RMAH Possible For Hardcore - Diabloii.Net

RMAH Possible For Hardcore


An interesting tweet has recently come from DiabloWikiJay Wilson‘s account stating that the RMAH may, in fact, come to the hardcore scene. If there was one thing that would ruin the hardcore community, it would be micro-transactions for resurrections. While it would not be a “9.99 for a resurrection,” it could be perceived in such a way. While you would be required to re-level to 60 over again, you could charge your card to either buy a new character or simply re-buy all that was lost. Many believe that if character selling becomes available, hardcore would simply cease to be hardcore.

Alternate means of monetary transactions are always available for the hardcore community. However, there is deeper significance to the monetization of the hardcore community. Not only would an RMAH diminish hardcore stigma, it could open a Pandora’s box for the legal team that could have resonating repercussions. Parents with children that use their credit cards with light-fingered contempt notwithstanding, “I didn’t know” just isn’t a reliable or legally viable excuse for killing off a character with $300 invested in it (or however much you wasted on DiabloWikiBobby Bucks), and such legal claims are easily fought. As such, it would seem that the costs from legal battles would not be a primary deterrent, but the effect a negative experience would have with their consumers – that is to say us. But who knows. It’s also possible that the demand is just not there, and such qualms would be few and far between.

@Angryrobotics Always wanted a genuinely hard but fun game. I truly think hardcore D3 will bring that. Any chance at RMAH on hardcore?
If there is a demand for it we’ll consider it.

It would seem to me, at least, that HC would have become somewhat of a refuge for those that wish to dodge the community of money-spenders in softcore. In short, it would be a community that Blizzard would not have chosen to monetize, and therefore an untapped source of revenue. Surely Bobby would frown at such an oversight on Blizzard’s part.

Yet, with the introduction of the RMAH to the hardcore community, I believe it would effectively alienate them from what the mode really “stands” for – or at least the banner under which the majority of the hardcore community rallies.

As an addendum to this editorial, I see that it would be remiss to not address the benefits of having an DiabloWikiRMAH – as some comments have pointed out. As I briefly mentioned before, such transactions would be present no matter what. As such, it would be in Blizzard’s interest not only to capitalize on an untapped revenue stream, but to allow a secure measure for such transactions. It seems, however, that Blizzard’s initial reasoning behind it was that the costs outweigh the benefits.

When talking with Jay and DiabloWikiRob Pardo last July, their reasoning behind the omission of an RMAH was to “save people from themselves.” The RMAH would create certain barriers and legal troubles, as well as a deterrent for customer’s continued use of the feature. Since this tweet directly involves the demand for such an option, it would seem that they are looking at as a viable revenue stream for the option before making it available.

What is the community’s reaction to this bit of information? I think it would be interesting to get a poll on this, seeing how people who actually will be playing hardcore feel about this possibility versus those who do not on playing it.

Thanks Muggs for posting in the forums.

Tagged As: | Categories: Blizzard People, Diablo 3

Comments

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    • Hardcore players do not want an RMAH, obviously as we can see by the posts. Therefore there is no demand. Therefore there will be no hardcore RMAH. Derp?

    • That’s your personal choice. There is a huge demand for HC items in D2, it will be the same in D3. It will dumb of Blizzard not to profit from it.
       
      How does this affect you? D3 is not a race. Don’t like RMAH, don’t buy items from it, plain and simple. I am 100% HC player, and I will not buy anything from RMAH, but I be sure as heck glad to sell on it.

      • Feel exactly the same way – Id be Very much in Favor of a HC AH … I really want it.  And no I dont plan on paying money for items from it but Id be glad to sell things more then glad …

        IMO blizz will be missing out on a big cash cow … I hope they include it.  Besides the best players wont be paying they will be playing and doing well … the worse players will be dying alot and be spending alot.    

      • It seems that HC players will not buy a lot. Maybe it would be better to only let HC player sell items to SC players.

    • How would the RMAH on hardcore be any different than JSP?
       
      Wow, you guys are still as ignorant as you were back in August, this is all it is, except we would be able to cash out our items, instead of being stuck with FG.
       
      And D2jsp was widely used, and will be widely used if RMAH is not implemented into HC. Only difference is, one man will be reaping the benefits with D2JSP, instead of the players actually playing the game….
       
      Nizaris, imho, you couldn’t be more wrong with this article. HC Rmah would be a welcome addition for me!

      • To be honest, I wasn’t really speaking for you. I was speaking for the pulse of the HC community. I understand your position, and the positions of those that welcome it. However, the HC community is already a small portion of players and that “hardcore” has the general consensus of “no, we don’t want an RMAH.”

        But as I say in the article, I base both the opinion of the article and the facts surrounding it based on the reasoning presented to my group at Blizzard Headquarters back when the RMAH was announced. 

        • Please tell me where I can see that “general consensus”, because I’m not aware of it.
           
          I consider myself to be part of the HC community and I don’t really agree with anything you say, which is fine as long as you’re not including me in your statements. When you presume to speak for the HC community you’re doing just that and honestly, it offends me.
           
          You don’t represent the HC community, you speak for one person only: Yourself.

          • Are you new to the Diablo III community? 

