Don't Freak Out! Simplified Diablo 3 Tooltips on the Way - Diabloii.Net

Don’t Freak Out! Simplified Diablo 3 Tooltips on the Way


Blizzard has posted new information regarding where they are wanting to go with tooltip information in-game.  Many of you are not going to like this, and I am not sure how well this is going to go down with the community as it’s a feature that many of you enjoy having in-game.

The plan is to really simplify the in-game tooltips so that less information is available to players quickly and those of you who really like drilling down into skill stats quickly are not going to like what Blizzard has planned. While PC and hardcore players enjoy such features, could Blizzard be making this decision now based on what would actually work in a console version of the game? Who knows what the reason is for the decision, because the explanation doesn’t really make much sense. Blizzard know this is going to be an unpopular decision so why do it?

Surely the best and simplest solution is let players decide if they want info-packed tooltips by making it an actual in-game option to turn them on or off? This is a pretty lengthy update so read on for the full details.

 

In an upcoming beta update you’re likely to see that we’ve been working to simplify skill tooltips. This has been in the planning for a long time and we’re finally making passes at all skills. We’re doing this now, for one thing, to try to be more consistent with how we’re presenting skill tooltips and their effects, but also to make them easier to understand.

We know that this is going to cause many of you, our hardcore gamer and statistics analysts, to freak out. Please take a few moments to freak out…

Ok, now that it’s out of your system, let’s go into the what we’re planning to do for you, and also potential features for the future.


We need to make sure that the game at its most basic level is easy to understand, quick to pick up and play, and has a strong immediate focus on the gameplay, and not mathy number-crunching and novella-sized skill descriptions. These are the pillars that we believe a game like Diablo firmly rests for the vast majority of players. It is first and foremost an Action RPG, and we put a lot of weight into the first word. For you, the people here every day or week picking apart skill math and statistics, we realize you crave something deeper, and we’re absolutely intent on providing you all of the information you’d ever need.

Take a look at the skill information on the Diablo II Arreat Summit for barbarian combat skills: http://classic.battle.net/diablo2exp/skills/barbarian-combatskills.shtml We think that is a great amount of insight into the mechanics of the skills, and it’s a great example of what we want to make available for you here on the Diablo III website. We all have to agree though that it’s a ridiculous amount of information to try to display in-game, especially through a tooltip. Let’s be clear though that our intent isn’t to force anyone to alt-tab to get game information. The tooltip information we’ll be providing, as well as very basic concepts of players getting and equipping more powerful items, will be plenty to get all players through the game, at least on Normal.

Some of you have been discussing tooltip complexity and more than a few times the World of Warcraft solution of having two different sets of tooltips (simplified and normal) has of course not escaped us. It’s a solution we’d like to explore, but if we did it’s extremely likely that our “normal” tooltips would be the toned-down versions we’re working toward now, and the “simplified” would be even more basic, giving game intent advice in place of any numbers. It’s something we’d like to explore but it’s still something we’ve yet to design, and could very well be something we don’t end up getting into the game.

In closing we wanted to give everyone a heads up because we know there are going to be some conclusions about our intents, and we wanted to share some ideas of having something similar to what Diablo II players could find on the Arreat Summit back in the day.

Presumably they do not mean the newly-added, noob-friendly tooltips for all the most basic actions in the game. You can see screens of a bunch of those in our gallery.

They are instead talking about the skill tooltips, which seem pretty damn simplified already.

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  1. mmmmm, not sure i like or not like the idea. With skill points now out of the game, is it still nessesary to know the full description and number-crunch of each skill? Is not like when in D2 we need to know the numbers since we wanna know what each skill point would do to the skill. Comparing one skill to another is as simple as swapping them on and off in town now, and alot of times numbers dont do a skill justice anyways. It is about how the skill suits ur feel and flow of gameplay, at least for me anyways. I cant really say i am a hardcore gamer, but for me this is another change that wouldnt greatly affect my experience of playing the game, i imagine.

  2. I’ll save my freakout until I see what these new tooltips look like, but I’m not sure they get much simpler than they are right now. Every tooltip in the beta is essentially: “blah blah blah <green percentage > blah blah”. I think they should get rid of a few of the blahs and add more green. If that’s what they mean by simpler, I’m all for it.

  3. If it isn’t clear by now, Blizzard’s target demographic is not those of us who waited ten+ years for a sequel to Diablo 2.  If you can swallow that pill — which personally I’m finding *really* hard to do — then it’ll probably be a really enjoyable final product.  If you can’t do that … well, I don’t blame you.  I think Blizzard is making some decisions that are definitely at the expense of their most loyal fans, and that’s really hard to support.

    EDIT: Would love to hear Flux’s rage on the tooltips thing.

    • I sort of feel the same way. At first I thought a lot of the changes made to the game basics were for good, ultimately striving to make Diablo 3 feel fresh and up to date. Now I don’t what I feel anymore. Just a few months ago I was eagerly expecting D3, not paying much attention to other games. Since then though, I’ve felt my interest towards D3 dwindle somewhat. Sure, I’ll still get it at launch and play it, but I no longer feel that excited about it and mostly it’s because of the fact that Blizzard seems intent on creating a much too casual game (IMO).

