach a point where they no longer need a signature spell, but this should not be the case for people who just put on 2 easily-acquired items and a particular skill loadout.

Yes – we are pushing for people to do more than spam one skill. Running out of resource should be a very real concern – that’s the point of having a resource system at all. You decide when to spend your resource. Sometimes you save it up, sometimes you spend it liberally. If you never run out of resource, what is the difference between a cheap spell on an expensive spell? In theory, a high resource cost spell should do more damage but you can’t use it as much. A low resource cost spell you can use more often but does less damage. What we were seeing on both the Witch Doctor and the Wizard is that people simply spam their most expensive spell possible and hope the monsters are dead before you run out of resource.

The Barbarian had reduction to resource regeneration from passives as well. We’ll continue to monitor the Witch Doctor, the Wizard and the Barbarian. We’re concerned both with making sure all 6 classes have good power levels relative to one another, and we’re also concerned that all 6 classes have a variety of fun playstyles available to them.

Quick follow-up for clarity. We intentionally did not modify any legacy items. We have a core value on the team to take great lengths not to modify items on the live game that people own. The reduction of AP-on-Crit applies to items dropped in Loot 2.0 only.

Click through for followups, where Wyatt answers questions about whether some legacy Wizard gear with higher APoC values might be better than new-found Loot 2.0 gear with lower ApoC values, and how the devs have worked to keep affixes from becoming too complicated in function or description.

I’m worried that legacy AP-on-crit Sources/Hats might still be preferable to Loot 2.0 items. For Sources you generally have 4 stats you care about:

  • Damage: ~250 on live L60 and ~350 on beta L70
  • Crit Chance: 10% on both live L60 and beta L70
  • AP on Crit: 10 on live L60 vs 4 on beta L70
  • Intelligence: 250 on live L60 vs 600+ (?) on beta L70
  • For Hats you generally have 4 stats you care about:

  • Crit Chance: 6% on both live L60 and beta L70
  • AP on Crit: 10 on live L60 vs 4 on beta L70
  • Intelligence: 250 on live L60 vs 600+ (?) on beta L70
  • Socket: 1 on both live L60 and beta L70
  • So the choice comes down to:

    Legacy:

  • 20 AP on crit
  • vs Loot 2.0

  • 8 AP on crit
  • 100 damage
  • 600-1300 more Intelligence
  • Skill % bonus on Hat
  • Potential for new Legendary effects
  • I admit that a lot of the new Legendary effects are tantalizing, but gaining 2.5x more AP on crit and the ability to use your most damaging skills non-stop is hard to pass up. I’d honestly prefer a lifesteal-like reduction at level 70 just so I don’t feel compelled to use legacy items (although I’m sure this isn’t going to be too popular an opinion with some people).

    It’s okay if the most dedicated players reach a point where they no longer need a signature spell, but this should not be the case for people who just put on 2 easily-acquired items and a particular skill loadout.

    In that case, have you considered making the rarer legendaries roll higher AP-on-crit values, approaching the legacy values? Or adding AP-on-crit to non-Source/Hat legendaries? Is there a Wizard set (torment-only?) that has AP-on-crit as its powerful set bonus?

    Yes, you bring up a great point.

    We discussed this internally and to be honest, we’re “worried” that legacy AP-on-crit sources/hats might still be preferable. I put “worried” in quotes because we ran some analysis and looked at the new legendaries are we’re fairly confident people will find Loot 2.0 items to be better but we’ve been wrong before and I’m willing to be wrong again.

    As you mention – the new Legendary effects is one of the things we’re banking on. We’re hoping they are tantalizing enough to pull people forward.

    We considered a lot of things. We considered a Lifesteal-like reduction going into 70. We considered nerfing the live items directly (but as previously mentioned, we’re very loathe to do that). We considered significantly increasing AP costs on the most egregious spells. We considered removing AP-on-crit completely from orbs but significantly adding +flat damage so the likelihood people “graduated” out of them was extremely high (but this would cause a significant ripple effect of balance across all items in the game and all classes). We considered massive nerfs to proc scalars on the Wizard but that seemed unfairly across-the-board punishing just to fix the AP problem.

