The Rules for Magic Find and Gold in Parties


DiabloWikiBashiok answered a bunch of questions with basic info about items, DiabloWikigold, and Magic Find in parties. Useful infos.

all players sit intop of each other and you throw large portion of gold on the ground who auto-picks it?
Bashiok: Gold drops are just like item drops: per-player. The gold that drops for you, DiabloWikidrops for you. The gold that drops for your buddy, is for your buddy. There’s no sharing or splitting when you pick it up. And if you have some +gold find stats on, you’re going to get more gold than someone in your party who doesn’t.

Do you only see the drops that are for you? Or will I wind up running over other peoples stuff trying to pick it up?
Bashiok: You only see items that you can pick up. Whether that’s your individual drops, or items someone else threw down that everyone can see.

So it’s similar to WoW whoever the 1st person is to engage the enemy, they get the loot? Or maybe whoever does the most damage to an enemy? Or last hit on an enemy?
Bashiok: No, everyone gets their own individual drops. We kill an enemy and you may get 5 gold while I get a DiabloWikilegendary DiabloWikisword. Drops are individual for every player. The game only requires proximity to the dying enemy to be considered for a DiabloWikiloot drop.

Like, does playing solo give you the exact same chance at gold and magical DiabloWikiitems that playing with a group does?
Bashiok: Yes, it’s exactly the same.

And my DiabloWikiGold Find and/or Magic Find gear has NO EFFECT on anyone else in a party?
Bashiok: Correct. Each person affects their own drops.

(aka – Why should we bother playing in a group?)
Bashiok: Because your kill rate goes up. Despite the difficulty increase you simply kill stuff way faster in a group. More ‘drops per hour’ means you want to be in a group.

One of the topics that’s come up time and again in regards to Diablo III’s individual drops and party system, is the issue of leeches. What’s to prevent someone from loading up on DiabloWikiMagic Find, playing along, lagging in the back, dealing minimal damage, getting full experience, all while scoring a full share of gold and getting better items than anyone else thanks to their big MF?

Nothing, apparently. Nothing in terms of game systems, at least. Bashiok previously said that that sort of thing would just be up to players to watch out for, and deal with on their own. So if one person is always in the back of your party, and seems to be lacking in their damge output, you might want to find another person to join in your next game. (Or do a better job faking it, if you’re that person.)

Comments

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  1. i like how they attempt to be fair by means of individual drops and all that, yet when the problem comes up with someone loaded with MF and leeching the kill, they’re just like, ‘you’ll have to deal with it’

    he kinda doesn’t fully answer the first question, or maybe i am not understanding it. if we all stand together and i throw down gold from my own inventory, everyone sees it right? but if it’s auto pick-up, which player will get it?

    • They didn’t answer that question. They didn’t say whether or not you can even drop gold. It may simply be traded through the trade window, if anything.

      I’ve seen a ton of conversations about what to do about leechers and most of the solutions just seem to create more problems. At least they’ve said they’re going to have a system to kick players.
      In addition, if it’s following bnet2 “protocol”, people on your ignore list won’t get matched with you on AMM.

    • Probably the person with the best Ping gets it!

      Gold was a droppable item in D2, so I don’t see why they would disallow dropping it in D3. I guess you just don’t want to drop gold in front of someone who you don’t wish to have it.

  2. I think it would be cool if MF would stack with other players MFs, meaning that if I have three friends and everyone has 100%, we would end up with 400%. That could be overkill but maybe just part of the percentage would stack say 30%, so it would encourage people even more to play cooperatively. Idk could be cool. Also, do items drop if I don’t kill the enemy, say there’s 5 enemies, I kill only one of them, will I get loot from the others?

    • I mean like if I don’t even hit the other monster, if I’m just in the battle with the others. I’m thinking something like if I just run around doing nothing (considering obviously the hypothesis that people would let me wander not helping, maybe if I’m being rushed or something) will I get loot without even touching the enemies?

      • Talking to yourself is the first sign of madness. :p

        Party MF stacking: It’s a bad idea too. It just encourages even more people to have a couple of MF twinked gimps hanging around so they can get more loot.

  3. Unless they were using a bot to leech (which hopefully will be minimal), why would someone bother? Killing monsters goes faster if everyone is contributing damage and just running around without casting anything sounds boring as hell…

    • Boredom has never played any factor in dissuading people from doing whatever is most rewarding in a video game. Look at item runs in D2 for example. No one has ever actually enjoyed killing Meph, or Pindle, or Baal, hundreds of times in a row. But since that’s been the most rewarding thing, in various patches, that’s what people do.

