V1.0.4 Changes Analysis and Discussion

Since the big (and encouraging) list of changes was posted earlier today, we’ve seen a ton of player debate and discussion. Most of you guys seem to like the proposed changes, but there are a variety of opinions on every point, and numerous topics worth deeper analysis.

That’s what this article is for, but first… let’s vote!

How do you feel about the proposed v1.0.4 game changes?

  • 2) They're good, but don't fix everything. (40%, 2,037 Votes)
  • 1) They sound awesome. Big approval. (36%, 1,864 Votes)
  • 3) They're not so good, but at least a step in the right direction. (11%, 584 Votes)
  • 4) They're lame. Useless. Too little too late. RagerageRAGE! (8%, 432 Votes)
  • 5) No opinion/not sure. (4%, 220 Votes)

Total Voters: 5,138

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No More Party Average of Magic Find

We were promised a whole raft of changes to how Magic Find works, so the brief tease in today’s article is just the first detail. Here’s what they told us about MF, in a post earlier this week:

Following up on earlier discussions, Game Director Jay Wilson will be providing an update on how Magic Find is evolving in patch 1.0.4.

If Blizzard is preparing a whole article on the MF changes, we’re obviously going to see more than just the removal of party-averaging of MF. That said, that change in today’s update was probably the most controversial tidbit, with numerous opinions on both sides of the issue. Lots of players approve of the change and think it will promote more MP gaming (which was what Wyatt Cheng said it would do in today’s update). Other players see a dark lining to that silver cloud, in that no MF-averaging will lead to lots of MF-leeches in MP games, where players load up on big MF gear, at the expense of their killing power, and tag along, providing minimal assistance while using your kills to enrich themselves.

Since the D3 devs aren’t complete idiots it’s likely that the D3 Devs have considered this issue, and that in Jay’s blog on the Magic Find changes they’ll reveal a bunch of other details to the system changes that will address those concerns. If so, goodie. If not, sorrow.

The issue of D3’s lack of bonuses to party play came up in the Barbarian podcast yesterday (the only non-Barb specific that seemed crucial enough to digress into), and lowering the bonus hit points of monsters was one of our key points of agreement, so it’s nice to see that mentioned in Wyatt’s post today. I’m sure there will be more details on that to come, but I’ve got a couple of questions/suggestions.

Why not retain MF-averaging, and keep individual MF as well? So the total MF shares, but players who have more than the average keep their own bonus. For example, if your Barb or Monk was the tank and only had 50% Magic Find, while that Demon Hunter providing artillery from the back had 200%, you would get 2/250 = 125% MF, while the Demon Hunter would keep his full 200%. And the Nephalem Valor stacks would add on top of that, as they do now. This would provide an actual bonus to playing in parties; players who were tanking wouldn’t feel they were doing all the work without getting the shared MF rewards, and players with great gear and high MF wouldn’t have a disincentive to party up. Everyone wins!

On that topic, a popular suggestion I’ve seen is that Nephalem Valor stacks should go higher than 5 in multiplayer games. Say that 5 is still the threshold for guaranteed bonus rare item drop every time. But what if stacks went up to 6/8/10 with 2/3/4 players in the game? And this applied a big bonus to item quality, thus improving your chances of seeing green and orange items drop? (Rather than say, 4 rares per boss.) Again, it’s a pure bonus to playing in parties, which is what Blizzard keeps saying they want to encourage in Diablo III.

Click through for more discussion of other changes, including the general easing of game difficulty (are we games all wimps now?), the boosts to 2H weapons and ilvl 61/62 weapons (which is a HUGE stealth buff to crafting), more hit points to trash mobs (good and bad), and the possibility of summoner Witch Doctors riding again.

Two Handed Weapon Improvements

The issue of two-handed weapons is a long-debated issue. It also came up on the Barbarian podcast last night, and I was amused to see that every point we’d argued about this back in 2009 was still open to debate. It’s funny that as many lessons as the Diablo 3 devs took from Diablo 2, they somehow didn’t seem to spare a single thought to the whole issue of two-handed weapons.

No one used them in D2 since their higher damage wasn’t ever higher-enough to make it worth giving up a shield or other off-hand option. And now in D3… no one uses them since their higher damage is never higher enough. Furthermore, D3 added numerous off-hand items that are better (for damage) than shields, AND D3 made attack rate much more important than it was in D2 (since attack speed triggers crits and resource generation per hit, rather than a % as mana leech was in D2). If anything, D3 went backwards on the whole “making two-handed weapons more viable” issue.

So now they’re trying to address that, in various ways.

We also want to close the gap between dual-wielding and two-handers, and so we’re improving two-handed melee weapons by creating a new set of stronger affixes to compensate for the loss of stats that can come from your offhand.

On the topic of two-handers, we’re also changing how damage is calculated on a few damage-over-time skills. Many skills have text like “Deals 75% weapon damage for 5 seconds”, which isn’t exactly clear as it can be interpreted a few different ways. It also made skill evaluation difficult, particularly for skills with long durations or cooldowns. We’re switching a lot of these skills to read “X% weapon damage over 5 seconds”. Many skills already follow this format, and understanding what the skill does is very clear. As the skills are converted there is an additional opportunity: when converting to this format, choosing a value for X depends on your weapon speed.