    It’s really hard to say for sure how things will play out, but it’s an issue we’ll be monitoring closely.

    Regarding AP-on-crit for rarer legendaries. I think part of this nerf definitely leaves room for Wizard-set bonuses in the future. Maybe it will be AP-on-crit as a set bonus – though more likely we’ll use some of the space we’ve freed up to do something more interesting like getting a freecast of Arcane Orb when you meet certain criteria or letting one of the cheaper spells become a generator in a manner similar to the Demon Hunter’s Kridershot.

    Wyatt – Should have bit the bullet a year ago in RoS development when you toyed with stat caps and converted to a Ratings System a-la WoW. APonCrit isn’t quite %-age based, but could have been done. Just raise the rating required for 10 AP @ 70 higher. Problems across all legacy itemization obsoletetion solved! (No need to block legacy rerolling either)
    ie – 10 AP on Crit converted exactly to 100 AP-on-Crit Rating.
    @ 60 need 10 rating per 1 AP on Crit.
    @ 70 need 25 rating per 1 AP on Crit.

    So your legacy item with 100 AP-on-Crit-Rating still returns 10 @ level 60…. but only 4 @ 70. Item stays the same, new ilvl 70 items also have the same 100 rating cap, but with shiny new legendary affixes.

    Was there a reason the Dev team did not want to convert to that type of system? It worked for Blizzard across many many expansions, and I know D3 folks really hate hearing about WoW… but c’mon.. Thunderfury? XD
    We’re trying to avoid ratings for the forseeable future on Diablo III. Believe me – it’s tempting. Ratings have the advantage that you can continually scale up the stats by making them worth less per point when you move to higher levels. We could have done crit rating, crit damage rating, move speed rating, ApocRating, etc.

    The downside of ratings is that it becomes extremely difficult to gauge your gear. Gear is already hard enough to evaluate – but we always have it in the back of our minds to try and make things better over time, not worse. Going with ratings is basically saying “No human being could hope to evaluate this gear, just go to d3up” (not that I have anything against d3up, but I think the game should be playable by savvy players without needing it). This is why the new properties we’ve added are things like cooldown reduction, resource cost reduction, and area damage. We’re trying to provide stats that people can evaluate without needing a spreadsheet.

    Internally we had people suggest things like “super-crit” or “crit-from-strength” as new stats to introduce in RoS. I’ll let you imagine what these do. The problem is – these stats added complexity without making choices more interesting -and worse – they further made evaluating gear into a giant math problem.

    TL;DR: Ratings let us scale gear but make gear harder to evaluate at a glance. The design team has decided to accept a lot of pain in order to keep the gear legible to humans.

    It’s ironic this is an issue for the Wizard, since as we’ve discussed several times on the podcast during the RoS beta; the Wizard is awesome now. Buffs all around have made many more skills and builds viable, and the general combat changes in RoS have decreased the importance (necessity) of using multiple defensive or crowd control skills. This gives the Wizard (and Demon Hunter) a lot more survivability and opens up many more builds and play styles. I just hope the APoC issue doesn’t derail that in some way for the Wizard, though it sounds like Wyatt’s got it under control.

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    1. I remember when I was running Spectral Blades/Meteor build on live months ago. I got enough APoC and crit to spam Meteor all the time but as a fun of SB, I didn’t liked it. I felt that it’s not what I want. I dumped Meteor and some APoC from hat, went for Storm Chaser (Energy Twister) and lived happily ever after.

    2. “It completely negates the use of Signature spells”

      This is indeed a real problem. With two APoC items and a moderate amount of crit (no Legendaries needed) AP becomes a non-issue. I enjoy my Ray of Frost / Blizzard cold Wizard in short play sessions, but in the long term spamming one skill quickly becomes very boring. Then there’s the issue that the power progression is screwed up compared to the other classes.

      I think APoC could easily be halved in the expansion and it would remain a very good stat. Some Wizard Legendaries should have it in slots where otherwise it couldn’t spawn though.

    3. “It completely negates the use of Signature spells”

      It’s not that because Signature spells, except Spectral Blades, just suck and nobody want to use them because of their usability vs. dmg/s?!