            And you’re offended?

            And are you familiar with basic editorial jargon?

            Because “pulse” is used as term to indicate the ebb and flow of a majority’s feelings towards something. By dint of using “majority,” you accept that it is not unanimous. In fact, you can sense the pulse of the community just by looking at the most popular comments on this article. In other words – those that say “no, we don’t want it.” It’s not scientific, but it’s a pulse – the indicative nature of a majority.

            And there’s also one more thing. I’m speaking for myself when I say “I believe.” Which, in fact, means that this is an opinion article and how I am reflecting upon the pulse of what I’ve seen in the hardcore community. In my comment above, I was referring to the how I wrote my article – in reflection to what I’ve witnessed from the community itself.

            Self-righteous posting just looks silly and shallow, so please refrain from doing so. “Being offended” by a post that represents a majority (because you are in the minority), just seems like wasted energy and misplaced angst. If it makes you feel better, I’m not speaking for you. I’m sorry you got offended by my choosing to speak for the pulse I perceived from the HC community.  

          • “Pulse”?
             
            So what you’re basically saying is that you have nothing that properly indicates a majority or minority, you don’t even have a poll from this site, which is probably the most critical D3 site of all. The only thing you’re mentioning that I can check is a “top comment” and I’ve been on the internet long enough to know how much that means if the first comment displayed is the first comment posted: Nothing.
             
            I may not be familiar with editorial jargon (…), but I am familiar with journalistic integrity, and in my world that doesn’t just cease to exist once you start writing about your opinion. You have no proof and no proper indicator that you’re with the majority, so stop acting like you do until you can acquire something more than a… “pulse”.

    • Sorry to say, but Blizzard won’t hear you. Their statements pretty much confirms we will see the RMAH introduced in hardcore. There’s always a demand for items, especially in hardcore where you can permanently pwn other players if you have better gear.
       
      At least now fanboys won’t be able to say “play hardcore mode if you don’t like item selling” anymore.

  1. Because it’ll be easy and quick to implement post release >.<

    • yes it would be ; why wouldnt it ? if its ready for sc it would be ready for hc ; should they decide to really implement that brain fart of an idea

  2. “Always wanted a genuinely hard but fun game. …Any chance at RMAH on hardcore?” 

    that just sounds inherently contradictory 

    and yes, I understand that I don’t have to use it, and that people should be allowed to play the game as they want, but it just seems wrong

    • You read what you want to read, obviously. I want the RMAH simply to sell things, and not to buy them. This has worked in other games for me that have real economies, and I enjoy it.

      “but it just seems wrong” – how constructive. 🙂

    • I don’t think the point is that he considers the RMAH to make the game harder but rather that he wants to use the RMAH and he can’t play HC if he wants to do that. So, in order for him to enjoy the hardest game mode, he wants RMAH to be a part of it.

      At least that’s how I understood that.

  3. FUCKING GOD DAMNIT THOSE FUCKING FAGGOTS BETTER NOT.  MOTHER FCUKING RMAH IS STUPID TO START, AND THEY WANT TO FUCK THEIR HARDCORE PLAYERS TOO?  BUNCH OF FUCKING BULLSHIT.  FUCK RMAH, LET IT “SIZZLE” A BIT, AND FUCKING DIE.  NEVER.  NEVER.  FUCK BLIZZARD, JUST GIVE US ARE FUCING HALF FINISHED GAME AND LET USS DI PEACFULLY.

    • ^ my thoughts exactly.

      and just when you thought HC would be the safe-haven from RMAH. Blizzard knifes us again.

    • This is my reaction right now after reading this article.
      Seriously what the hell Blizzard?
      I’m calling the cops!

    • Ok don’t implement the RMAH….
       
      I’ll just use D2JSP and it will be exactly the same thing, cept I’m stuck with FG….
       
      Seriously guys, get the fuck over it. We’ve always been able to sell Diablo items for real money….

      • I wish I could like this more than once, because it is true. Real Money for Items will be a part of d2 regardless of who does it.

      • Why would you use Forum Gold when we are going to have in-game gold auction house? Forum gold is completely worthless in Diablo 3 because there will be a functional economy within the game.
        The only people who think otherwise are the idiots who have amassed thousands of FG in preparation for D3. That well is going to dry up fast once people realize how valueless it is.

    • Appreciate the sentiment, but lay off the h.omophobic language please.

  4. ” it would essential be just that. While, yes, you would have to get to level 60 all over again, you could just swipe your card to gear out your character without the dedication.”

    Incredible writing, absolutely incredible.
     

    • Not sure if that was actually a compliment… or simply a nod to typos from my midnight writing…

      • Compliment for what? The article? Give me a break..

        If you have to cash up incredible amounts of money (for a game) then that might account as hardcore for some of us, namely the ones who can’t afford 90% of our time playing games. Maybe for you, that’s really bad since you got the time but not the cash.

        • Clearly you don’t know Septar as we do. 

          And clearly you aren’t familiar with the hardcore community. 

          Also, if you were expecting Pulitzer prize material here at IncGamers, don’t hold your breath please.