So what we’ve done in most cases is assumed a high attack speed (at least 2.0 attacks per second), chosen a value of X, and then in many cases bumped the value even higher. A skill that currently does 75% weapon damage for 5 seconds, with a 2.0 speed weapon, will convert to at least 750% weapon damage over 5 seconds. The skill becomes easier to understand, is a small buff for most one-hand builds, and a big buff for two-hand builds.

Yes, that’s fairly confusing. So basically, they’re fixing the tooltips to more accurately reflect what’s happening, as players are currently underrating the value of higher damage. And they’re also changing how some of the skills calculate their damage, to make it more about total damage than about frequency of damage.

That seems like a good start. The bigger issue is the new class of modifiers, which will presumably only spawn on two-handed weapons. We’ll obviously have to see what those are, but I hope they’re not just higher damage numbers, since there are many other issues. As we talked about on the Barb podcast, most Barb players (softcore, at least), especially using the popular Sprint/WW build, are now dual wielding, and using a very fast weapon with high Life on Hit in their offhand slot. More hits = more Life on Hit, more chances to proc Critical Hits, and other good things. As players are now choosing less total damage in favor of more total hits, upping the damage of 2H weapons won’t do anything to improve their popularity.

Furthermore, the real issue with two-handers is very obvious in Hardcore, where the loss of a shield is very dangerous. Which takes us back to some of the main suggestions from 3+ years ago: inherent defensive bonuses to two-handed weapons (such as vitality, defense, armor, blocking, dodge, life on hit, etc).

Item Level 61 and 62 Weapon Improvements

Just how this will work out remains to be seen. Here’s today’s quote:

Weapon damage is the most important stat on a weapon. It can be disheartening to get a lot of weapon drops and you know before even looking at them that they have no chance of being good. To help give weapons a fighting chance, the raw damage value on all level 61 and 62 weapons will be able to roll damage that extends all the way to the top end of level 63.

That’s not entirely clear, but it sounds like they’re boosting the base damage of item level 61 and 62 weapons, so they’ll have the same top end damage potential as item level 63 weapons. For example, here are the base item level 61, 62, and 63 one-handed swords. Hover on the links for the pop up value, from DiabloNut.

  • Ilvl 61: Saif. Damage = (78-81) – (181-187)
  • Ilvl 62: Conquest Sword. Damage = (90-93) – (210-216)
  • Ilvl 63: Rune Sword. Damage = (104-107) – (242-248)
  • So now all of those swords will have 248 for their highest possible damage, but the minimum damage will still be higher for the Conquest Sword and the Rune Sword? Or are they getting a bigger rebalance to make the item level 61-63 weapons much flatter in overall potential damage output? Remains to be seen.

    At any rate, this should make for a much larger pool of potentially great weapons. The interesting thing a few of you guys pointed out in comments was what a big buff this will be to crafting. Currently, crafting high end weapons is folly, since the highest recipes only go to 61 or 62, and thus can’t ever spawn with equivalent stats to the top end ilvl 63 weapons that can only be found from monster drops. I assume this was intentional on the part of the developers, as they wanted the best gear (there are no ilevel 63 sets or legendaries either) to be only findable from monster drops. A valid theory, but in practice it’s done what Wyatt said in today’s update; made any weapons you find with lower than level 63 seem almost like a waste of time.

    We can’t project the change this will make to Legendaries, since they’re getting a ton of other improvements as well, but it’s a very obvious improvement to crafting. As some people pointed out in comments, the ilevel 61 and 62 rare crafting plans instantly skyrocketed in value when Wyatt’s blog was posted. Since I’m already on the one handed swords page of Diablo Nut, here are the three relevant one-handed sword plans:

  • Exalted Conquest Sword.
  • Exalted Fine Conquest Sword.
  • Exalted Grand Conquest Sword.
  • All are level 62, and all have (had?) a base weapon damage of around 10-30 less than an ilevel 63 item. I hope you had these recipes already, or else you’re planning to find one, since their Auction House price went up from 80k to well over 1.3m today.

    No More Invulnerable Minions

    This change also spurred some debate. Many fans are overjoyed, others say that DiabloWikiInvulnerable Minions weren’t so bad since the last patch, which lowered the hit points of their non-invulnerable boss by a considerable amount. I’m kind of in the second camp, since I didn’t exactly *like* this DiabloWikiBoss Modifier, but I couldn’t deny that it did what many features in Diablo III are supposed to do; changed up the gameplay.

    It put more value on AoE attacks, on positioning, on movement speed, on skills like DiabloWikiDiamond Skin and DiabloWikiIgnore Pain that let your character ignore the minions (for a few seconds), and generally promoted different tactics than were required when dealing with any other boss affix. Which is a good thing, in general. Whether the drawbacks and difficulty spike of these guys offset that, is open to debate.

    One suggestion in the comments I liked was from Lanth, who said these shouldn’t be removed, but should be modified. Maybe instead of 100% shielding, they’re akin to the Ghostly champions in Diablo 2, and take damage, but with a huge reduction. So they’re not Invulnerable, but are just really damn durable. They might also become permeable, like attacks always pierce against them, so they wouldn’t work as such annoying meatshields to make their boss almost impossible to hit with non-AoE ranged attacks?