      I am by no means a hardcore player these days, but that doesn’t mean I don’t want a challenge and the fact that Blizzard basically says “Well, Inferno will be hard” is a bit disheartening. Ok, so the endgame will be hard, but what about getting there? Should that only consist of endlessly pressing the insta-win button? Because if it does, I’ll likely never get to the endgame because I’ll be bored and go play something else. Something which is challenging all the way through.

    • @Kaeros: quite true about the target demographics. i’ve been playing fighting games since the arcade era and i’ve seen the noobification of a genre over the past 3 years up close. if the results of D3 turn out to be the same. well, you won’t get a bad game, but you won’t get a great one either. it will be a bland, mediocre game and non-noobs will hope the expansion improves the game significantly.

    • I’m glad that Blizzard is making a game based on common sense and good game design, instead of trying to appease a bunch of ancient diehards who would rather see Diablo 2.5 than Diablo 3.

      • Good game design would be allowing a simple mode, and leaving advanced mode in the game.  Maybe that’s how it will end up, who knows?

        Honestly though, how much are the tool tips really used by people who don’t number crunch?  I just see this as more development time for an unnecessary ‘feature.’  This simple tool tip design doesn’t really have a purpose, the people its designed for just click on a new skill and mash it.  This removes the worth of that super simple tool tip.  

        The game can still be designed to appeal to ‘ancient die hards’ while still being able to pick up and learn.  The same process doesn’t work the other way around,  if you design the game for a 10 year old, an ‘ancient die hard’ will play it through once and quit.

        Go take a look at beta videos, the game is not hard to pick up and learn.  Blizzard is spending more development time on something nobody needs.

        I wonder if that means they are just postponing release of the game for business reasons?

        20-30 year olds are not ancient die hards BTW.  Games can be designed for people older than 10 years old, the market is larger than that.

      • Flibbertygibbet I don´t even think you know what common sense is. You always talk nonsense.

    • I think I’ll wait to play the game and see how much fun I have before I make any definite conclusions.
      😉

    • Relax sparky. 

      The hardest difficulties, the strongest skill gems, the best loot, that’s all still there for hardcore players.

      They could make normal diff a complete joke/tutorial for all I care, because I will be spending no time there, just like I will be spending almost no time looking at tooltips.  I can’t believe people would even begin to freak out about tooltips.  It’s not like they are simplifying the game, they are just placing more of it “under the hood”, which is totally fine because we as hardcore players will figure it out anyway.

  4. Typical Diablo 3 news in that it contains the following 3 items:
    1. they are making the game more noob-friendly.
    2. they are removing stuff which they previously spent a lot of time designing and implementing.
    3. they are still undecided and exploring different solutions.

    • no joke!! make something new and innovative – wait two months – change it up – wait two months – “refine” it again – wait two months – completely remove the added content

    • Ileration. Blizzard has always worked this way. The difference? Today, they communicate their ideas while in previous years, they kept such stuff under their belt until they confronted the players with the facts. Does it have an influence on the release date? No.

      •  
        Actually i clearly remember WC3 having the same iteration process and them being just as opened about it… the Burning legion was a playable faction at one point.
         
        And seeing how there are SC1 on what looked like the WC2 engine that are supposed to have been posted in 97 i’d say that they communicated with the fans.
         
        What’s really changed is that more people have access to the internet then before… which is why we have people still acting surprised when Blizzard delays a game even though Operation CWAL was something that came up in 97 (for those of you who dont know, CWAL means Cant Wait Any Longer).

        • I’ve been joking with people lately that Blizzard’s real motto is, “Iteration means never having to do anything right the first time.”

          Actually that’s more like the first 10 times, but it’s not so pithy a remark, with that added baggage.

          Any project you work on long enough will evolve and modify over time, for better or worse. Just because ideas are new or different doesn’t mean they’re necessarily improvements.  We’ve all had term papers or work projects to do with a terrifying deadline, and lots of us do our best work then, with the pressure forcing rapid and decisive decisions.  Often such projects, if you can bring yourself to read them again some time later, bear a few obvious problems you think could have been improved upon… but the phrase “good enough” is essential to keep in mind during all creative endeavors.

          That the possess seemingly endless time and budget for D3 is a luxury, but there are clearly diminishing returns to forever noodling with something, rather than slapping a finished sticker on it and moving on.

      • “Always worked this way”
         
        Gimme a break.  No one that worked on the original Diablo is there.
         
        There is nothing about the current post-WoW post-Kotick model of Blizz that has anything to do with their older legacy.  Nothing.

        • Well the original Diablo was actually made by a company called Condor… that got bought by Blizzard and renamed Blizzard North…
           
          But the main Blizz has been all about delays at least since the SC1 days…
           

          • I take it you would have preferred playing the initial version of starcraft? You know the one that looked like WC2 threw up something purple.
             
