Fan Theorycrafting: Targeted Legendary Item Finding in Diablo 3?

Fan Theorycrafting: Targeted Legendary Item Finding in Diablo 3?

Mwille shared an interesting sort of theorycrafting in our Diablo 3 community forum. What if you could specify which legendaries you most wanted to find, and then take specific actions in-game to boost your odds of scoring them? His idea works a bit like a Bounty system focused on item finding, where Kadala would let you create a wishlist of your most wanted items, and then give you hints when some monster in your game had an elevated chance to drop one of them.

A quote from the start of his article:

0KyzJhaMy suggestion is to add a tab to Kadala’s interface (Interface Mock Up to the right) that lets us choose what item(s) we are looking for and then pay her to tell us where to look, such as, “I’ve heard rumors that you might find what you’re looking for in (the Desolate Sands).” The things in ( ) could range from areas as large as acts, the next rift you open, specific areas & associated dungeons, etc., and would have a special marker on the world map.

The point to this would be that in that designated area (for that game only) the drop “weights” for the items in your Wish List would be increased by X%. Even if it were +100%, double of next-to-nothing odds is still next-to-nothing. But, at least we would know our chances have improved for what we actually want to find. And dealing with Kadala is always a gamble anyway. As an alternative to attaching the bonus to specific areas, it could be as simple as being on a timer (like shrine effects).

He wants to combine this with a renewed, much-improved sort of Magic Find. The new MF would come in different flavors, each boosting your odds to find legendary items of a certain type, and it would only appear on legendary items without a legendary affix. (Two birds with one stone there, since everyone is kind of annoyed by legendary items without a special property.) Here’s more from his piece:

Magic Find

The problem I saw with the old magic find property was that it was too available and one-dimensional. You could get it on basically any item without sacrificing that much really. And all it did was increase your chance for better quality items without any control over WHAT might drop. So, my idea for revamping magic find is twofold.

First, make it only available as a primary property on Legendaries that DON’T have a special property (including a normal mod with a higher than average value, such as knockback on Windforce). This would both limit availability and cause us to have to actually make a decision by giving up a special property for magic find.

Second, split magic find into 5 different properties to give it some depth & choices as to what we want to target. Items would be allowed to have only one random property from the list below.

  • Boost the overall Leg/Set drop weights. Ex. +X% to find Legendary items, +X% to find Set items.
  • Boost the weight of a specific item type (or slot). Ex. +X% to find boots.
  • Boost the weight of an entire specific set. Ex. +X% to find items from the Marauder’s Set.
  • Boost the weight of class specific items. Ex. +X% to find Wizard-Only items.
  • Boost the chance for smart drops. Ex. +X% to find items suited for your current class.
  • Finally, make gambling from Kadala ignore all magic find properties so that we don’t end up having a set of gambling items to switch out for just that purpose. As an alternative to adding both of the systems I outlined here, they could be combined into one if necessary. Either give the options from the Magic Find section to Kadala (for a price & limited time like a shrine effect), or add a 6th magic find property which has +X% to find individual items.

    The article closes with pros and cons and asks for feedback to refine the ideas, so hit up Mwille’s forum thread for the full details and share your thoughts.

    We can debate the details, but I like a lot of the ideas in Mwille’s post. I’ve always thought a more specific sort of magic find or item runs would be a cool feature. Boss runs were fun in Diablo 2, but too general where a few monsters were the best source for virtually everything. Diablo 3 goes to the opposite extreme where no monster is the best source for anything, and you’re as (or more) likely to find a great legendary from a chest or barrel along the side of the path, or a random trash mob, as you are from a bounty or an Act Boss or a Treasure Goblin.

    Diablo 3 did bring back one sort of run, with the DiabloWikilegendary materials. Those need to be farmed via runs, but they’re perhaps too specific since there’s no reason to ever hunt any of them unless you’ve got a specific legendary crafting plan that requires that one material.

    I’ve long thought some more specific item hunting would be fun, but I just figured it would be another type of run, where (for hypothetical instance), Siegebreaker would have 50% better odds to drop shoulders, Maghda had 50% better odds to drop gloves, Diablo had 50% better chance to drop mighty weapons, etc.

    I like Mwille’s idea better, as it adds customization in terms of what you want to find, and brings in the semi-random nature of bounties, and brings back an improved version of magic find. I can see “too complicated” complaints, and maybe the whole thing is too much of a better mousetrap, but I like all or most of the individual components of his idea(s).

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    22 thoughts on “Fan Theorycrafting: Targeted Legendary Item Finding in Diablo 3?

    1. Go work for dev team please 😉 Great idea. Needs some tweaking on the i’s since getting 6 extra kinds of stats to roll for with enchanting wont make no one happy.
      But overall great idea’s and these things will just add a ton of more dimensions into the item hunt!