    I dunno, there are a lot of possibilities, but I think we’ll miss them once they’re gone, especially with all of the other difficulty reductions we’re getting in v1.0.4 (and the many others we’ve gotten since release.)

    Health and Drop Improvements for Trash Mobs

    So, in 1.0.4 we’re increasing the health of normal monsters by approximately 5%-10% in Inferno, but also increasing the likelihood they drop magic or rare items by a factor of four. We’re correspondingly lowering the health of Champions and Rares by 10-25% and editing specific affixes to shrink the difficulty gap. We’re still working on those numbers, but that’s approximately what we’re shooting for.

    I like this one in both directions. I think normal monsters are way too easily-killed in Inferno, and I think they drop far too little stuff. This has created a system where most players, especially when on Magic Find runs, just ignore the regular monsters and rush through the game, seeking the next boss or champion. Currently, you actually want to skip over those regular guys most of the time, since they’re handy to have around during a boss fight, so you have more targets, to trigger more procs and crits and health globes and just generally get in the way of fast bosses.

    This is especially true against tough bosses, such as Shielding or Invulnerable Minions, where characters with builds that require lots of hits to generate procs are stymied by enemies that can’t be hit.

    This point is open to debate, but IMHO it’s cheesy to have levels full of meat sacks that provide no real risk or reward, which players largely ignore while dashing from one Elite to the next. The current game basically equates regular monsters with white items, which are only there to get in the way and annoy you, while perhaps making the blue and yellow items more interesting. I’d rather have white items have some purpose or value, and the same logic goes for white monsters.

    Witch Doctor Pet Improvements

    The DiabloWikiWitch Doctor is clearly the least popular character (at 10%, a distant 5th in our current class vote), and clearly a broken design in the game now, as most of his pets are simply useless by Hell, much less Inferno. It’s like the WD pets got the treatment initially meant for DiabloWikiFollowers, until they were buffed shortly before release to remain viable all throughout the game. (And I think that balance went quite well; Followers are useful in Inferno, but not mandatory to the point that you miss the horribly when playing MP.)

    But improvements are coming!

    Would buffing the skill increase or decrease build diversity? Some skills when buffed cause other skills to become obsolete, so there’s a net decrease in build diversity – we’re more careful with those. Other skills, when buffed, add to the total pool of appealing skills, which increases build diversity. The most obvious example here is the Witch Doctor Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan, which are both receiving significant improvements in 1.0.4.

    I’m a useless lemming on this point, as I have level 60 Barb, DH, and Wizard, with a Monk in the low 50s… and a WD still sitting in Act 2 at level 18, all but forgotten since I played him a few hours shortly after release. The only reason I ever think about playing him more is that I’ve got damn near a whole tab of my stash clogged by Int/Vit gear, including a ton of mid-level stuff that I’m unlikely to ever need on a rerolled Wizard. And like two rows of damn Ceremonial Knives.

    (Side point, but seriously… what would you pay for another tab in your Stash? One million? Ten million? Five bucks on the RMAH? Forty bucks for the Diablo 3 expansion?)

    I haven’t been not-playing the Witch Doctor since I know pets are worthless later in the game, but knowing that there are very few viable end game WD builds has certainly proved a disincentive for me to level one up. Hopefully v1.0.4 will change that!

    More Difficulty Decreases

    Last point, and here’s where I insult most of us. Me included.

    I was one of the many fans, pre-release, who openly doubted and mocked all of the “We’re making Inferno really hard!” guarantees from the developers. Granted, in retrospect we were correct to doubt (and mock) many of their assurances about Diablo 3, but I (and many others) were very wrong about Inferno. It was hard. It is hard. Much, much, much harder than any difficulty level or area of Diablo 2. This despite the fact that all right-thinking fans liked the idea of Inferno and wanted it to be challenging. And yet once we got it we all bitched and bitched that it was too hard, that it was just a gear check, that it pigeon-holed us into only a few viable builds, that it forced us to use 4 defensive skills, etc.

    All of those complaints are true, (for the most part) but still… what happened to surmounting challenges? Adapting to a game’s difficulty and finding ways to triumph? Where did the old time gamer guts and gumption go? Since when did a game have to conform to exactly how we wanted to play it, or else it was no fun and too hard and sux sux sux?

    Remember when I posted this cartoon and we all laughed and said how Diablo III would be way too easy and it was all dumbed down and Inferno wouldn’t be a challenge, etc?

    And then D3’s Inferno actually was hard, and people were all like, “It’s too hard and it’s not the right kind of hard and I want it changed!” This at the same time that other players were beating the entire game in 4 days, playing entirely self-found, using gear that you could buy for less than the price of the materials it could be junked into, today. And other people beat Inferno in Hardcore and needed hardly more than a month to do it?


    So anyway, we’re all wimps and whiners. Let’s just accept that and move on. More importantly, it turns out that players don’t actually want games to be hard. At least not for us. We’re fine with other people struggling, but we are special and wonderful and the game should recognize that. Which is a fine attitude to hold, so long as you’re aware that you’re being ironic and absurd when you take it.