            They make fewer games than other companies with that style, but theirs last longer because they are more polished, with better systems and proper QA. I know which one I prefer.

  5. Well put.  To elaborate further, Blizzard is targeting a wider demographic than the hardcore gaming population (who will only make up a small portion of Blizzard’s sales on the game likely).  Blizzard’s #1 priority is to make a profit for their shareholders and they do that by making games more accessible to the average gamer.  But that doesnt mean you cant be mad about it :-).

    • i cant really blame blizzard to aim at not just the hardcore followers. making a game for years jus for a group of fans is not exactly profitable. Is just that who is to say pleasing the hardcore fan means the general gamers cant accept and come to like it? Sure it might be hard to pick up, but i still think harder to pick up doesnt mean not being picked up. Is not like parents would go shopping in a game shop, ask for games that is easier to play and buy it for their children…….. “oh which game would u recommend that my 12 yr old can handle easily?” “here try D3, is quite popular for easy to pick up!”

      • I don’t even know why they’d need to appeal to diehard fans. I mean, aren’t they going to buy the game anyway? They should make the game MORE convoluted so that they can get people who are already going to buy the game want to buy the game more? What? If they make it so complex, will the diehards buy two copies?

        • You know what, this kind of post by TheDestructor really pisses me off. What happened to artistic integrity? They don’t even have to anymore because people like this guy will gladly cup the balls of Blizzard and take their collective load right to the face. Fucking pathetic.

  6. Not that big of a deal, imo. It’s not like they’re hiding info from us. The in-depth details will still be accessible on the website.

    Rushter’s comments made it seem a lot worse than it actually is   😆

    • This completely. I mean, diehards will head to the internet for their information anyway. Nothing will change. Even if there were complex tool tips, the diehards would be on the forums theory-crafting with their even more advanced equations.

  7. I’d be fine with it if they were making the advanced tooltips that give all the information but since they’re planning these new simplified tooltips to be the most advanced ones they’ll ever give, I’m kind of pissed… They are totally backtracking on all of that stuff they used to say about minimizing how much players need to tab out to a web site to find out all the specifics of mechanics and features of the game… I’d really rather not have to keep a Diablo 3 wiki or the official game guide open in the background all the time so I can remind myself what a skill really does… I should be able to access that info in the game whenever I need it…

    • im gonna use my notebook beside my PC, so i dun need to tab out……… i think is a good way anyways.

    • Why are Blizzard trying more and more to f my game :(?

      • well, seeing as how you’ve stated that this is YOUR game, you oughta go tell Blizzard to stop effing it up since it belongs to YOU and any effing of the game and they will have to answer to YOU because this is YOUR game.

        christallmighty i am getting sick and tired of all these dumb fcuks illusions of entitlement..

        • Vagrant Story, fuck yeah! Also, completely agree with your sentiments.

        • It’s actually a truism of game design, or the creation of any product that’s for public consumption, that the designers cease ownership once it goes public. Numerous games and interactive products, MMOs especially, have been ruined by devs who couldn’t let go and who insisted on attempting to make players play the game the way they intended it to be played, during development.  In those cases, players are entirely justified in saying, “You are ruining our game.”

          It’s fairly obvious if you analogize it to something like food. If you order a meal in a restaurant and you want a baked potato, and the chef serves you Brussels sprouts since he feels they are a better match for the rest of the food, you’re not going to be real pleased, or won over by his logic. You’re just going to want your damn tater.

          D3 isn’t a dinner entree, and it’s not public yet so fans can’t quite take ownership yet, but I don’t think it’s amiss for fans to think of the game as “ours,” to some extent.

          • To extend your metaphor further, Diablo 1 and 2 were the starter and main course, Diablo 3 is the desert.

            We were promised a 3 course banquet with each course built around a specific theme. We liked the first two courses a lot and now we’ve been waiting in anticipation for the desert, which should be the crowning glory. We’ve been catching glimpses of the chef and overhearing his coversation as he goes about work in his kitchen. At first, the desert seemed like it was going to be excellent. But now time is  dragging on, and the glimpses we get of the desert make us think it’s not really what we were expecting as the cap stone to our 3 course banquet.

            I guess we haven’t paid for desert yet, though. We could always leave the restaurant early, although with a bitter taste in our mouths for having wasted so much time for something that never arrived.

          • MAH ICE CREAM HAS MELTED!

    • Scorch Hellfire has hit this on the head.  They are backtracking on their previous statements.

      Additionally they are spending development time re-doing the tool tips that are essentially just re stating the skill name.   Frost nova….hmmmm, id bet that there may be a Nova… of Frostyness.  Nobody needs a tool tip to figure that out.  People need the tool tip to figure out the more complex aspects of the skill, like DPS, Duration, Numbers and things like that.  

      Also, the people that these tool tips are written for will probably not ever use them.  A 10 year old clicks on the new skill and starts mashing it as soon as they get it.  Now they know what the skill does.  Tool tip is now useless.