      • Great idea but it actually requires blizzard to do some coding. Something they are very bad or lazy at.

    2. I like the sound of a feature like this. It would certainly flavour the item hunt, even if it’s not guaranteed that you’ll end up finding those you’re looking for, it gives the incentive to do so nevertheless. Althoguh the concept would be better associated with the Mystic, since she’s the one with supernatural abilities to foretell the future and see what others cannot. This would also mean you can’t only spend your shards at Kadala. I would really like to see some other uses of those orange chrystals.

    3. Where I think an idea like this could shine is farming cross-class. So for instance, lets say that I main a wizard, but I really want to find a blade of prophecy for my crusader. I don’t really enjoy playing the crusader because he lacks a lot of items and can only farm lower torments whereas all the farming I’ve done on my wiz has put him in a great and fun place and lets him farm higher torments. The smart drops currently implemented are great, but it does mean you can only really farm for the hero you are playing. If I was able to target a specific item for another class while playing my favoured character at that particular point that would be great :).

    4. Looking at D3 – in particular –, I think a ‘reward wishlist’ feature is probably the antithesis of everything each and every single designer working at Blizzard has ever believed in.

      And even if a game with well below 30 hours of first-time-playthrough content, like D3, shouldn’t require 30000 hours of playtime for a perfect set of end-game rewards, like D3, those designers have a point with that …

    5. I have proposed some comparable sort of stuff: spending soul or death breath to certain item types or item directly to improve the odds to find it, the counter is reset when you find it.

      I also think that random dungeons, which are of no use in 2.0, could be “labeled” by a leg type and if you find a legendary in this dungeon, it is of this type (or has high probability to be of this type).

    6. I think this is too complicated. Also, I don’t like the idea of removing too much of the randomness in the game. Part of the fun is to find an item you didn’t actually look for, and then go “hmmm, maybe I can make this work instead.”

    7. Wait… am I reading this correctly, that (currently) Kadala’s drops ARE influenced by Magic Find??? I will be keeping my Nagelring in my inventory at all times for post-rift gambling if this is the case.

    8. At this rate everybody will have most of the gear they want on a shorter amount of time anyway, so…I don’t know.

      Kadala’s rumors for finding specific items could be interesting.
      But, I don’t see much use in dividing MF idea.

      • Targeted/improved MF was a topic way back in D2. MF that only worked for weapons or armor, MF that worked for runes or jewels or charms, etc. Never happened, and many fans hated the idea, but I always liked the theory of being able to control my play experience/rewards a bit.

        The key would be the balance, where such bonuses wouldn’t become mandatory via their effectiveness. Diablo’s core item game has always relied heavily on randomization, so you don’t want to lose that.

    9. I like the idea of paying blood shards for a weighted chance of finding a particular type of legendary, but it should not be too specific. Something like “I heard you were looking for set gloves, you might find them here” instead of “I heard you were looking for Immortal King’s Forge.”

      If it were too specific, the shard cost would have to be HUGE. Finding that last piece of the puzzle for an endgame set is supposed to be a big, big deal; especially now with the prevalence of RRoG, what was once an insanely difficult set to find makes it completing it a trivial act. Combine that with smart loot, where a Crusader would only be finding general sets or Akkhan with the 15% off-chance for other class sets, and it makes for child’s play when it comes to finding sets. I mean, I found Akkhan boots, gambled the pants 15 minutes later, found the boots again a day later, and then the helm the day after that. Blessed RNG, for sure, but now with RRoG I’m one piece away from endgame set completion… yawn. Having a big flashing sign on the minimap essentially saying “COMPLETE YOUR SET HERE!” feels tacky.

      As far as MF goes… its fine where it is. I’m glad it doesn’t appear as a stat on all but very few items; MFing for the sake of MFing was one of the worst things in D2, and was why botting was so prevalent. Giving up DPS/toughness for MF should come at a massive cost, in my opinion. Giving up SoJ/RRoG/trifecta/whatever for Nagelring SHOULD have serious drawbacks. Working in Cain’s set SHOULD have serious drawbacks. Putting in MF rolls insta-gg legendary items – that already have boosted stat ceilings compared to rares, even if there’s no special effect – is a brutal idea. There’s also simply not enough leg or set variety in the game to justify “X% chance to find X type of item” modifiers.

      I think getting a general idea of where to farm a certain item type from Kadala is good enough. No need to turn this into PindleCraft 3.