    The lesson I’m taking from Diablo III’s Inferno is that players don’t know what they want or what’s best for the game. No, that’s not exactly a revelation, but most players said D2 was too easy, there was item inflation, and that they wanted more challenge in D3. And we got D3 with challenge and much harder to find items, and it was history’s greatest mistake. Obviously there are more factors to consider than hard vs. easy, but in general terms, players don’t want a game to be hard. We want to play and have fun and feel awesome and powerful, and we got to do that in D2 since the end game was hell difficulty, and you could complete it with junk equipment, and could rampage through it with good gear and playing skill. You can do that in Hell D3 also, but since D3’s end game is Inferno… yeah.

    The fans have spoken.
    Good gear and playing skill in Inferno might let you struggle through Act One, but see how far that gets on you Act Two? Here’s a hint, Eirena giggling while you get repeatedly one-shotted by the Wasps and bomb-throwing Lacuni in the canyon ten feet outside of Caldeum. A joyous experience that sends you crying back to Act One, or to the Auction House where you realize that 200% res all and 24k life is a joke, and that all the gear you need to survive is 1) really hard to find, and 2) way out of your price range.

    All that said, yes, Inferno’s too hard to be fun for most players, high quality gear is too hard to find, and D3’s end game is lot less fun than D2’s was. Even though hardly any of us would have predicted those facts 4 months ago.

    While a lot of fans weren’t happy to hear about yet more Inferno difficulty nerfs, one change does seem to be pretty popular.

    We’re removing Enrage Timers and the “heal back to full” behavior from Champion and Rare monster packs. We don’t think they fit well into the general philosophy of the game, which is more about trying to farm as efficiently as possible. You’re already incentivized to kill things quickly, if a pack happens to take you a long time it can just feel unfair to have the pack enrage, kill you, and then heal back to full.

    The original intent behind Enrage Timers was to have a few encounters that served as a “DPS check” that also add tension and excitement. Due to the randomness of Champion and Rare monsters, combined with a general philosophy of efficient farming, this was simply the wrong approach for us to take. The Enrage Timers feel more appropriate on bosses, where the setup, predictability and mechanics of the fight add the required context for the time limit.

    So apparently Enrage Timers will remain on Elites, like Act Bosses, but you just won’t see them on random boss and champion encounters. This is only half the desired change, since most fans don’t much care for Enrage Timers at all. A quote from the comments that I thought summed it up pretty well:

    This is especially true for Hardcore. I like to play through content blind, but with “dps check” enrage timers I feel like I’m forced to Google what DPS i need before attempting the bosses.

    Unfortunately, it sounds like you’re going to have to keep researching the DPS requirements in advance. Happily, with the improvements to ilvl 61-62 weapons, those shouldn’t be so hard to achieve.


    Lots of changes, and lots more to come. As many people have said in comments, it seems that the devs actually are listening to fan complaints, or at least they’re agreeing with the fans on what changes really need to be made. It’s a tricky thing for them to balance, since players have tons of complaints and requests, which usually contradict or overlap. It it pretty obvious though, that players are more interested in a game that’s challenging, but not actually hard or difficult enough to require special effort to defeat. It’s kind of an illusion of difficult that most of us are after; enough challenge that we have to play better and gear up, but not so much that it’s show stopping.

    The hard part for Blizzard is finding that balance, and they’ve obviously struggled to achieve it yet with D3.

    Ironically, and perhaps justly, their online-only DRM makes it much harder for them to fix the problems. If they’d allowed a single player version of Diablo III, and especially if they’d made it mod-friendly the way Runic is doing with Torchlight 2, there would be a thriving community of Diablo III modders, and people like like Brother Laz would be working to help field testi every sort of change and improvement to D3. The devs could join the rest of us in testing those out, seeing which ones were the most popular, and which changes to items, classes, skills, monsters, etc, paid the greatest dividends.

    Instead it’s all on the devs to make changes, and then test them internally. Which is a good way to find bugs, but can’t compare to letting tens of thousands of expert players rip into the product to find the soft spots. Note how quickly most of the key problems with Inferno (as well as various skill exploits) were found by fans post-release, and how utterly unaware of them Blizzard was even after months and years of game development?

    We’ll never get offline D3 (over Bobby’s dead body?) but it’s surprising we don’t have a D3 PTR by now, where where interested players could try out the new patches before they went live for the full game. Perhaps that’s coming in v1.0.4 as well?

    Related to this article
  • Legendaries 1.0.4 vs 1.0.3 Comparison Charts
  • Vote: What do you think of the v1.0.4 patch?
  • 1.0.4 Undocumented Changes

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    61 thoughts on “V1.0.4 Changes Analysis and Discussion

    1. 2 handers should get a stat that gives them a % chance to parry so that perhaps it could help make them more useful in the survivability trade off from not being able to use a shield.

      • Depending on the type of weapon many games either have a parry chance or a chance to block on 2 handed weapons. both of which would be perfect for this type of game they would just have to look at any number of games and see which weapons use which stat and balance the pros and cons of how much for the weapons each should add.

        • This is an awesome idea / suggestion. Giving 2h weapons a block value that is something like 1/2 that of shields, and giving them 1/2-3/4 the block chance, would be a really cool thing to do. You should spread the word.