      • The issue is efficiency not damage. Right now resource can be much easily made irrelevant by the Wizard and (from what I’ve heard) the WD than by the other classes. Because of this efficiency isn’t a consideration for them anymore, so you can get away with sloppy play like spamming your big spenders almost constantly, even when doing so is overkill.

        Signature skills actually serve their intended role really well. If you use them right you can clean up trash mobs with them easily and retain your resource spenders for when you really need them. When this efficiency issue is sorted out maybe some of the Signature skill’s viability should be looked at again, but overall I think they are in a good place. Right now however for the Wizard and WD if they were to become viable their damage had to be increased almost to the level of resource spenders.

        • “Signature skills actually serve their intended role really well. If you use them right you can clean up trash mobs with them easily and retain your resource spenders for when you really need them. ”

          That was the point of my post. They are not that good (except Spectral Blades). Why would you use something less efficient with less damage when you can boost your resource regen. and spam resource spenders.

          This problem is just another side effect of their kill-everything-for-moar-loot mantra. D3 need wide range of combat tactics, like better buffing and debuffing, better crowd control, lower resist, lower defense, stop healing, reflect dmg, etc. Then you can create wider range of skills with better properties, not just dmg and resource regen.

          • “Why would you use something less efficient with less damage when you can boost your resource regen. and spam resource spenders.”

            And this was my point. There’s nothing inherently wrong with this. The only problem is that the Wizard and WD can do this much more easily than the other classes, creating an imbalance in power progression. In my opinion bypassing game mechanics like class resources should require much more effort than equipping 3-4 Rare items with specific stats.

    4. Yo dawg I herd u like nerf so we put nerf in ur nerf so u can nerf while u nerf.

      Seriously Blizz, knock off the telling us how to have fun. You made these skills that deliberately suck and by design you want to use as little as possible then bitch when people want to use them as little as possible.

      D2 didn’t do this. At high enough levels Firebolt actually outdamages Fireball (no AoE though).

      • But if we don’t balance this non-competitive, cooperative-only, essentially single-player game, then… SOMETHING might happen! Think of the children!

        • Herp Derp you’re so funny, you realize they make these changes for the overall enjoyment of the game right? It’s not fun having resource, that you don’t even worry about because it’s unlimited.

          I’ve been playing snoozefest archon mode for almost 2 years now, glad they are looking at apoc.

          • Eh, overall enjoyment is a tricky thing. I think the problem is that designers of games these days are very much responsible for some combination of herding cats and saving people from their worse natures.

            Nothing MAKES you play Archon snoozefest mode, other than your own desire to be efficient/whatever. I haven’t been playing snoozefest anything, but using random skills, and that’s awesome. If I get Archon, well then RNG decided that I should have a stronger play session that day than another day where I have to be more creative and less “hold down right click”-y. But “overall enjoyment of the game” is completely subjective, and while they’re certainly entitled to attempt to maximize enjoyment over as much of the playerbase as they can, the real issue is that the playerbase will willfully engage in path-of-least-resistance activities and then complain that those activities are possible, rather than just not doing them in the first place.

            • You do realize Diablo is a game about farming items efficiently?

              So,,, yeah. Of course players will play most efficiently, because people value their time. Efficiency shouldn’t come at the cost of enjoyment, it should go together hand in hand.

              And yes, “they’re certainly entitled to attempt to maximize enjoyment over as much of the playerbase as they can”, and the playerbase has every right to complain and criticize their changes. No matter how annoying and childish most of you come off as. 😉

            • I disagree. To you, and perhaps others, Diablo is about farming items efficiently.

              I don’t really like games about farming items efficiently. Or farming items. Or doing things efficiently. I’ve never played any ARPGs to do that. So… meh. I mean, I’m glad you think it’s awesome (no sarcasm, truly) to farm items more efficiently, but I just don’t really care that much. Essentially people are asking for Blizzard to make a path of least resistance that’s more entertaining than the current path of least resistance, but there’s also a shortcut — just stop taking the path of least resistance and entertain yourself on another path.

            • “You do realize Diablo is a game about farming items efficiently?”

              No, it’s about having fun, just like almost any other video game ever. If you’re not playing a game with the goal of having fun, you’re doing it wrong.

          • Herp derp indeed.