  4. One plausible solution to the potential problem of a player loading up on MF and lagging behind is to limit the opportunities for magic find to show up on gear. For instance, maybe +%mf won’t appear on normal items at all, and only has a chance to appear on one piece of crafted gear (or mystic enchantment), and maybe also on particularly rare legendaries whose stats would be good otherwise?

    • I think it’s possible that would simply exacerbate the problem, if the person in MF gear is truly and totally gimped by it. It gives them less incentive to rush in and die, because you can’t loot when you’re dead.
      Also I just don’t see what the point of MF would be if it were only on one small type of gear or a single gem or something.

    • Wouldn’t be fair. Then pretty much the only people who would have MF would be those folks buying their gear. That would be another nail in the D3 coffin as another reason for people to stop playing. Lots and lots of people won’t even play games where gear can be bought.

      • There has always been a market to buy gear in online games. Not saying that it is the right thing to do but this will not stop “lots and Lots of people front playing D3”.

    • Why would anyone load up on MF and then purposefully lag behind?? If they join in, things die faster, so more loot for all!

      • Because they have low hit points and resistances and defense since all of their equipment is purposed towards MF, not other stats. Imagine they’re doing it in HC, where dying actually matters?

    • It’s a tricky issue. If MF is very scarce on items, or if they cap it at 100% (or whatever fairly low amount) then every well equipped char will eventually have that one item, or up to the low % allowed. At which piont you might as well not have the stat in the game at all, since everyone will have the same amount. They’ve got to allow players to choose to go with MF or not, and make there be real trade offs for doing so. Not just tack some MF on top of lots of the best items you’d want to use even without MF, the way the D2 devs did.

      But then that solution runs into problems in this party system, with individual item drops, since that creates a situation that didn’t exist in D2. For all the problems MF had in that game, at least it didn’t allow you to kill nothing, stand in back, an still get your share of drops.

      • there was always the kill nothing, stand in back, and rush in at the last minute to try and grab items before the bot does =D. or rush in front of a multi-shot/orb and grab all the goodies before the attacker is even close.

        but i guess it’s hard to find the perfect solution. in D2 people could grab your items that dropped, espeically if you were still clicking to kill. in D3 people can lag behind and leech the reward off the more productive players. if they made it where your drops depend on your kills, i’m sure that would have its share of problems as well.

  5. Their magic find system is quite flawed when it comes to magic find in parties. The person doing all the work will get sucky drops. The leeches decked out with magic find will get the payoff.

  6. They really should just get rid of the magic find (and gold find) properties all together on items, so people can focus completely on making their character powerful and make drops have the same rate for everyone.

    • Or shrines only which will affect the party as a whole.

    • ^This. MF is a flawed stat in itself. Gimp yourself by loading up on MF in order to find even better (MF) items to gimp yourself even more in order to find better (MF) items, repeat forever.
       
      Throw real money into the mix and where is the point in even trying to create a “powerful” character when you could just MF with your gimped char making more money that way in the end?

    • I like the idea of eliminating Magic Find, but it sounds like it’s already in the game. I also think a more advanced system of drops/rewards could’ve been developed, so that the drop for a character would be based on the amount of damage that character dealt to an enemy plus the amount of damage that character mitigated from the enemy (through blocking, defense, slowing effects, etc.), or other factors related to the efficiency of the character and party involved.

      The solution described here sounds very simple, almost as if they didn’t put a lot of thought into how it could be abused. Sure, at the end of the day any system could be abused, and deciding who you’ll group with (or whether or not to play with strangers) will always be a factor. But here, they’ve created a system that is inherently flawed.

  7. Hm, I wonder if players will be able to see what drops for their companions?  I’d certainly like to!

    • You can not see what drops for other players. (Unless they tell you, though some kind of *found _______* tell is an oft-requested feature.)

      This secrecy fits nicely with the fully-anonymous nature of the RMAH to further the breakdown of the trust bonds that make human society workable, thus bringing us one step closer to anarchy, civilizational degradation, and a new world order funded entirely by B.net’s Bobby Bucks™.

      • TeHe, yah.

        What is with the not being able to withdraw your Bobby Bucks unless you spend them on Bliz Shiz? Sheesh, that’s lame, and of course there are ways to get around that, which are going to be open to exploitation.

        So, I have to decide, do I want to play HC to avoid exploits of the Bobby Bucks system or do I want to play standard mode so I can exploit the system myself… Hmm.

        • you choose wether or not to get cash from the rmah or to put it into your blizzard wallet thing… it’s not mandatory one way or the other…

          • No kidding…

            But people will still stock up money in their Bliz wallet and eventually want to extract it in real dollars. And there are ways to do that, if you can use your imagination.