    2. Of course a lot of people are going to say “they’re good, but don’t fix everything”. Everyone has different opinions on what’s needed to “fix” Diablo 3, so the game will never be fully “fixed” for everyone.

      These changes are just flat-out awesome. Much needed!

      • Replacing a flat tire doesn’t do much good when the battery is drained and the carburetor is busted..

        • Haha great comment, I wish we could get more pessimistic morons around like you :D. Please give us more worthy comments like this …. glorious!

          • Fervent apologies, mate; I had forgotten that the lion’s share of blindly loyal Blizzard defenders have yet to hit puberty let alone the legal driving age. An analogous statement involving cars, then, would go right over most heads.

            Diablo III is critically flawed at its very core — the design philosophy extolled by its development team has proven itself to be ineffectual and the game resultantly possesses the depth of an above ground swimming pool. Even with these minor tweaks that were inexplicably missed during the year-long polish phase, there still exists no compelling reason to reinstall the steaming pile of offal that is somehow the successor to one of my favorite games of all time.

            • Blindly loyal to Blizzard ? Not even hit puberty ?
              It seems that is the standard response from every anti-diablo 3 person.

              The thing is, you haters hate this game so much, you don’t even know what you are hating anymore.

              Not to mention, when asked what they hate, you get generic crap that doesn’t make sense nor is any fault of blizzard that they don’t like it.

              I don’t give 2 sh!ts about blizzard as a company, despise WoW and don’t play Starcraft, but this game rocks.

              Bring on 1.04 !!

            • I think you underestimate the similarity of D3 to D2. Flux nails it above when he talks about the one thing that is truly different: the difficulty of Inferno goes beyond anything in D2. D2 was a cakewalk, even for gamers 30 years beyond puberty, like me. Patch 1.04 should go a long way into making Inferno more like Hell. Other than that, D3 basically carries forward the same qualities and flaws of D2.

    3. I think it’s a little early for a vote at this point. There’s so much about the patch that we dont know yet.

      • Well, we’re voting on what we know now. We’ll have another vote once the full details are revealed, or else after the patch is out and we’ve all had a chance to test it.

        When that time comes, it would be funny if we had character play info on posters and voters here. They sort of have that on the B.net forums now that the Diarmory is live, so if someone’s saying that Wizards suck you can look and see if he’s even got one at a high enough level to deserve an opinion. That won’t be true of v1.0.4, but imagine if there was, and then being able to correlate that with pro/con votes on it? What % of haters would have not even tried the patch?

        Yes, it’s fun to pretend….

    4. “No one used them in D2 since their higher damage wasn’t ever higher-enough to make it worth giving up a shield or other off-hand option.”

      Spears, they are called….Spears. Spearazons running around with Matriarchal Spears. Barbs with warpikes killing some monsters hiding behind some barrels.

      D2 spears were sweet. Extra reach and some of the highest damage in the game. (wtf Flux?)

      D3 took a huge dump on them and made them a joke.

      Long live the SPEARAZON! 👿

    5. All things that should have never happened to begin with. Even with these changes, I sincerely doubt the game will be fun. Should have learned from D2 and expanded on it, Blizz– not try to reinvent the wheel.

      • I honestly can’t believe they are taking the game seriously only after they launched it. They literally never looked at what made D2 great. Better late than never and all, but what the hell were they thinking?

    6. I’m in favor of these changes for the most part. Inferno ought to be tough, but farming ought not be an exercise in masochism for players who want to tough it out and avoid the AH. Farming Inferno while self-found is a punishing experience because of the way MF currently works. In order to find good rares with some efficiency, you need to be wearing… good rares. Specifically, good rares with %MF. Which you have to find yourself. The beginning portion of the equipment quality/farming success curve is awfully long and flat.

      But if you oversaturate the economy with good equipment, then Blizz’s AH returns go down the toilet.

      That’s why I voted #2. Blizzard has a vested interest in scarcity this time around, and that’s the problem. Maybe that makes me a fool for wanting to make my characters decent without any outside influence, but that was always possible in the first 2 games. It ought to be possible in this one w/o trying to punch through a brick wall.

      Like I said, I want Inferno to be tough. But as a pure SPer, the item farming grind is getting to be a bit much. The amount of rewards earned/progress made vs. hours spent is way out of whack.

    7. my main issue with the game is that you basically have to devote too much time to it to have a half decent character, yes im aware it was the same in D2 but here is different, you can spend half a day farming with over 300% MF inferno ( like i used to do, on a daily basis) and get shit, SHIT, not even something usefull or worthwhile, 99.9% of all the items i ever got were either sold to vendors or salvage in order to sell the mats, nothing else..

      it HURTS me too see that EVERY SINGLE PIECE OF GEAR in my character is from the AH, EVERY SINGLE ONE, because if i don’t play this game, LITERALLY, 24/7 im not gonna go anywhere, nothing good ever dropped for me in over 500+ hours besides a 1000 dps crossbow with 93% crit dmg that i gave to a friend and he sold for 10 dollars, that was it, that was the \EPIC LOOT\ that the credit screen told me i would get after i beat the game back in hell mode, that was the ONLY, ONLY worthwhile item i ever got, im not kidding.

