The Diablo 3 Podcast #92: D3 Year One — The Diablo Community

Flux, Neinball, and Wolfpaq discuss the Diablo community and speculate on why passions often run so high, and why so many self-professed “haters” stick around to complain and troll, rather than moving on with their lives.

This is the second half of the show begun with TDP #91, but you need not listen to that one first since the topics are entirely separate between the shows.

Approximate segment starting times:

  • 0:10 — Intro and Diablo 3 community overview.
  • 4:40 — Is the Diablo 3 community really that much more negative than other gaming communities? Why do people who claim not to like Diablo 3 stick around to troll people who do play it and to say that every other upcoming ARPG will be 10x better? Why does this not occur with WoW and Starcraft, even in the downtimes for those games? Is it a testimony to the enduring enjoyment (and rose-tinted glasses) of Diablo 2?
  • 12:00 — Diablo 3 didn’t live up to impossibly-high expectations? Would Diablo 2.5 have been more popular? An update rather than a full sequel?
  • 20:10 — Expectations for upcoming changes to Diablo 3? Anything big coming up before the expansion adds massive content and changes everything?
  • 25:00 — Creepy unicorn sound effects.

The Diablo 3 Podcast Episode Guide in provides links to every show, plus quick summaries.

  • Listen and subscribe through iTunes.
  • View video versions of all The Diablo Podcasts on You Tube, via our all-encompassing Diablo3Inc channel.
  • Get the Podcast RSS feed
  • We have a quick 1 year anniversary vote for our Facebook fans that’s asking How long have you been playing Diablo 3? There are five options from “since release” all the way to “stopped playing” – select your option.


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    1. I haven’t been able to access the past several podcasts through iTunes, though they are available through my iPhone’s podcast app (Last one I was able to download in iTunes was #85). When I click the link you provided in the post to “subscribe through iTunes” I get an error message stating “this is not available in the US iTunes store but is available in the UK store. Would you like to switch to the UK store?”. After switching to the UK store I am prompted with a message stating the podcast is not available through the UK store either.

      Any idea whats going on Flux?

      • Sorry, but I’ll check into it, which means I’ll poke Rush and hope he can fix it.

        Excuse time: I finally got sick of itunes software some months ago and used a hack to reformat my ipod so I could manage it with the winamp mp3 player software. Which is lame, but at least there’s drag and drop file movement and organization, so it doesn’t drive me insane the way apple software does.

        However, as a result of that change I no longer think to check if the podcast is syndicating properly through itunes, since I now manage my podcast subscriptions through RSS feeds or just by directly grabbing the mp3s and click/dragging them onto my mp3 player.

    2. No, Diablo 3 is not the only game that faces negativity (some deserved and some not deserved). You run a fan site of one of the most popular pc game franchise of all time, you’re bound to attract haters, trolls, and many who can overlook the flaws and enjoy themselves. Besides…you get page hits and incgamers makes money off it. It shouldn’t REALLY be a problem for you 🙂

    3. Haha! 30 minutes talking about haters. /popcorn

    4. It’s not the only community with bitching fans but they are some of the whiniest out there.

    5. The ending of this podcast is phenomenal. Whoever did that: have an awesome day and know that you are awesome!

    6. Surprised about the hate ? Cant talk for everyone but this game was/is hugely disappointing for me and my group of mates, after all the changes pre release and Jay Wilson telling us he knows better I can see why people flame it.

      • When exactly did Jay Wilson say he knows better, and to whom? And who says he doesn’t know better?

        I for one think he made an excellent game.

        And of course it’s not going to be flawless from the start. How many products do you know about that was flawless in the first version of it? D2 sure wasn’t.

        • It’s been a staple for the d3 dev team to use phrases like “that’s not fun,” “fans are remembering that wrong, through rose tinted glasses,” and other stuff like “While players state X is good we think they don’t really understand x and in reality x is artificial and bad.”

          Nearly all the changes design wise that have come to the game post release were all called out by avid fans and criticized before players even got their hands on the game. Jay, Bashiok, etc. consistently defended all their positions with comments like I provided in the first paragraph. Strange how all those positions they claimed were better and the players didn’t really understand the issues… are all changes that failed and have now been or are currently in the process of reverting back to what most fans originally thought was better.