        • no, putting up incredible amounts of money for a game doesn’t account as hardcore for anybody

          “hey, look at me, I’m hardcore, I just spent $100” 
          🙄 

  5. Seriously if they do that then ill give up on D3… everyday = bad news… release this shit as it is and stop fucking around with it.

  6. No.
     
    No no no no no. I even LIKE the RMAH in a roundabout way but there is nothing worse for hardcore.

  7. Do we know if a person dies in a HC pvp they lose the character?
    Aside from PVP I honestly don’t see an issue with it. People pay for what they want. I personally will never put another dime into the game after buying it because i enjoy the run to 60, and the endless hours of finding the best gear humanly possibly for each of my builds. If someone really wants to rake out 300 dollars for a HC character that will most likely still die because they have no skill whatsoever (personal opinion on people who wast money to bypass the best part of the game.) Then why not let them? The only way I really see this effecting the rest of the community is in PVP  BUT again my previous statement comes full circle. IF you have no skill you will fail in pvp. If you just spent 300 dollars on a character, you probably wont take that chance. Now on the flip side, say  you just spent 60+ hours trying to finish your perfect pvp build and your missing one piece that you just cant find… I find it justifiable that the person (not me .. hellz no ) may consider spending 20$ (or hell after 60 hours you should have the gold for the part just buy it in the normal ah ) to finish there PVP build. Well that was one hell of a drunk rant…. People below me , please discuss , I’m going to pass out, Peace 🙂 

    • Nah, they don’t lose their character in PvP. But… since PvP is removed in release, I suppose even that is up in the air now.

  8. Hardcore is hardcore for a reason. If you buy all your stuff for mothers credit card then you not worth being in hardcore. 

    But I feel Blizzard will implement RMAH in HC, because it’s just more money for Blizzard that way.

    • What if you happen to be an adult with your own money? What if you use your own credit card, and not “for mothers [sic] credit card”?

      I don’t really want RMAH in HC either, but I don’t really think the holier-than-thou rhetoric everyone is spouting means anything at all. 

      • Who cares if it’s your own money. If you can buy best stuff for $ then hardcore is not the same.

      • It’s just an expression. The key word there is “buy”, not “mother’s”. (edit: i meant to reply to MRR, not Kblavkalash)

        • Delvin it is a reply to MRR, if it was to Kblavkalash it would look like mine does below yours and stepped in a bit.

        • It’s hyperbole, not an “expression”. I understood what he was getting at – my point is that under all of the hollow exaggerations, people aren’t actually giving any reasons why hardcore would be “ruined” by an RMAH, especially with the GAH already there.

  9. I like it.

    Hardcore is hardcore. Life is hardcore too.

    Besides, there is nothing more hardcore than losing 100 Euros in poker too.

    I love it. Epic.. At least now on line rpg’s will seperate the real men from the whiney boys.

    If Diablo 3 launches 5 months before Gw2, NCSoft can already forget its advantage of having no subscriptions.

    RMAH will shape the future of on line play. Having a real money player driven economy is the bright future of risky gaming.

     

    • except when GW2 launches it will have PvP 
      5 months after D3 is released, we’ll still be waiting  

      • Truer words were never said.  Then again, I don’t consider non competitive, “every scrub gets a trophy”, to be legitimate PvP. 

    • This is it. Feel free to pump up your hc character. As there is no competition, you can spend as money as you wish. But better be prepared for when you die to <insert random lag or bug or unskill here>, your money is lost. L-O-S-T.

      I can even imagine that text: “You have but a one life, hero. If you happen to die, though your deeds (and money™) will be remembered…. 

    • great……..    -_-
      sims = D3
      sometimes the stupidity of people r beyond believe….

  10. They won’t do it. “If there is a demand for it we’ll consider it.” is a business way of saying “we consider all of our customers opinions but we won’t just do what some people want”.

  11. There is no reason to not have a RMAH for hardcore.
     
    And the hc rmah has a chance at being healthy and sustainable.

    • This is way I look at it.  The hardcore market will always be stronger because of the extra item/gold sink associated with character death so those looking to make a profit will do better in HC if they can manage to get to a decent farming point (even if they just farm mid-normal gear to sell to fresh characters).  This will drive demand such that it could be more profitable to sell hardcore items on third party sites than to use the RMAH on softcore items.

  12. who would be such an idiot as to invest 300 bucks on a hardcore…..hell, even a softcore character??

    • Is this your first time entering a free-to-play microtransaction arena? I ask this as a legitimate question, because you’d be astounded, absolutely astounded as to how many would invest that much and more.

      The owner of D2legit owns a 5 million dollar mansion in the California palisades. Look him up. 😉 

      • I read an AMA over at Reddit from a former Zynga employee. He told us how there are plenty of people who poured thousands of dollars into those facebook games.

    • People spend hundreds of thousands on used panties online (specially stained ones) and get them shipped  to them in the mail, so yes 300 on digital D3 items does sound completely reasonable.

      • D: sounds like you speak from personal experience! if that’s the case, I need my stained torn black thong with the stringy crack hairs back. total product recall announced way back.