  8. I dont care, honestly. Who wants to know how skills work, will find this info anyways.

  9. Not a big deal to me.  Most of us who like to dig into this stuff will end up looking at web sites about it anyway.  Hopefully Blizz can find a happy medium between a wall of text and “Bash – Bashes Stuff (Hard!)”
     
    A bigger priority for me is to have detailed stats on the character screen.  Especially things that are tedious to calculate or are based on hidden game mechanics.  For example, it would be great to know how many attacks per second a weapon can do compared to another, and how fast both weapons are swinging if dual wielding.  Or how much damage skill X will do using weapon Y + all other buffs (charms, afixes on gear, etc.)

    • Sir Matas hit it right on the head.  Although a full spread sheet OnMouseOver would be nifty, its the character screen info/stats that you will need on the fly like when you hit a level or pick up the windforce.  Within a month, we will all have memorized most of the stats/skills and favorable ones will float to the top so any data sifting to “challenge” conventional char builds will be done out of game when we’re taking a breather or maybe at work 😐

      Having said that, i have a question. Are there any D1/D2 players who were in their teens or earlier at the time of release? Im pretty old so i was already in my 20s when D1 came out.  If so, did you find it hard?  Were you a stat geek?  Was it too much?

      I share the sentiment of concern about the dumbing down of not just d3 but fricking everything (and trust me, im not sheldon cooper).  i work with kids ITRW and man WTF happened?!?!  Getting back to D3, I would hate to see it become a twitch game (although I realize that there is that element in it inherently).  I felt strategy and build was a great deal of the game in D2 and welcome that in D3.

      • I was 15 when D2 was released. By that time I had played D1 to death (got it at release I think) and no, I didn’t feel D2 was hard. In some ways I actually think D1 was harder, but that may just be my memory playing a trick on me.

        I wasn’t a stat geek, but as I remember, after a few failed builds you learned what worked and what didn’t.

        • I definitely thought D1 was harder, although I also was obviously new to the Diablo world for D1.
           
          In D1 there were fewer monsters but they could mess you up.  I played an archer and sorcerer and did a lot of careful sneaking around and kiting.  There weren’t as many packs of 15+ monsters, but each monster packed a punch.  I preferred that to D2 where I normally felt like I was mowing down an endless sea of grass.

        • I was 14 when D2 was released (but prolly got D1 a year or two after release, as opposed to you), but had the exact opposite experience (i.e. D1 easier than D2). The reason? Well, simply because by the time D2 came out, I was still unfamiliar with RPGs with skill points. (HOMM and Diablo were pretty much the only RPGs I’d played). D1 was hard to finish for a 8-10 year old at that time I’d say, but I did it the same way most people did and still do – by clever use of the surroundings (standing in doors etc). That made sense intuitively, it’s the way you finish almost every action game.

          So what happened in D2? Not knowing what I wanted I put a skill point here and there to check them out. Ofc every skill sucked compared to the one I already had 3 points in, which made me stick with that, and try yet another new skill after ding. Naturally the build became sub-optimal and with my poor ability to have quality loot drop, I couldn’t even finish Diablo on normal (Remember I ran around the altar with Big D behind me for 20 mins or so with my Bowazon, only to die when I had him at like 10%). Conclusion being the noob I was? “F**** this char sucks, I’ll try a new one”. Same story repeated… (For some reason it didn’t occur to me that build was important, I was still in the mindset of D1 with loot as the only source of power).

          Not until years later I picked D2 up again, found my love for theory crafting and have played it since (so today I’d agree that D1 is actually harder). But, to relate it to the topick at hand. From my personal experience, the tooltips didn’t help me squat back in my early noobish teens, so why should they do so for noobs this time around? Allowing free specs will help the noobs, which they already have. Let the rest of us have our beautiful math intact in-game plz!

  10. I don’t mind alt-tabbing to get the info.  Going to a wiki would be better than relying on them to get the info right anyway.  But what would be wrong with them putting the info that is at the Arreat Summit in some sort of lorebook that was a click away in game.  Maybe you right click on a skill and it sends you there to the right page.

  11. no need to take out of my system because it is already out of my debts, but im still gonna play it, if you know what i mean
     
    enjoy blizzard

  12. no need to take out of my system because it is already out of my debts, but i will still play it, if you know what i mean
     
    enjoy blizzard

  13. can they PLEASE stop updating senseless **** … and just focus on getting the game done? …

    • If you think that this is slowing the release your sorely mistaken.  Diablo 3 has a very large team and not all are busy trying to fix what ever is holding the game back.  So the writers have time to sit there and fix tool tips.

  14. If they do it like WoW where simplified tooltips were just an option it will be perfectly fine.
    If they only have simplified tooltips; Do not want!

    Sure we can get the info on web-pages, but its somewhat bad game-design if people need to go to a browser for the most essential and basic game information.
    Hell, if they want to keep the tooltips small with no options, throw all our skills into the lorebook in the game, with tons of information?