            “Hey guys, I play a build that uses 0 resources, it’s relevant to a thread about recovering resources!”

            And yes, it’s very enjoyable to give overly verbal demons a handjob with your sigs instead of ya know, killing them and taking their stuff. You and the devs are right. We cannot be trusted to have fun on our own. PROTECT US FROM OURSELVES AND OUR UNFUN WAYS OH MIGHTY WYATT!

            Oh and last I checked D2 was fun, and no one past 20 cared about resources.

            • This is a long term fallacy – because players are doing it, it is a fun thing to do. But so many Diablo players would rather be “efficient” than doing something fun.

              If I found that simply pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds was the absolute most efficient way to gain items and power, hordes of dumb sheep Diablo power gamers would start pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds.

              They’d do it even though no one anywhere in their right mind would think that pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds is fun.

              And then those same people would complain about nerfing their so-called fun when they make it so that pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds is no longer viable gameplay strategy.

            • “Dumb sheep power gamers”.

              As opposed to the guy copy pasting off Blizzard amirite?

            • “As opposed to the guy copy pasting off Blizzard amirite?”

              Huh? I have no idea what this comment is in reference to.

    5. Nerf all the things!

    6. Here we go again. “Uh oh, people are having fun with a class. Let’s water it down and make it less fun because that’s how WE WANT them to play the game.” *eyeroll*

      • I have fun with my HC Disintagrate Entropy Wiz (leveling but still). And I have no APoC. Let them halve it!

      • To be able to spam a expensive resource spenders is fun for sure, but should be a long term goal. Not just: “I put on this rare hat” Done!

        If you want to be able to spam an expensive skills like that, invest in ‘reduced resource cost’ and pick resource generating skills.

        I think you will have more fun after that because now you earned the right to use that play-style rather than just been given it for free.

        • “I think you will have more fun blah blah.” Again, telling someone else how much fun you think they’ll have or how you think they should play…nosir.

    7. I like primary skills when I can actually use them to “make some sense” on my builds(DH AoE bolas, WD bouncing skulls I don’t need to aim, the recent barb weapon throw, Monk thunder teleporting punch/forked punch – names missing, bnet is down at moment, sorry).

      Wizard’s primary skills just aren’t fun imo – they are just there, generating resource. I tried to make the passives work, but it didn’t. I don’t like spectral blades (I use Magic Missiles for D&D flavor).

      Maybe I should, it looks like Crissaegrim Castlevania:SoTN – too bad I can’t kill stuff with it before dying… But we will be probably YOLOing in normal, so maybe I can! :p

      Slightly OT, but I spammed Blizzard for the majority of my D2 carrer and it was fun. Glacial spike as a primary skill would be cool… 🙂

      In a more serious note: the primary skills should be more compelling. Especially the wizard ones. (To be honest, I only fell like having choices with barb and WD atm)

      • How you can not like Spactral Blades? That skill made me play wiz 🙂
        Glacial Spike in D3 is nice, sad that it’s Cold not Arcane, but that would be stupid.

    8. They probably should make APoC only work for signature spells

      • This is a passive…

        • It’s not on crit, it’s on everything. That, plus Lightning Blast, and it’s almost as good than old APoC rates.

          That last bit is really disheartening, though. Ratings aren’t that complicated; more crit rating is better than less crit rating. You’re always going to have to “do the math” to compare different stats between each other, but converting it to a rating doesn’t cause that. They already have this w/ armor and resistances. Maybe they don’t want to do ratings b/c they’re afraid of proving that they aren’t very good at math.

          • Ratings are just like taking shortcuts. They, in my opinion, are poor design. You can do whatever you want with the values then and that’s cheap. I want them to take the hard way. After all we want Diablo game.

    9. I tend to enjoy the game more when my resources have value. People are hating the barb, but he’s actually my favorite these days with the razor thin balance you have to maintain for Fury generation.

      • I feel the same way. I played a Wizard and a Barb on the PTR. My Wiz is far more powerful, yet I enjoyed playing the Barb much more. Managing Fury added depth to the gameplay that my Wizard just didn’t have. With her all I had to do to reach peak efficiency was follow these complicated steps:

        1) Maintain my 3 damage buffs.
        2) If enemy = Elite then spam Ray of Frost else cast Blizzard and continue pulling enemies.