        Niz: yeah I guess it is. personally I can justify paying 10-15 bucks for a DLC weapons pack, but paying up a total of 300+ bucks for items that can drop for me anytime is utter lunacy. especially when it’s just a video game and won’t benefit me at all in real life like a super-rare cd pack, or anywhere else other than that single game. for god’s sake a crack whore will cost to buy alot less!

        *edit* oh wicked, “whore” is allowed! oh oh oh the possibilities are endlessly interesting

  13. Well i see this as in fact profitable and reasonable. Actually i was wandering why they did not made it from start.
    Simple fact:
    1. Black market WILL be present in HC. No matter of whet we do, how hard punishment is, no matter of what there WILL be black   market. People willing to pay for items will somehow find those who willing to sell. Obvious question is why give those money to someone else when you make create legit place for those people who will buy/sell anyway? 
    2. HC demand. This is huge because HC demand VASTLY different of SC. In case of SC any real value may be only on the very top level items that drops incredibly rare so demand is limeted. In compensation to this stands the population od SC whitch is huge. So i predict very competitive market with lots of microtransaction. Also prices will devalue with each new item dropped weighted to the amount of active players. Basically at some point prices will be lowering every day. So in the end only most rare and unique items will have any real cost at all.

    HC will be different. First of all we must consider the fact that HC characters dies with all items that dissapears. More than that – they dies at any level and there is a constant demand for middle class gear. This is like bad quality electronics that you buy today and it dies week later and you have to buy another. Only here you have NO warranty. The only problem is to draw more players to this market and it may be much more profitable than sc.

    And for all those who raging at blizz and RMAH i say what i always say. Stay away from RMAH and express your rage on wow goldsellers/d2 items sellers. And even if you will – nothing changes. If market exist your cryes will never EVER do anything about it no matter how much tears you drop. Profit always come first. So i prefere some blizz game designer get rich instead of some soulless bastard selling anihhilus for 0.99$

    Cheers.

  14. There will be real money trading in Hardcore, whether people want it or not. There may as well be an official way to do it, to make the black market’s job harder.

    • The difference is if it’s official the real money trading will be at least 10x as huge.

    • There will definitely be RMT in hardcore, with or without support from Blizzard. Either the way, those people are cheats to me.

    • There will be botting in Hardcore, whether people want it or not.  There may as well be an official way to do it, to make the black market’s job harder.

      See what I did there? 

      • I don’t deny that botting will exist in softcore, but I think we’re being a little premature about hardcore. This isn’t D2. You wont be able to level up a new character in an hour. There is no chickenscript when your bot gets in trouble. Boss runs are a thing of the past. And finally inferno is designed to be challenging for people.
         
        All these points will work against bots in hardcore which lead me to believe there is a chance we wont see them much. It’s feasible that the quantity over quality aspect of botting wont translate well in Diablo 3’s hardcore scene.
         
        On top of that Softcore will be a much more fertile ground for botters and farmers selling their wares through the legal RMAH.

  15. Real talk, people buying and selling Hardcore items is going to happen wether or not there’s an official hc rmah. The whole idea behind the rmah was to move that aspect of the game away from third party sites, as well as generate profit for act/blizz. The fact that it wasn’t already implemented for HC is just an oversight. Or Blizzard trying to pander to idiots who think items won’t be bought and sold in hardcore. Those same idiots also think this somehow affects their hardcore character.
    You people railing against these facts are naive as hell.

    Nizaris, “open a pandora’s box for the legal team.” Read a EULA sometime bro, your reporting is atrocious. They’re already covered, and could further cover themselves with a few sentences.

    There would be absolutely zero legal resource for any scenario you want to play out re: losing money.

    • My reporting is based on the horse’s mouth “bro.” This was the primary reason from omitting an RMAH for HC back in July’s press event – you know, the one where they introduced the RMAH. So… I guess you can tell Rob Pardo and Jay Wilson to read an EULA. 

      And clearly you’re not too clear on the legal bounds of an EULA. It’s extremely easy to invalidate.

      “The simplest method is to have a third party install the software and agree to the EULA (e.g. – your son, daughter, nephew, you get the picture), making it clear that he/she is not accepting the agreement on your behalf, but is accepting the agreement in full. If you explain exactly what they are agreeing to (terms and conditions) it should not be hard to find someone to do this for you. Remember, anyone who has agreed to the EULA (someone who already installed the same software), is already bound by the terms and conditions of the EULA and would not be agreeing to anything they did not already agree to.
       
      If your third party tells you they would deny having done so in a court of law, that is fine. If one were brought to court for violation of the EULA, declaring that one had a third party accept the EULA is sufficient to invalidate the EULA. Legally, a declaration stands as is, unless it is successfully challenged by the opposing council in court.

      Essentially, an EULA is legally binding if you agree to it, and if you can get the software on your computer without agreeing to the EULA, you are not bound by the EULA. For that same reason, if someone created a third party installer that installs the software independently of the products installer, that too would bypass the EULA. Remember, If you own the merchandise, you can do anything you want with it, unless you bind yourself to a EULA.”

      So… I think it’s best to understand the real truth before posting like you know what you’re talking about. These are law basics for video game development.