  15. I just googled diablo 3 tooltips to see what they currently look like and they are already pretty simplified. How else could they simplify them? Not show the % of damage the skill adds or not show the radius of the skill? Not show the attacks per second on an item or the amount of DPS???

    This is basic information you would NEED to decide which skills/items to use, but maybe i dont understand what they mean by “simplify”.

  16. You know when Bashiok starts a post with “don’t freak out” that they have done something completely and totally asinine. But I called it.

    This isn’t even remotely necessary. 
    If they are making these idiotic changes intentionally, they must have gathered some information during focus testing of some sort. The information they gathered is that people are complete retards. So here’s my questions:
    1. Where did they hire such morons to do focus testing? Or are they playing it and thinking, you know, gamers are such morons that they’ll never be able to understand such concepts. 
    2. If they didn’t intentionally hire morons, then are the designers emulating sheer stupidity?
    3. Are the designers, then, morons?

    • you know, i thought you where one of the fanatics, but seems like your not. i agree, or they hired idiots or the designers are morons. having to alt tab to have important info like % and dps is retarded
       

      • you know, RR might be questioning every move blizzard makes, he might be harsh with his criticism but he aint no idiot. and i almost all of the time agree with him. 

        on topic: i am not even going to freak out about this. the current ingame tool tips are already basic at best.
        and their decision to tone it down even more is not the least bit surprising. they are re-positioning the franchise to aim at retards – if you didnt notice until now.
        the game itself is fun to play for a little while, but has little to do with the former franchise.

        i cant even be bothered to fire up the beta again tbh. all newcomers and retards are going to love it, but those of us who where waiting the past ten years… well…  its dead, jim.

        • I’m very, very generous with praise when it’s earned. But it seems like this year alone they’ve tried to systematically dismantle all of the good parts of the game.

    • I’m assuming they focus tested with console gamers…

      • That excuse doesn’t really carry weight. I’m a console gamer.
        The “industry” separates gamers into three categories: casual, core, and hardcore. The majority of people spending money on games are core gamers, which is why they are called that.

        They do this kind of garbage to do what they think is catering to the casual game crowd, but in the process, they are ruining aspects of the game for everyone else when there’s no reason to think a casual gamer (someone who plays angry birds on an iPad, for instance) would give half a shit about Diablo or want to play a game on a computer.

        Console players like me get equally upset at lack of information inside of games. There are things we need to know. For diablo? It’s a numbers game.

        WE NEED THE DAMN NUMBERS.

        • ” Console players like me get equally upset at lack of information inside of games.”
           
          Certainly doesn’t seem so from all the console ports i played…

  17. Skill tooltips are already very simple and just shows basic skill stats.. so are they gonna remove them completelly or what? How can they be even more simplier? ^^

  18. I like how the retarded news post only goes as far as the ‘freaking out’ part without actually digesting or discussing the merits of this decision.

    Oh well, just further proof that the news articles on this site are overblown biased nonsense.

  19. Not a big deal, IMO. These are tooltips we are talking about here, who wants to have ridiculosly large tooltip covering half your screen. I have often found that current tooltips have some redundancy, they display too much information, some of which is unnecessary. What I am concerned about that isn´t necesserily tied to current issue, is the amount and accuracy of information in game. I think it would be cool if could have things like formula for damage/defense displayed in game, rather then us fans having to dig through game files to obtain information which is necessary for character building/equiping in end game.

  20. i own blizzard shares and i hope they dont fail with diablo3 …. this is getting more and more to the level of overnoobing. but i am still confident that it will be an awesome game, i hope they will implement the switching tool ..

  21. Since when do you have to be a ‘hardcore gamer’ to understand simple math? I really do not understand how it could be more simplified than it already is. 

    Is it gonna come down to:

    Barb Skill Cleave — Hit stuff with big stick in half-circle wavy fashion?!??!?!

    I can’t help but conclude that 

    1) This is clearly the strong hand of Activision messing with Blizzard 
    2) Just further exemplifies the terrible trend that video games are becoming too easy … likely correlating with the increasing stupidity of the human race by making EVERYTHING too easy and hand-holding (Ever see the movie Idiocracy? … its scary)

    Honestly, I haven’t had any problems with other so-called ‘controversial’ issues that DIII has presented (ie. RMAH, skill tree removal, manual attribute point removal, etc. I think those are all fine and help evolve the game/genre) 

    But even though we don’t know the exact changes that are going to occur … just the obscure blizzard comment on the subject makes me sick to my stomach …

    • It’ll be simpler than that. Barb Skill Cleave – Cleave your enemies.

      Also, it won’t tell you if there’s a damage increase for the next skill point you put into it because there’ll be none of that.

  22. I don’t really care either way how they explain to me what each spell does. Less reading means more pwning imo. I wish they’d do something about the in-game tips that pop up every time I do something new that game.