    10. If they want us to use signature spells, they must make them appealing: all possibilities from melee to range (which is the case but with a big advantage to melee) and all elements. Magic missile must have a rune for all elements.

      • On your last point, I’m pretty sure MM has a rune for all elements. If it doesn’t, it’s only missing Lightning, in which case Electrocute or Shock Pulse would be better for you anyway. Wizards don’t get Physical or Holy-element skills, and MM is Arcane by default, with Conflagrate for Fire (adds piercing and DoT) and Glacial Spike for Cold (freezes enemies).

        In terms of your general post, though, I tend to agree. I think that the main offenders are Shock Pulse (especially) and Electrocute. MM is in a good place right now, and it has a legendary that makes it shoot 3 shots instead of 1 by default, so it has legendary support. Spectral Blades is in the best spot of all of them, as the Wizard has an easier time surviving melee-range now, and Spectral Blades does the most damage of the 4 signature skills, as well as having a decent spread of elements and good extra effects. The main problem with Electrocute is mostly that its runes deal too little damage compared to the other options, though I feel that the rune that creates charged bolts on crit is pretty good as a wave-clearer. Shock Pulse, meanwhile, has pretty weak values on all of its runes except for Living Lightning, which is so much better than any of the others that none of them are really viable compared to it. Shock Pulse is also a lot weaker than the other ones because the bolts move randomly and the range is not much better than melee range, making Living Lightning feel even better comparatively. I think that if Shock Pulse shot 5 or 6 bolts instead of 3, and had them travel a little longer in a little straighter of a line, its runes would be a lot more viable.

        As for the problem of signature skills overall, I think the best solution would simply be to make them AP-generators instead of simply free skills. With the exception of WD, every other class has resource-generators and resource-spenders, and by-and-large this has led to pretty decent resource management for the other classes. Furthermore, if the Wizard’s signature skills generated AP, then cutting the APoC amounts would not be as detrimental, as you could still recoup a lot of AP from playing with a signature skill, especially if you used the Prodigy passive as well.

        As for what to do about items, I would take APoC off of Sources and make it spawn as a special affix on Wands and Wizard Hats. The default in D3C is 10 APoC; I’d probably reduce it to a range of between 5-7. This gives you 10-14 APoC if you have both a Wand and a Wizard Hat with APoC, and gives you a benefit without having spells be quite as spammable as they are now. Meanwhile, I would have all Sources spawn with an inherent bonus to elemental damage, in the standard range of 10-17%, to compensate for the loss of APoC. Doing so has the benefit of pushing elemental damage, which acts as an alternate source of damage rather than crits; as a result, this subtly pushes players towards playing for straight elemental damage rather than crits, which negates part of the problem of AP on ‘crit’.

      • /quote/
        If they want us to use signature spells, they must make them appealing
        /quote/

        yep. million times this.

        if you want to slap zombies to silly with signature spells be our guest.
        their DMGs are so rubbish, the whole effort becomes a click-fest to mediocrity.
        one can do more DMG by pushing monsters into mud puddles and hurting their feelings then using signature spells.

        psshh..!

    11. Flux, will you happily drink the tears of the wizards? LOL

      • Wizards seem to be taking this change pretty gracefully. They know there are lots of ways to maintain AP without needing to stack APoC.

      • If the Wizard were made wildly OP for a year+ and the fans who mercilessly exploited the OPness whined when it was finally fixed, then yes. We’re got a ways to go on that, yet.

    12. Or they realize they could just use legacy items. That said, what other ways, other than possibly large amounts of cost reduction?

    13. QUOTE

      "Signature skills actually serve their intended role really well. If you use them right you can clean up trash mobs with them easily and retain your resource spenders for when you really need them. "
      
      That was the point of my post. They are not that good (except Spectral Blades). Why would you use something less efficient with less damage when you can boost your resource regen. and spam resource spenders.
      
      This problem is just another side effect of their kill-everything-for-moar-loot mantra. D3 need wide range of combat tactics, like better buffing and debuffing, better crowd control, lower resist, lower defense, stop healing, reflect dmg, etc. Then you can create wider range of skills with better properties, not just dmg and resource regen.