       

  16. How would the RMAH destroy Hardcore mode in ways that the GAH will not? What’s so fundamentally different about “swiping a credit card” to re-build your character and doing the exact same thing with in-game gold?

    This whole argument seems to amount to nothing more than “Hardcore mode is… hardcore, and that means that it’s like, tuff or something, and I don’t have any money so the RMAH is bad!” I don’t want the RMAH in HC either, but not because I think playing hardcore is some sort of morally-superior way to inflate my e-peen out to epic proportions.

    You’re also assuming that the best gear in the game will be readily available in abundance on the auction house, and without duping that hopefully won’t turn out to be the case, at least not for several years. 

    • The best gear in the game will be readily available. Bots notwithstanding, these Auction Houses will be the trading grounds for millions of people, as they are region bound rather than server bound as they are in World of Warcraft.

      The sheer volume of players will make such items readily available. Perhaps not out of the gate, but surely as the market equilibrium is settles for such game commodities.

      • Even if all the best gear is available (which I’m still uncertain about; millions of people will be playing the game, but only a fraction of those will be engaged in serious end-game farming), I fail to see how the RMAH would destroy hardcore in a way that the GAH does not. What’s the difference between using real money and safely farming gold in low-level areas until you can buy everything you need?

    • “Hardcore mode is… hardcore, and that means that it’s like, tuff or something”

      yes, exactly 
      and its not about e-peen, its about hardcore
      hell, if they have a RMAH they might as well sell resurrections  

      • My point, since you seem to have missed it, is that citing the name of the mode isn’t actually a valid argument. It’s “die once” mode. Other connotations of the descriptive terms used to label that particular gameplay mode aren’t valid arguments in and of themselves.

    • Because Gold Auction House requires you to put time and effort “IN GAME.” RMAH allows players to bypass many of the challenges of hardcore and use outside resources to purchase success.
       
      I can’t just conjure up 1 million gold in hardcore. I have to go out and earn it by playing the game. That is what people in the hardcore community want players to do. Earn their stuff by fighting in hardcore.

      • You can’t just conjure up a million gold in normal (non-hardcore) play either, so why is the RMAH acceptable there but not in hardcore? If you’re opposed to the RMAH in general, that’s fine, but Nizaris was trying to suggest that the RMAH would compromise the spirit of hardcore mode in some way that was different from its presence in normal mode – his wording before an edit was also a bit more harsh. 

  17. I actually like the idea of having a RMAH in hardcore. (1) There will be ppl buying gear from the gold AH to tune their characters. That’s what the AH is for, right? And there will be 3rd party website for those ppl to convert $$$ to gold. Why not let Blizzard make the conversion with a RMAH from the start? (2) I  probably would not have played HC for the lack of the RMAH. Why play HC with the risk of dying permanently when I could play SC and actually make money in the RMAH? Overall it’s a good thing.

  18. Doesn’t really bother me, as long as the character purchasing isn’t allowed.  Being able to buyrequirement doesn’t really seem to ruin the integrity of anything, IMO.  Really just a way for people who want to throw away their money to, well, throw it away. 

  19. Good article. Let us pray to the High Heavens that hardcore will remain a S/sanctuary free of Bobby’s gaze.

  20. Whether or not an RMAH will be in HC depends entirely on the playerbase. If a huge black market exists for HC then Blizzard will implement it to counter gold spammers since it means that players are willing to invest money even with one-life characters.
     
    People really shouldn’t attack Blizzard for this decision, since ultimately it’s up to player demand that determines whether HC has a black market or not.

  21. The only reason I was planning on playing SC was that I could sell some stuff lulz. I will never play SC if RMAH was included in HC. I would never BUY an item with money and I’m not really bothered by someone buying something from RMAH. If RMAH wasn’t in, ppl would still buy stuff from 3rd party websites anyway..

  22. I love the idea. I pretty much only play HC and would love to be able to make some cash on the side while playing without having to rely on 3rd party sellers.
    To be honest, I don’t understand the animosity to RMAH. Nobody is forced to buy anything. Is it jealousy about someone else being able to get better gear without doing hours of playing? That would be like being jealous of someone who has a better life because they inherited a bunch of money. It just seems lame. To me, life is about learning to transcend our limitations.
    I have a lot of complaints about Diablo 3, but this is not one of them.

    • “To me, life is about learning to transcend our limitations.”

      well that’s kinda the whole point
      people with lots of money don’t have as many limitations as those who don’t have lots of money 

      if you really want people to transcend their limitations then you would be against them being able to buy things, you would want them to strive and work for it, to earn it

      you’re not hardcore if things are just handed to you or if you can just buy them without putting in the work 

      • Actually, their limitation might be time. The RMAH is a time-money exchange, not so much a gear-money exchange. People trade their money for some other guy’s time, the time it took to find the gear. Let’s be honest, most of the accomplishments (especially in terms of gear acquisition) in Diablo are straight up time sinks. Pure skill is not the determining factor for getting gear. Game time is. Since, in most of society, time is money, converting the two is a pretty simple hop in logic.
         