    • People like you actually exist?
      How are you going to “pwn” if you don’t properly know what a spell or skill does by the lacking, shitty tooltip?
      How are you goign to “pwn” if you don’t have the information you need displayed in front of you?
      How can you pick between skills and runes to make the best build for your playstyle to “pwn” because Blizzard thinks we’re retards?

      • its alright Red……when the game  comes out and hes just playing and not really paying any attention to how or what hes doing me, you and many others will “pwn” HIS ass 😉

        His ignorance will be his undoing…..

        @Sippin kind of off topic but were you in any focus groups recently by chance?

      • Yes, we exist. I’m just saying, the current in-game descriptions are rather lengthy. It’s unnecessary. 
        And yes, spells are pretty self explanatory. They do damage and/or slow you down or de-buff in someway. But I can understand how this can be difficult to understand without playing the game. it’s a very simple game, I shouldn’t have to read a paragraph to figure out what type of resist I’m de-buffing when I add a rune.

        Edit: and there are A LOT of tooltips while playing.. it’s annoying. Be happy you never had to experience it. shits intense man

    • This reveal could really use an early sample of their simplified tool-tips. No use letting us sit here and speculate. Ugh.

  23. If Blizz _simplifies_ tooltips – thats fine. But the good amount of information MUST be in-game. I don’t want to Alt-Tab to read more.

    If Blizz _makes tooltips totally retarded_ – goddamn NO to this!

    Players just need to turn on their brain for a moment and think a bit, to understand what this or that description means. Come on, don’t support brain-dead people, please!

  24. Moar dumbing downs?!? How can this be possible? I thought they had already reached the limit by now…
     
    I really can’t understand this decision. Even a casual player want to have the most efficient build possible. Simplifying the tool-tips will only force most of player to search the internet for crazy formulas datamined from the game and that’s really annoying. Why is it so hard to make short tool-tips but with some kind of button that allows you to read the details of the skill when you are brainstorming about your build?

    • If I could wish for something I would wish all RPGs to have crazy complicated skills trees. A little like this:
      http://migre.me/7434E

      • I wonder, is that really crazy complicated, or are there just 100 skills that just increase some of your stats etc.
         
         

        • Yes, most of the passive skills in PoE are the same (+10 str, +10 int, +life, etc) but if you think for a moment there are hundreds of different paths that you can choose from, each one leading to a slight different final build. Discovering the best possible build is not something you can do in 5 minutes.

          The magnitude of the dumbing down process of Blizzard’s games are incredible. I laugh when I remember WoW had 71 talent points in WotLK and and now they are going to reduce it to 6 points.

          • But most of those builds could have easily been made with just putting points into attributes instead of picking skills…
             
            Skill trees like that always felt like the devs cheating to me, making it so it takes a long time to find the best build simply by forcing the player to count more beans…
             
             

  25. Omg, this shit is unnecessary. RELEASE THE GAME ALREADY.

  26. “We don’t want people to alt-tab.”
    “We don’t want hidden, obscure, inscrutable mechanics.”
     
    “Hey guys! We’re taking all the numbers out of the skill tooltips!”

  27. It’s funny they focus on tooltips when they could put the efforts somewhere else that NEEDS it…

  28. What’s wrong with Toggle?

    Have it simplified as default and those that bother with custom settings will know to toggle the regular listing on.  It’s not as if the mechanism for showing regular tooltips is not already in so leave it as is but set default to ‘off’.

    Making people alt tab out of the game seems really drastic and flies in the face of their continued efforts to keep people absorbed in the game and the gameplay flowing. What could possibly be more jarring that ‘brb, just checking skill stats’?

     

     

    • That’s exactly what I thought, Elly!
      They say they don’t want to force us to alt tab to check the information at the website, but they are removing the complete info from the in game. W’T’Hell??? A “hold Ctrl to show more info” so you can just hold it and see the complete info about everything would be so easy and satisfactory for everyone…
      This seems to be going too far for noob-friendly. Having a noob-friendly interface is OK to me, but not allowing a “fan” interface to be shown? why? because noobs could access it and get confused?
      And more stupid than that is Blizzard antecipating the fans-rage and trying to give us a non-sense explanation about it.
      Ok, so just lets wait for it. Maybe it won’t be TOO stupid-noob-friendly.

      • Either way you still have to stop and read the stats…..it takes a couple extra clicks if you have to alt-tab? and for the record im not pro-noob tool tips….like others have said i will need to see them first before i can make my mind up.

    • Or “let me bust out my calculator for ten minutes while I figure out whether this is an upgrade with my build or not, because the tooltips don’t tell me with updated numbers on equipped weapons”.
      I guess it’s not a lying character screen if it doesn’t tell you anything to begin with?

      It seems like they’re opposed to the toggle simply because they’re out of time. But they already have these tooltips, how long could it possibly take?
      Oh.
      Yeah.

      Fucking Blizzard.

  29. They don’t stop rewriting what they already have done! When they are going to delivery this game?! If it keeps going this way I doubt it is going to make to the first quarter of 2012!