      Exactly. There’s only dps. No real dynamics between skills, so of course only a few are good at any time.

      • And therefore no one should try to do anything to improve that or to make skill use and selection a little more involved?

        • Which would mean:

          Enemies have less HP, but mitigation and varying resistances.
          The stuff he said.
          Big enemies THAT ARE ACTUALLY WORTH KILLING.
          Several skills per utility effect (countering Frozen, for example).

          Not herp derp auto attack.

    14. QUOTE

      To be able to spam a expensive resource spenders is fun for sure, but should be a long term goal. Not just: "I put on this rare hat" Done!
      
      If you want to be able to spam an expensive skills like that, invest in 'reduced resource cost' and pick resource generating skills.
      
      I think you will have more fun after that because now you earned the right to use that play-style rather than just been given it for free.

      ________
      ________
      ________
      ________

      vs

      ________
      ________
      ________
      Arcane Power on Crit

      (x2-3)

      vs

      ________
      ________
      ________
      Reduced Resource Cost

      (x2-3)

      Do tell, how is one earned and one not?

      Or you can make the generators not suck (hi Monks).

      • In it’s current form, you’ll need aprox 2 rare items to be able to spam recourse spenders like frozen orb forever with ApoC.

        Are you suggesting that 2 rare items with maximum reduced resource cost will be equally good? You’ll need RRC in almost every spot to be able to do that + a lot of paragon spent in it. There are some legendary affixes that can help too, cinder coat is one of them. But that is a legendary affix, they are supposed to be game changing.

        Maybe Apoc should be a legendary affix too?

        And wizards don’t have generators you know. Your knowledge shows how much you actually have played a wizard without the mandatory stat ApoC, which is exactly 0 minutes and 0 seconds, because its mandatory.

        • Or you can not pick at semantics, as you know full well what I meant. And the quoted guy said the same thing. It does have a cost though, an affix (and then crit is another affix). Since you didn’t say how much reduced resource cost actually gives, I dunno, but any skill like that is two hander bait or worthless and two handers suck in RoS so…. Moot point?

    15. Considering what they did in vanilla beta to the Hunter, and what the Crusader turned out to have, are they really that fracking lazy and uninspired to just give every single class a generate/spend resource? There’s no concept of different resources to develop a different feel and rhythm to combat amongst the classes, at least not right now.

    16. QUOTE

      This is a long term fallacy - because players are doing it, it is a fun thing to do. But so many Diablo players would rather be "efficient" than doing something fun. 
      
      If I found that simply pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds was the absolute most efficient way to gain items and power, hordes of dumb sheep Diablo power gamers would start pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds. 
      
      They'd do it even though no one anywhere in their right mind would think that pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds is fun.
      
      And then those same people would complain about nerfing their so-called fun when they make it so that pressing nothing but the letter Q exactly every 7 seconds is no longer viable gameplay strategy.

      If that is someone’s idea of fun, I have no problem with it as long as it is offline/LAN and doesn’t intrude upon other people’s values of enjoyment.

      Consider also that time is limited. Efficiency may not necessarily be a concept that is associated with enjoyment, but rather may be something that holds value to gamers limited by time, or to those who do not desire to invest hundreds/thousands of hours into just one game.

      The reality is that the loot hunt iterated in D3 has lost its appeal to many gamers, myself included. With that said, pressing “Q” doesn’t sound like a bad idea.

      I’m giving the devs one last chance to redeem themselves with RoS. However, I’m not holding my breath. When the time comes, I’ll take my own values of “fun” and move on from the series.

      Oh well, there are plenty of great games out there. It’s just unfortunate that I cannot personally say the same about D3.

      • “If that is someone’s idea of fun, I have no problem with it as long as it is offline/LAN and doesn’t intrude upon other people’s values of enjoyment.”

        And if that is someone’s idea of fun, I have no problem with a game’s designer not giving a damn about that person’s dumb ideas about the game.