          Hate or no hate the dev team has had to revert and make changes to the game on positions they once argued were not only inferior, but simply bad for the game.

          • Only a few times did they actually say stuff like. “fans remembering that wrong” and 90% of those time it was to address art controversy lunatics stating that d2 was a dark and creepy game with no colors when it actually was pretty colorful.

            The other times they simply explained why they did changes to address criticism. Part of addressing criticism is to actually tell why they think the so called “fans” are wrong. Nothing wrong with that. They didn’t say that “We know best, you suck” like the fans did, they simply gave insight to the thought process of some of the changes they made. And for the most part they did back up design decisions with good arguments, even if fans didn’t agree with the design philosophies behind those arguments and the results coming out of them.

            • Every post by Blizzard, and every panel is coated in an almost impenetrable sheet of PR. Before posting it gets reviewed, before going on a panel someone from PR does a run through on how to answer some of the most challenging questions. The most honest communication we have ever seen from Blizzard was the “Fuck that loser” fiasco between the devs. That in of itself says everything.

              Yes they have said on multiple occasions everything that chimpomon referred to, and your love of the game laden with flaws does not diminish the validity of his claims.

            • Look… you made the claim that Jay apparently never said he knew better and that assuming he did make the claim he knew better maybe he really does know better.

              I provided pretty clear evidence that not only did he state he knew better, but that has been a staple argument with the entire dev team for a while now. Also its clear that he didn’t really know better. So ya both your arguments are just shit.

              I could list at least 10 specific examples where Jay and co. clearly failed by choosing a bad design philosophy and later reverted, currently reverted, or simply admitted it was bad but they can’t fix it. Your silly comment about art controversy being 90 percent is just pure horse shit. It’s apparent you just want to be a willfully ignorant and stupid online persona so enjoy living in lala land.

            • Chimponon.

              You haven’t given me one example of Jay ever telling the community that he knows better. You only said he did without providing any example of anything. That’s not evidence. That’s only opening your mouth.

              The example we have is the one I gave, the art controversy, where I personally remember them saying that ppl remembered d2 to be a far darker game than it was. i have never heard them say anything like that ever after, and this is coming from somebody that probably read all he ever said during the development of the game.

              They also said that PKing is not fun, but I think he spoke for 95% of the community whit that one.

              I think you guys deliberately confusing “argumentation” with “I know better”.

              So go ahead and make your list of 10 things!
              Make sure to give examples of developers having the “I know better” or attitude when speaking about those things. Otherwise it will only count as something they admitted was a bad decision, which is the opposite of a “I know best” attitude. Right?

              And don’t give me the item argument. Items was barely talked about before release, since we didn’t have any info about them. Blizzard admitted that they sucked pretty much 2 month after release and made changes to address that mistake.

        • “How many products do you know about that was flawless in the first version of it? D2 sure wasn’t.”

          It surely wasn’t.

          However, when you release virtually the same game for the second time a decade later – plus updated graphics/different story/gameplay refinements/minor additions/etc. – it is expected of you that you don’t make the same mistakes again (or mistakes that are much worse, as in this case). Something should have happened and hopefully improved during these long years, or else you’ll find yourself confronted with fan outrage upon release. Especially if you decided to hype them for years since the moment you barely had two tileset- and character-mockups ready and a rough vision of what could be.

          Long story short: They failed to recreate the original game’s spirit with a new developement team, failed to meet the high expectations they set for themselves and continue to fail fixing all that within acceptable margins. This has nothing to do with D2’s early state though nor is it an excuse to crash back down so far on the game design learning curve. =/

    7. I for one, kind of enjoy checking up on d3 and admittedly make comments that are very critical. I’m not exaggerating or trolling nor am I stating any of it with hate. I just find it amusing and I guess cathartic to express my overall disappoint with the game.

      I originally participated on the forums and made pretty in depth and long posts about what I thought blizzard could do better and improve on the game along with stuff that simply needed to go. I gave that up back in October and simply stopped logging in d3 as well. It became incredibly annoying and simply an arbitrary and useless chore to try to communicate on the forums and other places with an expectation that blizzard is actually going to seriously consider it. It was just depressing seeing the number of amazingly well constructed posts with feedback and positive criticism and helpful insight into what blizz can do to make d3 better and having nearly all of them get no blue response or something stupid when a blue DOES reply with a comment like \Oh we certainly appreciate your feedback! keep it up!\ You know if there are threads on the blizz forums with over 98 percent likes and support it has to be good.