  30. Simplified tooltips is in my opinion something that can be very annoying. However, I don’t really care if it’s just toning down explaining visuall effects like ‘the monk infuses himself with holy energy before brining it upon his enemies close him causing 300 holy damage’ to ‘the monk does 300 holy damage to enemies close to him’.
    But, when they tone down the essential information of the skill; then it becomes very bothersome and extremely annoying- “The monk engulfs nearby enemies in holy energy”. I have no idea if that spell is stunning, damaging, slowing  or any combination of such things, neither the extent of the AoE which is critical in all AoE spells.
    Another problem with simplified tooltips is that a skill may sound very powerful in the description but function very ‘meh’ in actual gameplay becuase of a special casting time, high resource cost, too little aoe etc. It can cause a very big anti climax and give a bad experience since your new high level spell can turn out to be worse than that what you picked up at lvl 6. This is something that I always encounter in diablo-like games – always.
    A very easy solution is to have a sort of knowledge database which include clips of each spells so you in an accesible way can look at each spell in action. But it is important that the clips doesn’t try to make the spells looks better than they actually are (like on the offical site) where 1hp monsters get 1-shoted by spells that may actually be a very bad choice for damage etc.
    But since you can swap skills quite easy in d3 it will not be gamebreaking though, given that you can find high detail information somewhere else about every spell.

  31. I dont think a lot of you understand that software has to be easy to use.  So they make it a little more difficult to get to the technical aspects of the game but so what? It should be that way. Why? Cuz not everyone was/is a hardcore gamer and all these fancy numbers would just confuse them.

    I personally like the idea. Is it really going to change the game in a drastic way? No.

    • The thing is that if it is too complicated for the new player to understand he can just read the flavor text and go by that.  Players who seriously want or even need that information to compare don’t have a choice and must alt-tab and look it up which completely removes them from the game.  It doesn’t hurt the new players to have to skim the parts of the tip they don’t understand or to turn the option on that reduces the tool tips to their more ‘herp-a-derp’ mentality.

    • …fancy numbers?

      Are you serious? Do you look at your banking statement and say “psh, I don’t need these complicated fancy numbers”?

    • Of course they have to be easy to use. The current tooltips are extremely easy already. Only a moron can’t decide which skill to choose with the current tooltips. I never played D3 and I still managed to make builds using skill calculators that where very similar with the current best builds used by many beta testers. There’s no need to simplify even more so a baby cold make the perfect build even when he cannot read.

    • Why does software have to be easy to use?
      Also having numbers in a text hardly qualifies as ‘not easy to use’.

      Hell, it makes it harder to use because you have to google the stuff instead.

  32. My first thought… no sentence that begins with \don’t freak out, but…\ is ever good.  My second thought… I thought the tooltips were already dumbed down  \a kick that does X% dmg\.  My third thought… what is going on over there?  So much of the game still seems to be in flux… are they doing this because they know they have the time to do it?  Are they doing this because when they put %s next to a skill, people just choose the highest % and they want to hide the numbers in hopes people will diversify?  The game seems very straightforward as it exists now.  Pick up stuff compare numbers, put on stuff with higher numbers.  Level up, get new skills and skill slots.  Pick skills, test em out, keep the ones you like.  Do this until you can’t find any items with higher numbers and can’t level up anymore.  Sell your characters and items on the RMAH.  You win!

  33. we should think about making tool tips for blizzard employees; how to cook healthy meals and how to loose weight :mrgreen:

    • However on a serious note, I don´t really have a problem with it, unless they make it as pedagogical as in zelda. Furthermore I hope, that you can turn it off before you begin the game, so I don´t have to get annoyed by it everytime I make a new character.

  34. Blizzard should stop removing stuff from the game and “simplify” the game, instead they should actually ADD to the game not remove. But if they want to make a game for casual players only, that`s fine.

  35. To me it is more confusing if they dont show exactly what the skill does via tool tips….

    Even a complete newb is going to want to see the numbers and %’s in order to know if one skill is better to invest in than another. So they cant dumb it down too much or its just that, a dumb system! Blizzard wounldnt be that retarded……..would they?

    Yes, a dumbed down system would work if you stayed in normal difficulty where damage doesnt really matter because you can kill everything easily anyways. But when you start getting into higher difficulties you will want to optimize your skills as well as possible and to do that you need to know the stats of the skills using the tooltips.

  36. Every bit of news about the beta makes me want to buy the game less and less.
     

  37. Sounds good to me, as long as all the required information is given. Really like the whole “no need to alt-tab” approach.

  38. I’m amused everyone is foaming at the mouth over…tooltips. Really? Why not pull your hair out because there’s no endgame but grinding for items for the RMAH?