        As to the main point, the day they said no RMAH for hardcore, JSP got their second wind. The black market for HC will thrive, unless Blizzard cuts them out w/ the legit version. And yes, the HC market will be much more robust, b/c of the item sink of permanent death. And gambling a few hundred dollars on a character who might completely disappear at any moment? That’s gambling. That’s like, Vegas gambling. Problem gambling. Which is why they’re probably reluctant to put it in.

  23. I don’t understand the anger towards the RMAH.
    Its no different than GAH. You spend your time farming gold, to buy things off the GAH. Or you spend your time working at a job, to earn money to buy things of the RMAH. If you don’t like the RMAH you shouldn’t be ok with the GAH either.

    • Human perception is everything. It is quite interesting how the value of something can be dramatically different by separating it simply by verbiage. 

    • so u like going to work as much as playing D3? see a psychiatrist plz..

    • I didn’t know “working at a job to earn money” was part of the game.
      Or is it that you maybe are just dumb that you can’t see the difference between the two.

      • Then you probably shouldn’t buy the game either. Since working at a job isn’t part of the game. You shouldn’t use your money to buy that game either. That just… just… UNLOGICAL…
         
        PS its illogical, or maybe your just dumb that you can’t see the difference between the two.

        EDIT: So your ok with selling things in the HC RMAH, but your not ok with people buying them? I’m not even sure where to begin tearing that statement apart.

        • Your “logic” states that having sex with or without a prostitute are the same because indirectly money has been lost or not earned either way.
          But seriously, “buying the game” is a prerequisite for being able to play it, “buying an item” isn’t, but you’re too stupid to understand how that is a fundamental difference.
          PS. You think i accidentally mistyped my nick instead of it being a trap so i can identify the fools that comment on it? And obviously the irony of your nick being KaoticSoul is lost on you yes?
          And please, try to “tear that statement apart”, it amuses me to see someone with an inferior intellect fighting an already lost battle.

  24. RMAH for HC:

    Sell yes
    Buy no

  25. The first couple paragraphs of the OP made me feel like i’m in bizarroworld.  It seems quaint, outdated, outmoded.  It’s crazy how ppl can view things so differently, even within a small subculture like HC.
     
    I’m solely a HC player, and i want the RMAH.  Not because i want to buy – never have never will, don’t care if others do.  Not because i want to sell – i have no use for the third-world wages one might make.  I just want HC to be the same as SC.  No differences, like it used to be, like it should be.

    I’m annoyed by those that see HC as some haven of purity because of its new, additional difference with SC (RMAH). Stay out of my HC community heathens! Play HC because you enjoy the thrill, not because you want to avoid the RMAH.

    • There’s decidedly less thrill with the RMAH.  Hardcore is for gamers, not cheaters.  You’re a cheater if you use the RMAH.  Period. Keep that crap in carebear mode.

  26. I just realized I’m not against RMAH, even for HC. Thing is, if they won’t be doing character wipes every 6months or so there is no way economy won’t tank and windforces will be cheap as peanuts, sheer numbers will do the trick and power will be extremely cheap/common both in GAH and RMAH. Now if we only had GAH, blizz would just wipe and call it a day but with RMAH they will want us to buy more and more, thus more content (items, locations, bosses etc) and harder content 😀

    Same thing goes for HC, at some point it would be too easy but RMAH will actually make it harder for people like me who just won’t buy stuff from it (I agree that it will be easier for those that do but I couldn’t give a flying fuck about them doing so) 

    • World: Why don’t you have two SoJs, Enigma and an Infinity merc?

      Me: Becuase this character hasn’t found all those rare things.

      World: hahahahahaha nooob

      Me: :s 

    • Umm that wont happen unless Blizzard lets the same hack/cheats as D2 has, sure there be a fair few good stuff but demand should far outstrip supply for some time that without HC character wipes eating some of the items.

  27. I don’t get why people are bitcing so much. Since the ladder doesn’t exist, it’s up to everyone to choose if they want to buy a pass, or if they want to play it like it should be played. What do you care if Bob down the street uses money to buy his character good gear; it won’t affect you the least bit.

  28. I wonder how long time it will take (after release) until the first QQ-threads appear on the official forums about how they lost their 15$ hardcore character when their cat jumped on their keyboard…

    Srsly, this will only be a pain in blizzards @ss in the long run

  29. I say this over and over. I think I should be allowed a spot in the headlines to rant, too, if Nizaris is.

    The RMAH was created in response to d2jsp (“forum gold”) and third party sites like d2legit. It’s not that Blizzard wants a piece of the pie, it’s that they don’t want a third party to be providing a service critical to the game. Looting and trading is core to the Diablo series. Blizzard wants to be your trade facilitator, and they want to have control over your Diablo experience. And that’s fair, because it’s their game.

    The developers once said that revenue from the RMAH is a bonus and they’re not counting on it to do anything other than maintain the separate dev/maintenance budget for the RMAH. Hence, the flat fee. They should explain that again. This is not a greed thing. They saw people getting screwed by large-volume third parties and took steps to equalize the playing (trading) field.

    For example, d2legit is selling an Annihilus for $0.99. But there are two reasons why I can’t sell my Anni for $0.99: I can’t accept cash, and I can’t trade my Anni as easily as they can. If a high rune is 25 cents then d2legit is trading Annis for 4 HRs (ripoff) while I have to spam chat and beg to trade one for just 2 HRs. But with the RMAH, d2legit and I have equal trading power. If their Annis are worth $1 and selling quickly, then mine is/will be too.