    10. More Simple (from Kadala):

      50 Bloodshards to choose what kind will be your next legendary (Daibo,Amulet,etc…)
      50 Bloodshards to increase your magic find in 300% ( last 1 item )
      50 Bloodshards to increase your magic find in 50% ( last 1 hour )
      75 Bloodshards to increase your chance to find Sets instead of legendaries
      100 Bloodshards to give a chance of dropping Forgotten Souls

    11. I kind of like both ideas, but I think that they’re not really that necessary now that the legendary drop rate has been doubled again. Given the style of game Diablo is, there has to be some kind of randomness in drops, and I feel like improving your chances of dropping certain items would hurt that. Likewise, I’m not really a fan of the magic find idea, though that has less to do with randomness and more to do with simply not liking the implementation.

      I think that both ideas are good, but that they should work differently. For ‘targeted’ legendary/set drops, I think that certain enemies/bosses should be weighted towards specific drops, similar to how certain uniques/bosses can drop legendary crafting materials. For example, Fallen angel enemies, and Izual specifically, could have a higher chance of dropping the sword that summons an angel. Likewise, any of the arch-demons (Belial, Ghom, Cydaea, Azmodan, Rakanoth and Diablo) could have a higher chance of dropping Maximus, and Diablo specifically could have a higher chance of dropping Shard of Hate. This would provide a bit of extra lore (certain types of enemies dropping weapons that it would make sense for them to have), and also give you a reason to farm certain areas or bosses if you wanted a certain drop.

      As for the Magic Find idea, it’s not bad, but it’s tarred by the same brush that tarred the original MF. If the bonus is not large enough, then using those items would not be any real use, and the items without special properties would still be just as worthless. However, if the bonus is too large (which I fear would most likely be the case), then legendaries without special affixes will completely supplant legendaries with affixes, because people will want to get more drops. I am worried that it would be too hard to balance the MF, because currently it is fairly easy to gear a character to be able to farm Torment I even with mediocre items, and nearly every slot has at least one legendary with no special affixes, meaning that it would be fairly easy to amass multiple pieces and stack up a very large boost to legendary drop rates. Obviously, there are five flavors of MF being proposed here, but all that means is that you have to roll the MF property you want onto your items to get the full bonus. Mwille’s post said that his problem with the old MF was that it was too available, too one-dimensional, and not enough of a sacrifice compared to the massive benefits for using it. I feel that Mwille’s new MF idea makes MF much more three-dimensional, but that it is still to available, and that it is, perhaps, even less of a sacrifice now than it was then.

      Truthfully, I don’t think there’s really any good way of balancing MF, and I think that the affix is just bad overall. There’s really no happy medium: if MF provides a small-to-medium bonus to your drop rate, then nobody will use it because they will just focus on killing speed. If MF provides a large bonus, then everyone will use it, and it will become an essential stat, exactly the way it was before. Finally, MF simply isn’t a fun affix. It doesn’t help you build your character, it provides no tangible benefits or downsides; it is all simply potential. Because of this, it’s useful, but at the same time, you can’t build around it, or use it to do anything that your character couldn’t have done without it. It just makes drops happen more often. It’s always supposed to be a sacrifice, but it always just ends up being a mandatory stat that every character needs in order to be worth playing.

    12. I just see incgamers posting about legendary items daily, as like someone cares about this game and in particular, about legendary items. Just admit the simple fact the game (and itemization) is boring and uplayable for more than a week afyer you get 70, lol. How can you, guys, be so hypocrite?

    13. Thanks Flux for putting my idea in the spotlight. As others have said, it may be too complicated, etc. However, I still think the basic idea of being able to somehow target items would give us hope. It’s kind of like praying to the RNG gods. It’s still not a sure thing, but at least we would feel like we had a better chance.

      I know we can already kind of target items by gambling for a selected slot, so here’s another thought. Maybe just add something along these lines to campaign mode ONLY, to give us another option of play style. As another poster mentioned, move the Wish List system to the Mystic instead. Just incorporate some combination of targeting ideas, and do away with having magic find on items. Instead of being told where to look, Myriam could enchant US instead of items. Of course it would be for a price of some kind , and for a specified time frame.

    14. I know you need daily articles and all, but really…. Worst idea ever.

      If your chances of finding something super rare are still… super rare then everyone would just feel cheated. Kadala already allows you to focus on a specific set of legendaries.

      Look, finding items is fun and all, but you have to enjoy the process. This is an action RPG about fighting monster, not item farmville. If you are not having fun playing the game and just want to get the “best items” its time to uninstall -no joke.

    15. I would like it if : you could amass a certain amount of souls and trade them at Kadala for an item fron a wish list, or one your trying to find

    16. My idea is as much in the blizzard way as can be.Random. I think we ought to be able to trade items for an increase in a chance of that item dropping when you gamble with Kadella. Example>> if you want a higher chance of wands to drop when you gamble for a 1 hand weapon you should turn in any and all wands you find or make for an increased chance of wands dropping when you gamble for 1 handers. Item sink and gold sink and shard sink, right up Blizzards alley.

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