      after that i just decided to level all classes to 60 and i did and i had fun doing it since i was no hitting a fucking wall on inferno because i was fucking sick of farming and didn’t had the patience to farm dank cellar with GF gear or many of the other places ppl use to farm gold, but after all that i just stopped playing entirely, seriusly, i hate and love at the same time how you can get the best item in the game by killing one easy elite pack in your first run, wich of course only seems to happend to the 00.1% of lucky SOBs that play this game because, that’s what the game is all about, luck, just pure luck, because getting a good item is so rare that you’re gonna get entirely sick of the game before you even get one…

      because most people that play games can’t devote their entire life to playing one game, my objective for this game was gear my character as best as possible and do so with every single class but the fact that i didn’t got a single upgrade, A SINGLE UPGRADE, for my monk (my main in wich i spend most of my time in the game) just blowed my mind, i don’t know how the item/affix system works but it’s completely broken, i cannot look the AH anymore and look at those fucking amazing pieces of gear, because i know i’ll wonder \well… maybe if i spend another 100000000000000 fucking hours playing i mayyyyyyyy get lucky and get something similar\ and i know i won’t happend, plain and simple, how many times i’ve seen ppl post over 1.2k BLUES that they got on act1 inferno or this amazing 1.4k + rare that i got on act 1 and i just fucking say to myself… am i doing something wrong here? why can’t i get an item like that or even something fucking similar? am i cursed with the \you shall never find an upgrade by yourself\ curse? because if so, eff ya blizzard

      im looking foward to 1.04, but if the itemization or whatever makes the items be as shitty as they are now is unchanged then i most likely will play for less than a week and then quit until they get their head out of their asses and redone the whole system or at least try to, because, this is fucking RIDICULOUS !!

        • im just frustrated that i wasted hours and hours of my life in a game that feels more like a job than anything else 🙄

      • I’m in the same boat with regard to hitting a wall in Inferno, Act 2. There are some affix combination elites that I just can’t beat without dying multiple times — and death was a rare and terrible thing in D2, so that makes me feel useless in Inferno D3. The availability of more powerful items would solve that problem and put me back in the zone – able to defeat elites and bosses without dying, but perhaps not on the first try. Act 1 Inferno is pretty close to putting me in the zone right now — death is possible, but avoidable with skill and concentration.

        With regard to finding good gear, I’m not sure I agree. Everyone in D2 ladder was running around with Infinity, Enigma, Chains of Honor, HOTO, etc., and I can tell you from 8 years of playing that you don’t get those runes through random drops. It was all about trading and, for those less morally mature, duping. The gold AH is a vast improvement over that rip-off prone system. I’d like to see Blizzard use all of the data to make a suggested price point available based on actual selling prices (I work with economists every day so I like this kind of stuff…)

    8. I hope there will be new all-round affexes too, not only for the 2H weapons. How awesome would it be for example, to get something like “aura on equip”?

    9. No one used 2-handed weapons in D2? Flux….really? Outside of PvP where only the occasional Barbs would use it for the range, Druids and Barbs would commonly go 2-handed in PvM. Unlike in D3, 2-handers in D2 actually had a massive damage boost compared to 1-handers

      Compare the damage of a eBotD Berserker Axe and that with a eBotD Great Poleaxe and in just pure damage the Poleaxe greatly outperforms the Beserker Axe.

      • no one that was smart used a 2hander in pvm either…. barbs used 2x 1hander axes usually unless they were trying something different… druids used 2handers? WHEN? what build? cuz i don’t EVER remember a good druid using 2handers. i’ve 99’d both classes and i think you don’t know what you’re talking about bro. :mrgreen:

        lol at ebotd 2hander out dpsing a 1hander build… 2 things say hello… beastz and ebotdz. i stand by my comment that you really don’t know what you’re talking about at all.

    10. As I understand, they’re boosting potential top affixes (Grim/Death) on the 61/62 weapons, not their base damage. That’s how I understand “raw” damage. But yeah, it’s a bit unclear.

    11. Inferno is too easy: Casual pandering
      Inferno is challenging: Forcing players to use RMAH, conspiracy!

    12. Very true about the Inferno difficulty whine.

      In the end I guess people get what they deserve :/

    13. I really really really really realllllyyyyyyyy want them to at least quadruple the stash size! Even after purchasing all the upgrades and having 7 mules (which dwindle 1 by 1 as I level up new characters) I still need to dump a lot of stuff I’d like to keep.
      Now that the initial sales rush is over Blizzard can have a real look at the hardware requirement on their end and see if they can enlarge the stash. Here’s hoping that they do that before the first expansion!

        • That’s been suggested a lot, and one of the bliz CMs replied and was like, “individually IDing items is part of the game’s challenge.”

          Not their most inspired piece of PR puffery, IMHO.

          • LOL what so hard about IDing items? That CM clearly is a slobbering moron if he find IDing items hard. The onlything IDing items is useful for is 3 sec break in the fighting.

            • Scrolls and spells of identify would add game depth if they were baked into the game from the get-go. Having Cain identify all in D2 was extremely useful as well, and made sense.