    Back to hardcore. The RMAH wasn’t withheld to keep hardcore pure. Nor would it be enabled to make extra revenue. Blizzard is simply afraid of valued customers setting on their money on fire. This news tweet is a warning to the third parties who are gearing up for hardcode that if they dare to make trading in HC difficult again then Blizzard will respond by making it fair. Which means enabling the RMAH.

    • Bravo! Great post!

    • Can you point out to me where ranting occurred in the article?

      Blizzard is counting on fans to take your line as to what the RMAH means to them. Anyways, I don’t think I said anywhere that the devs said they wanted to keep hardcore pure. I quoted them directly from the interviews held with Jay and Rob Pardo – that they do, indeed want to “save people from themselves.”

      There is a clear disconnect between what the developer’s decisions are and what fans perceive of such decisions.  Developers say they want to save people from themselves, fans see them as “carebearing a community” or other such nonsense.  The contrast between the two is where dissonance occurs, and possibly alienation. Communities can either adapt to a new “definition” of hardcore, or quit.  

      The bottom line is that the revenue gained from an HC RMAH must be equal to or more than the costs to maintain it. I think the biggest thing I disagree with is how little emphasis you put on the necessity of the RMAH’s financial success.

  30. Can someone tell me whats to stop people from using D2jsp for HC trading, just like d2? The one with most \forum gold\ have nothing to loose, and can make a perfect character over and over again. I say bring on RMAH to try negate the effects from sites like d2jsp. 

    • Well if someone is willing to get worthless currency (FG) for items then nothing can stop them, but those people will be minority.

    • More importantly, FG cannot be exchanged for currency. Why would anybody have incentive to use FG when there is a GAH that would be more effective with a wider audience?

  31. No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  32. Here are my thoughts…. Regardless of weather or not Blizzard puts the RMAH in Hardcore, people who want to buy items will from other 3rd party websites. Even certain trade sites (D2jsp) allow you to buy fake money to purchase items from the other traders. Isn’t this basically buying the items anyway? I say, if they do or don’t i would not care. If they do, I will sell items on it and go on with some extra cash. If they don’t, I was not looking to buy anything with RM anyway. If I was Blizzard, I would want a RMAH just to take away from 3rd parties making money off of MY game. Those 3rd parties spent no time or money on Diablo 3, why should they get to profit from it?

  33. Reading this my initial thought was “no, please don’t ruin my beloved hardcore with an RMAH!”.  But really, anyone retarded enough to spend a lot of money on items will probably just die anyway, and lose them all, and I can sell them new ones 😀  Bring it on!

    Reminds of that ladder-topping level 93 necromancer in classic (93 was impressive in those days) called Squid_III or something – that character got sold for good money and the new owner promptly died 🙂

    • The game is not even out yet and it is THE talk in town for the next 3 years.

      Earning money by selling gear and items to other players.

      What a fantastic idea. I am going to spend my RMAH earned money on REAL life clothing, video games, wow subscriptions and booze. Hardcore modes will increase demand !

      Impossible ? I bet you I have my first 200 Euros after one month already.

      Mmorp gaming/dungeon crawling will never be the same again after Diablo 3 will hit the market.

      Expect it to be introduced in Wow by 2013 too. No one will want another system anymore.

      I LOVE the real money thing. It is exciting. 🙂

  34. In the end, whats the difference from a RMAH and gold AH?  When you compare both playing HC, its the same, is it not?  I mean, you’ll still have money (gold or cash) and can buy the stuff to get back where you where.  IMO, they should either take out both auctions OR might as well leave both in.

  35. “If there is demand for it…” So if you think its a really bad idea it might be worth it to tweet and say you feel passionately about not having it, no?

  36. This is terrible idea. No point for competing in hard mode, if rmah will be on hardmode then value of those players are not true. I repeat myself again, terrible if that happens. 

    • Why don’t you people get it? THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE GAH AND THE RMAH. Without a RMAH people will just spend piles of gold to regear a new character. Its no different. Gold, cash, both take time to earn. They just come from different mediums. I think people are mad because they make a shitty hourly wage and can’t afford the items themselves.  
       
      HAH captcha: Face the music

  37. If I was really selfish at this point I would support RMAH in HC, the more pro-RMAH people playing D3 the better since they won’t be playing what I’m playing. People who spend money to gain advantages in games ruin my fun so I’d prefer them playing other games then me. 
     
    I’ve reached the point where I’ve definitely decided not to play D3 no matter what happens between now and release.

    • Why are you posting an a d3 site we get it you’re not happy about how it’s turning out move on my friend you’ll find something more to your taste but apparently not here

  38. after reading everyones comments …

    Here are the things we know:

    – We know for a fact that other sites will set up or be set up to sell items to HC characters … unless blizz does the RMAH for HC.
    – Now people wont use the offline sites as much as they would blizz’s.  