      Anyway I suppose most the hate or in my case disappointment comes from having such high expectations of the game, getting friends etc to buy it and come together to play it and the game was just really bad and frankly still is for a d3 successor. Sadly I honestly don’t care much about the Diablo franchise anymore. I find it entertaining to be overly negative and make posts from time to time when I am browsing the webs. D3 really did kill the future of Diablo for me. While I admit that I want to see what they do with the expansion and hope they do things right the 2nd time around d3 is pretty low on the care meter for me at this point. I am way more interested in d2 HD or w/e .

    8. I think this podcast painted the community as being entirely made up of those people who complain that D3 is the worst game ever while having a toon with 500hrs played in June ’12. Or of people that post derisively about how “some other game” will be so much better than D3. While examples ofboth of these are true, I think it’s too bad the podcast didn’t have a more reasoned view of why the community has been quite harsh towards Blizzard over the past year. I also think the D3 team has contributed to help stir this pot of vitriol from time to time.

      It’s not just JW’s FTL moment, though that certainly is the biggest example of the D3 team being out of touch. It’s also their firmly-held belief that D3’s design was solid. Bashiok posted that rares were intended to be the best items in the game, not legendaries. How whacked is that? We also had JW boasting that D3 was in “polish mode” for the prior two years. This even though PvP was pulled from the release. Oh, but don’t worry it’ll be added back in prior to the end of the year. It would be disastrous otherwise lol.

      More recently we’ve had JW at the GDC doing his best to salvage what reputation he has left as a credible designer, to some degree at our expense. And his assertion that the AH is to blame for D3’s woes is nothing short of pathetic. Most game developers don’t have designers that seem bent on tweaking the nose of their customers (Maxis/EA being the exception).

      The community wants to enjoy D3, but I believe the overwhelming sentiment expressed by us is that it is taking too damn long to fix the problems that Blizzard has taken too damn long to acknowledge. Blizzard has said that they iterate to a fine point to ensure a quality product, but the RMAH bug introduced in 1.08 quashes that line of argument.

      TL;DR: Community isn’t that toxic, though the backlash towards Blizzard has been in part Blizzard’s own doing.

    9. This podcast was SO off.

      You guys have made so many wrong assumptions, specially because you all had the same opinion and no one to counter most arguments. Very undemocratic and shows how you don’t understand the issues or the people who visit the website.

      You lost a few points with me IncGamers. I might not renew my subscription.

    10. there continues to be so much dialog from people who quit because the issues with d3 are complex to fix. no one agrees about what specifically needs to change. just look at the posts here!

      I think the biggest error they made was calling it diablo. if it instead was a new game set in the sanctuary universe with elements of diablo 1 & 2, there would have been muvh less baggage and player expectations. there would still be comparisons, but I think the decisions they did make would be more palatable to some of the loudest critics.

    11. Terrible podcast guys…Not really, but not understanding Diablo 3 have a Huge community of “”hater””/critics/people loosing hope its because the CARE ABOUT THE GAME.
      But when caring about the game, being critic and patient is not enough people get anxious and disapointed, users are talking at forums about the same flaws since beta and developer team do not solve/change it with a patch a month after launch…they practically seem to have NO IDEA about how to expand/repair/improve the game.

      Just remember, if people show their disappointment with the game month after month…it’s because THEY CARE and probably LOVE the game, but see a slow/bad/blind/deaf developer team.

      I think nobody can argue D3 is a great game if we compare it with the “mortal/normal” games aka not-Blizzard games, or…what Blizzard game used to be.

      It’s more than a year post launch and Dev. team don’t solved BASIC issues with the game, most of them EASY to solve…they do not say/know what to do with the expansion…THE HELL!! I WANT MORE FROM THIS GAME!!

      PD:It’s the first game I install after formating…I play every week…I like it…and yep I WANT MORE!!! xDD I’m not a hater…call me ¿pusher?

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