              Right clicking on an item with no spell or lore behind it is just stupid IMO.

            • Have you progressed to MF runs on Inferno with 5 stacks? You routinely return to town with 10-20 rares, and it’s a boring waste of time to stand at Haedrig, right clicking and waiting 3 seconds on every one of them. Hence people who know the difference requesting an ID-all button.

      • Here’s a guide to solve stash capacity problems:

        You found and item.
        Is it good?
        ? No: vendor it.
        ? Yes: is it an upgrade for any of your characters?
        …? Yes: equip it.
        …? No: could you potentially use it on a future character?
        ……? No: AH it.
        ……? Yes: AH it; you will likely find a better item at a cheaper price later.

        Notice how the stash is not mentioned in the guide.

        • I don’t use the AH very much and would prefer to keep it that way. Aside from 1 item everything I use is self found.
          So for me a bigger stash would be really nice…

    14. These changes will not matter because both auction houses remain which kills the thrill of the hunt for loot. You can simply just buy gear off of the AH which is not what Diablo is all about. Until they remove both auction houses and fix the loot drops the way they should be this game will continue to suffer.

      • I’m sure its been said before, but you know you don’t HAVE to use the AH right? Its completely your choice to “Kill the thrill of the hunt for loot” by using the AH. Its not being forced on you…

    15. This patch should be a great help to improving the game, all the revealed changes sound good. I still think D3 has a lot of potential, many great games come out of the gate buggy and imbalanced, than find there stride after a few rounds of patching/expansion. Most games just didn’t have the level of hype and colossal expectations that D3 had, to cause such an outpouring of fan hate and rejection.

      • Diablo 3 isn’t “buggy” or even”imbalanced”. It’s fundamentally broken and un-fun. Right down to its core. These changes don’t change anything.

        • then how come me and so many other people have so much fun playing it? Sure, it’s your right to dislike the game, but please don’t generalise.

    16. I am happy about most of the changes. I think the HP reduction to the rare pack boss with invulnerable minions was all it needed. Getting rid of them totally is a little to much because these packs add challenge to the game. I really like the decision to get rid of monster healing back to full, and I wont be happy until enrage timers are completely gone. Leave enrage timers in WOW where they belong. I like to kill everything, so giving white monsters a better chance to drop items is a very nice change.

      I am glad they are working on the game, but dont think for a minute the auction house is going to take a back seat to anything.

    17. The main problem with the witch doctor is the lack of flexibility due to mana. You either have to have vision quest or you have to stick to cheap abilities almost exclusively. Additionally, there are a lot of skills that you can’t spam and most of the other ones have long cooldowns. That means you really need many different skills to always be casting unless you have one of the spammable ones; for instance, haunt, queen spider and pestilence don’t stack when recast, and the pets, wall of zombies, and big bad voodoo have long cooldowns. The spammable skills excluding the cheap primary ones cost so much that you really need a cheap one as well.

      Wizards resource system is so much better. They have FREE skills and skills that cost a lot, but their resource regenerates incredibly fast. We have almost-free skills and skills that cost a lot, but outside of vision quest our regen is incredibly slow; so slow that you can keep it down with even some of our cheaper skills like firebomb. Outside of vision quest, you really need a lot of mana regen on your gear to allow flexibility, and no other class has that problem. The 3 classes with generators can always use all of their abilities in a sort of rhythm, and wizards have several free skills including the rampaging skill archon as well as a better ability to kite.

      Yea, mana sucks.

      • This. What was my favored class fails on all counts. I wanted a support caster with minions… minions DO work, but only if you sacrifice everything to tank with them. And then you do no damage. Or you can do all damage… but only if you pick the one correct skill setup. Oh, you can pretend to be a DH, without all their tricks and sustainable damage. Fake a barb, fake a wizard, fake a DH… fakey fakeity fake.

        At least the class can’t get much worse. Yeah, I said it.

    18. On the ‘Inferno being too hard’/endgame matter:
      I think it all distills into the one truth that for beating the hardest challenge in the game, you’d expect some kind of reward being bestowed upon you. And if it’s merely the fun and satisfaction of excelling at the game’s mechanics.

      The thing is, running this game for the fourth time already isn’t fun anymore – it’s actually quite frustrating and boring despite being randomized. There’s nothing in store for beating Inferno either: No additional level or easter egg, no hunt for perfect/special items (due to the item system being broken and feeling rather generic), no sense or records of achievement in the shape ladders or similar (and no, some additional achievement points don’t really count as a reward for one-hit-dying your way through the game for a fourth time).

      And in the end, I keep asking myself if the game developement team failed in that regard or accomplished the goal that was set for them: to create a game that wouldn’t draw the customers’ attention from the flagship subscription title for too long.

    19. There’s also a huge problem with the way the affix system is set-up, pretty much in such a way that itemization is as linear as possible. I’m doubtful this will ever be adressed since i don’t think it’s an oversight or sheer incompetence, it is Blizzard’s (new) design filosophy.