    So there are options:

    blizz either sets up a HC RMAH or it doesnt …

    if you guys dont think people will use other sites to buy things you are delusional – one of my first ever ebay trades was selling a HC item.  And this was soon after D2 came out. 

    anyways … I like the option.  whatever if people want to buy my items to make their character stronger; whatever … I can still plan for the enjoyment and make a profit while I do it and have a safe environment for doing it in.        

        

            

  39. When we create a new game, It could have an option to allow or not people with weapons from RMAH.

  40. Here’s an idea they can charge a monthly fee for hardcore and not have to worry about making any money in rmah as we all knw it’s a business and money is the driving factor so if they put it in good for them and to those who oppose don’t play ppl who have to buy gear I suppose  

  41. There already exists a way to pay for gear with real money in spambot websites and this didn’t ruin d2’s hc community. Now there’s the possiblity for an official one and people complain lol. There’s always gonna be extra money flowing in these games to give other people an unfair advantage,but then it’s not really unfair since it’s thier money. Needless to say, hc may not be the most attractive place to spend money, whether it be the death thing or the principles of “hardcore”,but this rmah thing just means the real hardcore players will have to be twice as adamant to keep the game hardcore for themselves is all.

  42. I don’t want it, but it is impossible to prevent in one form or another.

    • It’s impossible to prevent botting in one form or another, does that mean they should just bring it into the fold as well?

  43. Well personally I don’t know why people think an RMAH devalues the hardcore experience. If anything, I’d think it would make it even more hardcore knowing that your hard-earned money is on the line if you ever spend it on a character. I know I’d be a thousand times more careful if I had spent $100 buying items for my character.
     
    And if it turns out that 3rd party sites exist for HC, then the hardcore experience is “devalued” whether an RMAH exists or not. I never really understood why people are fine with RMT being in the game as long as it’s unsupported by the developers. It’s not like most players give a shit whether Blizzard allows something or not; if they can buy items they will.

  44. @ Titikaka
    “I’ve reached the point where I’ve definitely decided not to play D3 no matter what happens between now and release.”
    So you’ll play after release?

  45. No RMAH in hardcore.  It’s the last bastion of uncorrupted gaming in D3.

    And stop saying “well people are just going to use 3rd party sites to get their hardcore items”. Good, let them. Hardcore isn’t supposed to be a safe environment, so let them deal with the shady D3 item sellers.

    I’m sick of this slippery slope mentality. You may as well just say: “People are going to bot anyway, maybe Blizzard should just make an official bot for people to use too!”

    I can’t stand you RMAH-using cheaters. I wish there were a way to block RMAH users from games.

    • “I wish there were a way to block RMAH users from games.”

      There is. Create a private game. 

      Out of curiosity, is it “cheating” if I find a good item and give it to a friend?
      What if the same thing happens, and he buys me a beer afterwards?
      What if I find a good item and give it to a stranger?
      Now what if I gave the good item to a stranger, and they were so impressed that they decided to ask me for my info so they could paypal me enough money to buy myself a beer?

      Why is any of the above cheating? 

      • I think the perception of cheating comes from the idea that people are relying on an external source for internal gain. What I’ve observed from purest HC players is that they believe the most “worthy” players are those who gain all items via internal means – trading or finding it themselves.

  46. Let’s say they did away with all the auction houses, the GAH and RMAH.  I would still trade items with my friends for 7-Eleven snacks or scratch-its, or trade a SOJ to my wife to get a back rub.  People are going to be doing these kinds of trades anyway, why wouldn’t you want to make a profit also?

    • Dude, do you fail at reading or something? It isn’t about trading or the GAH, it is about being able to buy out the game and win through means that don’t even involve playing the game. If you’re ok with that then why not also allow botting and maphacks and pickit, ofcourse “legally” bought directly from Mr. Bobbies store.
      Then again there shouldn’t be a artificial divide between HC and SC like that either, now people have to decide between playing HC (which only appeals to the smaller hardcore community) or having to wade through the cesspool of SC where there’s a complete lack of gaming fairness? Why not let the player decide in what for AH realm (GAH or RMAH) and game mode (HC or SC) they want to play. Then all the hypocritic carebear cheaters like you don’t have to deal with all those true gaming infidels that want to play fairly. Controversial huh?

  47. And if blizzard doesn’t do it…d2jsp will.

    Enjoy your fantasy world of thinking item trading for money won’t exist as long as blizzard doesn’t include a HC RMAH..

    • Why would I waste my time on JSP when there is a perfectly good Gold Auction House? JSP only flourished because the economy of Diablo 2 was dysfunctional. Now that Blizzard is trying to make gold a valuable commodity, I see no reason to go back to 3rd party forum gold.

  48. Never really like HC in d2, my connection is to unstable and i would die because of a disconnected quiet often…
     
    my connection ahs gotten a little better over the years but still not perfect and the ONLY reason i am considering HC is because it has no rmah … so if they add it no d3 for me 🙁

  49. I bet Blizzard can’t wait to see this headline if RMAH was ever added to hardcore:
     
    Man hangs himself after losing virtual character worth thousands of dollars

  50. I demand a hardcore RMAH.  End of discussion.

  51. Keep that RMAH PIECE OF SHIT out of HARDCORE !!!!

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