          • @SH Yeah, but they, and/or Paypal (or whomever) will be making fees on every “cashout”, so it behooves them to nickle and dime you with a lot of small transactions (withdrawals), rather than let it accumulate and have a, say, once a week, fee when you drain it all at once.  I could be wrong, however; if they chose to go by percentages (again, not on the AH process, but the cashout one) instead.

      • Would it then matter if you got the function in getting a peak in what other players get. That wont help them in giving you the item.

        It depends on the player as much as it did in D2 when “omg spamclick and less latency = win”

        As much as it would help i for one would just get more mad if i know a great item for me dropped too another player, Now i can just wonder if it dropped any good.

        • This is exactly why they shouldn’t add in the ability for people to see what you got, and vice-versa. You will never have the scenario where one of “your” items drops for another player, because that’s not how drops work.

          Quite frankly, if I have to play online, the last thing I want to deal with is some player hounding me for an item that I got during the game.

  8. Who’s the dumbass asking these questions? I could’ve given him the answers.

    • It’s the growing mass of casual players finding their way to the battle.net forums. The CMs really enjoy answering stuff they have answered before.

  9. This way no one will know who get’s what during gameplay.  Perhaps this will help Blizz create items no one knows about and sell them in the auction house….

    I admit that I’m paranoid, but honestly, I wouldn’t be surprised  :bloody:

  10. TLDR: People will use the inspect feature to check if the other person is leaching.

  11. It seems I agree with you totally Flux.  But it also seems like my connection is no good.  Since I posted my comment before about 6 others appeared including yours lol.  I guess I shouldnt buy this game then since it’s online only :[

    But you must not be THE Flux ? Where is your Avatar ?

    • I can reply to new comments while I’m using the news script (which I was all afternoon, with so much news to post) but as the comment above indicates, my avatar doesn’t show up  that way. Odd bug, there.

      If a name is in red, it’s a registered account, regardless of having an avatar or not. So no name spoofing is possible with those.  AFAIK.

  12. Anyone ever heard of a password?  If you have problems playing with other players, regardless of what that problem is, create game > password > tada!!

    • A lot of the problems in D2 stem from the team not thinking about things like this. It created a very hostile, unfriendly environment that could have been avoided with some forethought. The solution to a problem should never be “don’t play how you want to in order to avoid it”.

      And there are no longer passworded games. They are either single player, invite-only private, or public AMM.

  13. SWEET ! this is a win win for me. in D2 i favored sorc over all other clases. I never put any points into vitality and dumped it all into mana for non stop spam of 20pt frozen orb and 20pt firewall. any stats i spent went to just enought str and dex to equip my top MAGIC FIND gear which always suxed for defence anyways and 1 skill pt in frozen armor and 1 skill pt in teleport. GLASS-CANNON and the faster cast rate passive solves my damage out put issue as i can now mow down large groups of mobs solo or in a 4 player party. just like max orb and max mastery allowed me to in D2. Since my play style relys heavely on movement VS defence i can both sacrifice all defencive type gear with just a little resistance iteams and dedicate all my gear towards MF. MY DPS will always be high i will be able to solo or kill groups of mobs very easy if there is a MONK or BARB tanking 4 me. Thus i reap close to min-max on magic find percentage and since i don’t rely on best equipment only MF gear i am free to auction off all the stuff i find for real cash or blizzard currency. My style of play alawys assumes my gear is sub-par and i never have anywhere close to enough gold for anything and i never gamble. thus making gold i will bank vs spending. Demon-hunter and Wizard are best suited to this style of play and maybe even the witch doctor will be a viable though a little less cost efective way of playing. I love challengs and D2 was a joke when it came to SORC – AMAZON and TRAPaZONs. ranged DPS is supirior for gold find and magic find. good luck to all u melee players who need defence over MF just to live.

  14. I think all drops (whether in a party or not) are intended for that player.  You can’t get a unique sword that someone else was going to get, because that sword ONLY could have dropped for you. Meaning if it dropped to the ground on your screen, it can be only yours.   So I think it’s a misconception about how the drops are taking place.

    BUT, I think there is a problem with the anonymous nature of the drops which coincide with the RMAH.  This will play into the hands of some players if not the Blizzard crew themselves.

  15. grr… now i actually want this game.

  16. About the last comment. I bet you almost everyone secretly held the idea that they would stack up on MF or GF and slag in the group, dealing damage but just for show. When the loot drops they get something shiny or twinkly.
    .
    But a good way to solve this would be the implementation of a “threat meter” or a party damage dealer so a person in the group dealing way to small % will get kicked out by the rest of the group.
    .
    [edit]
    Or, how about you’ll somehow get loot dependent on the % of damage you’ve dealt to that particular monster. If you’re slow or slacking you’ll get zip.
    Maybe…it’s a brainstorm idea, nothing solid.