    20. Overall the proposed changes should help the game quite a bit…at least take away some of the frustration that can occur (especially for players like myself who prefer to stay away from the AH). One thing that I hope they adjust is the drop rate for legendaries/sets as well as crafting plans as well. I must have clocked in over 300 total hours by now (spread out across five characters) and I have yet to find one set item, and I have found only one legendary lower than ilevel 35. Through my play experience, it’s as if low level legendaries and set items don’t even exist. Regardless whether they’re useful, I know there are others like me who enjoy the thrill of seeing that special item color drop and the scarcity of these drops makes this game quite disappointing.

      • about 200h here and I’ve found 1 set item and maybe 8 legendaries. Surprisingly, I’m using 3 of them as they’re ok’ish (2 in inferno).

        I agree that legendaries+sets should be fixed (no bonuses for full set?????????????) but I don’t think they sohuld be the BEST items in the game. Perfectly rolled rares should be better than legendaries, this way there’s more variety rather than everyone hunting for the exact same items.

        I think with Legendaries and sets they should focus on introducing unique skill/class bonuses to make unique builds and play styles rather than just overpowered generic stats.

        Regarding crafting, so far I found 3 exalted plans (2 of the same! @#[email protected]#[email protected]#F), no gem design plans.

        I would really like them to fix crafting to provide a viable alternative to AH.

    21. completely agree with the fact that NV stack should go higher with either more elite kills or more players in game. Basically, you can do your normal 5 stack boss run but if you wanna continue past that, you keep getting better bonuses. Also, what’s up with NV disappearing after an Act switch?!

      Moreover, they should remove the penalty for skill switching. For most of the run, you probably use mob-focused skills but for a boss you wanna switch to single-target only but now you’re screwed.

      Anyway, excited about the patch.

    22. Well atleast Blizz is working on the game whether the new patch will satisfy every 1 is doubtfull. On the flip side 1 thing is true bout most gamers is the fact that most are whimps and dont know what they want if a game is to easy they whine if it is to hard they whine as well so what do gamers want actually? Wonder how many of the haters can actually make the game better the way the haters talk one can swore they are experts or game developers them selves. If that is the case why not go to Blizz HQ and show the so called morons how it should be done then we all can test your ideas and give all of you guys that say the game is flawed or broken a cup of your own poison to drink. Either grow a pair of balls and prove your better
      or shut up.

    23. @Secxzy: I dont have to be a dev to be able to describe whats good on D3 and what is not. I played a lot of RPGs, since the Amiga Commodore (which was the start of all gaming industry), games like Black Crypt, Dungeon Master, Realms of Arkania and many many other… And yes, I feel to be enough experienced to say, that D3 has a lot of potencial but also a lot of nonsences (loot system, MF gear swapping f.e.)! It definitly needs more lore, more game imagination and fantasy from the devs. This is like a good crafted game (music, graphics, animations…), but it misses something very important to be a legendary thing. Just why to hell is everything about dmg vs. mobs? What about some simle puzzles, riddles which would randomize? Where is this passion for RPG, the lore, raw world of fantasy? D3 is a static, limited action game, it needs more depth and width to feel the magic of a fantasy world. A fantasy world which drives the players to play it again again and again, because it is just pure gaming fun. I had this feeling in D3, I swear. But only till killing Diablo for the first time on normal diff….

      • Amiga, Black Crypt, Dungeon Master…man, you bring back memories…

        Anyway, you bring a lot of good points, however, don’t get carried over with the RPG elements. Diablo is NOT an RPG, it is an action-rpg (some even argue that) and the focus should stay on clicking to kill a lot of stuff.

        But as mentioned in one of the podcasts from this site, they should have more of these cool random events, like Jar of Souls or Scouring of Caldeum. Those are really fun and provide a nice break while keeping the action going.

        And while I like puzzles, I think they sohuld be left out from Diablo – it’s just not that kind of a game.

        • Youre right, I got carried away a bit… 🙂 But you know what I mean. Diablo misses something variable, its too static and that seems boring to lot of people. And I must opposite to your opinion, because I am pretty sure that more RPG would help the game a lot.

      • The point i was making is that gamers bitch and whine just like flux said and all gamers really do based on their preference whether it is fsp rpg or what ever is if they think is good they buy it and play it if it is shit they dont. But to come on forums and say a game is shit just because its not the same as its predecessor on what grounds can one come to such a conclusion? D2 was a good game but times has changed and gamers have to come to terms with it. Thats why i said if they can do a better job then they must prove it and we can all examine their ideas and bitch and whine over their flaws like they bitched over the mistakes Blizz made. To make it even more clear for those who are braindead and whine that d3 is not as good as d2 i draw a comparrison so that even their little minds can understand it.

        1. D2 ended with the killing of Baal in normal the same way D3 ended with the death of Diablo in normal.
        2. So why did people kept playing D2 then and D3 now? Its obvious for the bragging rights of having the best gear for their character and thats it. The only real diffrence between the 2 games is D3 have an inferno difficulty lvl where D2 has ended with a Hell difficulty.

    24. D3 difficulty mainly lies in unavoidable cc effects. Skills that break cc are mandatory and often you need 2 or more because multiple cc eFfects can be on one elite. One small change that would go A long way is that cc effects can break early if you are being damaged. Being feared, frozen repeatedly and dying because your anti cc ability is on cooldown is incredibly frustrating and NOT challenging gameplay.

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