    17. I think you will have more fun – no, you are wrong to tell me or anyone else, how much fun you think we will have. 🙂 Blizzard does that crap, and they aren’t popular because of it (in regards to D3). If I don’t want to use a signature spell (because they are all crappy and boring and go pew-pew) that’s my business. Getting AP on Crit is fun and I want to continue to do it, in its current form. Changing it doesn’t make the Wizard a better class.

      • Games have rules. That’s part of what makes them games. One of those rules for D3 – powerful skills cost resource and resource isn’t infinite.

        I’m sure some people think it’s fun to be able to use cheat codes to turn off game rules but it’s absurd to get mad at a game designer for choosing to remove rule-breaking cheat codes. If APOC is breaking the rules, good riddance.

        • APoC is a rule ya fool.

          Do you get x arcane power on a crit proc? Yes. Rule. QED.

          Now if you got arcane power on crit without actually having such an item, or just had infinite arcane power THAT’D be a cheat code.

          Next you’ll bitch that:

          Molten bombs hurt.
          There’s an item that makes you absorb fire.
          Molten bombs are now pretty health globes.

          OMFG RULEZ BROKEN LULZ.

          • Yup, APoC isn’t a rule so much as a special bonus. A bonus that has apparently made it really easy to bypass a basic rule. If items that made molten bombs heal you were thrown around easy as candy, yeah, I would bitch about it. If it made it so common that no one is actually threatened by molten anymore then why have molten in the game at all? If it becomes so easy to bypass your resources, why have resources in the game at all?

      • Why is it even an issue? I play this game, and I really don’t use signature spells THAT much. People make it sounds like they’re getting 90% of their damage from signature spells, which WOULD be boring, but from playing I know that can’t be the case.

    18. I still can’t quite get my head around the hypocrisy of people who have spent months squawking about D3 lacking depth now moaning that the devs are taking measures to make single skill spam more difficult to attain.

    19. QUOTE

      I still can't quite get my head around the hypocrisy of people who have spent months squawking about D3 lacking depth now moaning that the devs are taking measures to make single skill spam more difficult to attain. I guess people only want the kind of depth that means you don't have to do anything.

      If more than single skill spam had a purpose no one would complain. If the primary skills had a purpose, same deal (hi Monks, DHs).

    20. QUOTE

      "As opposed to the guy copy pasting off Blizzard amirite?"
      
      Huh? I have no idea what this comment is in reference to.
      Your arguments could just as easily be written by Chang and crew.  The "power gamers" are at least thinking of the efficient way before  doing it, whether it's a farm route or setting a pecking bird on the q  button and then playing a different game entirely.
      
      
      Yup, APoC isn't a rule so much as a special bonus. A bonus that has apparently made it really easy to bypass a basic rule. If items that made molten bombs heal you were thrown around easy as candy, yeah, I would ***** about it. If it made it so common that no one is actually threatened by molten anymore then why have molten in the game at all? If it becomes so easy to bypass your resources, why have resources in the game at all?
      Because opportunity cost. There's already fewer slots for the good affixes as is. Quite a few affixes either got removed or nerfed into uselessness. If you have apoc you don't have a few hundred stats, or a socket, or.... and then you still need crit (before you say you'd want it anyways, more specific bonuses like elemental skills are or should provide more dps so opportunity cost again).
      • “Your arguments could just as easily be written by Chang and crew.”

        Oh jeez, really, you’re gonna accuse me of that? You’ve seen me throw out plenty of criticisms at their decisions both past and present so don’t go acting like I’m some parroting fanboy. That said, the game they *talk* about making with decisions like these matches up very well with my *dreams* about what I want this game to be, even if the two don’t always match up that well in reality.

        The point is simple – what’s more fun, having to manage your resources or easily being able to ignore them? You think it’s the latter. I stand very, very firmly with the former – and am quite glad that Blizz does too.

    21. You and they are about the only ones that think Wiz sigs are fun. Everyone else realizes the damn things need to have an actual function beyond being the terrible skill you use when you can’t use your real skills. For example, they could do like Monks and DHers where these skills do decent damage and have viable utility functions such that, while the higher cost skills are superior the primary skills aren’t just inferior filler.

      Also, last I checked Wizards had terrible proc rates on every skill not named Wicked Wind or Living Lightning, so APoC is hardly that great in a post nerf environment.

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