  17. Isn’t there going to be a match making sort of system in this game? Just make the default game settings to only allow players around your level, gear, and progression to join, with the ability to tweak these for those that want a broader range. With this, make high amounts of MF/GF only possible with lower quality gear, and little to no amount at all on higher quality gear.
     
    Problem solved?

  18. My Wizard is quite simple. GLASSCANNON : ramps up the damage your spells do will lowering your Defence. QUICKANING : Increase Spell Attack Speed. AKA faster cast rate. PENETRATING SPELL : all enemy resistances are lower’d by 20% ARCANE ORB : mass AOE spell. this will be my main attack all the time. WAVE OF FORCE : Knocks back mobs and knocks back projectials. TELEPORT : my escape from death ability. Also my form for traveling at a fast pace. DEFENCE : will sux. GLASS CANNON will make it even suxier. MAGIC FIND : goal to have every piece of gear have a % to MF on it. GOLD FIND : I dont spend any gold buying iteams from AH or from the blacksmith. I save my Gold and in large sums and i put it up on the auction house for cash. Any real kewl iteams i get from drops with got AH for sale.

  19. I agree with the idea of just nuking Magic Find as a stat entirely. You want to get drops faster? You pick stuff that lets you kill things faster. If Magic Find is a stat and it’s not a worthless stat, then maximizing the rate at which you get stuff is a matter of finding the sweet spot on the curve where you trade some kill speed for Magic Find, but not so much that you kill things slowly enough that it stops being worth it. (+100% MF isn’t worth it if it takes you more than twice as long to kill things.) But who wants a game where being as awesome as possible punishes you by giving you less rewards? Let the game reward being as awesome as possible by making kill speed the sole factor in how fast you get stuff. It sucks that it’s correct to be less awesome than you could be. (Note that kill speed is not simply congruent with raw damage, since if you die, that cuts into your kill speed, so you have to tend to your survivability at least a little.)

  20. So now we know how item farmers, deflation and forced RMAH spending is going to work.
     
    Cookie cutter char on the hammerdin level leading a party of 4 with 3 bots loaded with mf and goldfind following him. Blizzard sells 4 copies for every employee.  :[

  21. At least it will force the gold and item farmers to work in teams 🙂
    On the theory-craft level I can see a certain team work out very well. 2-3 Barbarians with maxed out MF and MF and all skills gear to trying to be as tanky as possible together with a Wizard that is as glass cannon-y as possible. Wizard kills everything unopposed because of the tanks, barbs get great gold and item drops.
    I like that they made drops individual at least, people stealing drops really grinded my gears in D2. I’d be more tempted to play together in parties now, even if some of the people might be MF leeching.

    • It’s hard to tell at this point, lets just hope neither the Monk nor the Daemon Hunter gets a loophole ability to tank while being built on damage at the same time.
      Your version at least requires a real persons playing the game. (but that depends on how smart the bot software is going to be)

    • If they make serious tradeoffs for MF, i.e. MF items make you a weak character, then your only way to enjoy MF is leeching in the background in a party. I bet that is how this system will be used, among farmers. They have 1-2 MF characters in the background collecting loot.

    • Now your talking my style of WIZARD class cannon farming. Only prob with BARB tank MF gear is that if i notice they aren’t pulling there weight i can choose to GRIEF Them. when we hit a hard spot i attack off in another direction for 5 – 10 seconds causing mass damage to quickly stack up on our poor tank and greatly enhancing his chance’s of dying. (this is not my play style) but i fear this happening to me when i am a monk or barb. I guess there is really no way to stop some one from causing GRIEF. but it is in famers best intrest to work together as faster killing = more random loot. Personally i will definatly play hardcore alot. knowing that none of my games are influenced by cash or Farmers.

  22. Hey got a question not much related to MFs, but about picking up things.
    If say u got a legendary sword. The 3 other guys beside you wont see it, and they cant pick up. You are so excited, u click on the sword, and it bounces off the floor and fell on the floor again and you think to urself “**** my inventory is full!!!!!”
    At this instance, does it count as you threw out the item, and hence the other 3 guys will see it and try to snatch it while u try to empty ur inventory?

    • While we probably aren’t able to answer that until the game is out, I think it will be likely protected from views since it doesn’t come out of the inventory.
      Further we do not know yet how dropped items should behave, and whenever/under what circumstances they should show up at all.

      • Hey, yeh i guess, i was just thinking bout it since this is said:
        Bashiok: You only see items that you can pick up. Whether that’s your individual drops, or items someone else threw down that everyone can see.
        So if u see something someone threw down, ill say u can pick it up. But what classcify as threw down? does it need to go into inventory first? or something like i described is considered threw down as well?

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