    • While you are definitely right to an extent, I think the irritation stems not from the fact that they are dumbing down the tooltips, but rather that a lot of people who were once very excited about this game feels that many of the features that made the previous games exciting and fun are being removed for the sake of making it easier to play and thereby more fun. At least it seems to me Blizzards notion is easier = more fun, or less thinking = more fun. I for one do not feel the same, in fact I feel the opposite. A game shouldn’t be too hard, but if it’s just a matter of clicking through content I can simply watch the cinematics on youtube and spend my time doing something which actually feels rewarding.

      Having said that, I have fears for the endgame as well, but at this point I feel like I need to wait and see. Even if there is still a chance this game will rock, I do feel that Blizzard may be going too far with the whole “make the game more accessible”-business, to the point of me almost feeling alienated. Perhaps that doesn’t mean anything for Blizzard and perhaps it actually makes my life easier because I have one less game to play in my limited spare time, but I really want this game to be good. If that wasn’t the case, I’d just choose not to care and move on.

      • TBH, I think this makes the game HARDER, b/c you’re “flying blind” and trying to build a character, skill set, gear set w/o knowing what the hell is going on. “I just switched my ‘Awesome Axe of Annihilation’ for a ‘Sweet Sword of Slaying,’ that’s better, right?” We don’t know!

        • However that’s not always harder in a good way…
          Surely the difficulty should come from your ability to use skills not finding out about what they actually do?

  39. I really, really do not like the approach – ‘assume retard until proven otherwise’.

    I mean, what, this game is rated M in US? Haven’t adults finished college by the time they’re ‘allowed’ to play the game? Do they still teach for the love of god -at least- algebra in college nowadays? How hard can it possibly be to understand simple numbers like damage per interval or damage increase by %? I mean, really? Did they have a team of monkeys for the focus group?

    My god..  You have got to be kidding me.

  40. No surprises here since this is what they’ve been doing to every other aspect of the game aswell. I’m glad they’re being honest about their intent with this change atleast, it’s not often we hear the whole story behind a change from ActiBlizz.
     
    So they’re looking to make a simple tooltip and one that’s simpler than that. Why not make one for us who they obviusly know are “freaking out” aswell? Anything that may confuse a grandmother playing for the first time gets the boot apparently :/
     
     

  41. just so long as they don’t have the items and skills “talk” like the old “Clippy the Paper Clip” from MS Office

  42. Unless the tooltips say something like “Click this. Kill more”, I wouldn’t really freak out.

    While it is necessary for D3 to cater the needs of newbies, I don’t think that a simplified tooltip will ruin the game for us hardcore players. Its not like we will have to read the tooltips all the time in order to play right?
     
    Usually, we will just read it once and “meh, already knew that”. And the trully hardcore learns about skills and whatnots in wikis and forums and not just rely on what the tooltip says in-game.

  43. The game will probably be released with a Blizzard employee included.  He’ll be there to hold your hand and push the play button on the remote control that plays this game turned interactive movie.

    I can with all honesty say I haven’t heard any good news from this game since the skill-rune videos came out.  Oh and invisible dyes.. I was pretty stoked about hiding starfish hats and spiky face masks.. oh wait, that’s not suppose to be good news right? 
    What is happening to this game?!

  44. this computer makes ping,
    this stat makes something, believe me it is all you need to know

  45. Fuck! Now I’m pissed off. Is Bashiok high on drugs or something? Did he actually played Diablo 2 before linking arreat summit?
    The tooltips from arreat summit are not the same tooltips showed inside D2. Arreat summit’s tooltips has way more flavor texts in the skills, different from the skills in D2.

    Bash
    powerfull blow that increases the damage done to enemies and knocks them back

    Bash Receives Bonuses From:
    Stun: +5% Damage per Level
    Concentrate: +5% Attack Rating per Level
     
    Any idea how to simplify that? Only if we remove all the text.

  46. I’m betting this is much ado about nothing.  There are multiple ways to interpret Bashiok stumbling over his own explanation (and painting a big bullseye on his arse).  Tooltips never helped me kill the s^&$ out of things… I always drew my own damage tables on paper anyway and I don’t think I’ve read a tooltip in D2 since 2001… this is really an issue?

  47. lol, 4 pages of comments… the “Don’t Freak Out!” title didn’t work I guess

  48. They’re claiming that statistics are not what Diablo is about? Granted not entirely, but it went something like this ARPG -> Killing Monsters -> statistics (skills, damage, timings, framerates, precision leveling, etc.).

    The accuracies of Diablo 2’s in-depth skills and data system is what made it that much more compelling; having the ability to truly build your character – from the ground up – just the way you wanted and like no other RPG could. Even in current other RPGs, the tooltips are vital. I don’t know if Blizzard is having a problem with writing when it comes to flavor text, but I’ve never encountered a “paragraph tooltip” in any other major RPG. 

    Hell, looking at the screnshot of Disentegrate the text says:
    http://diablo.incgamers.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/6306/title/new-wiz-skill-window/cat/635
    “Thrust a beam of pure arcane energy forward dealing 18-23 Arcane damage per second and disintegrating enemies it kills.”
    1) The entire chunk of text “and disintegrating enemies it kills” is not needed. Maybe that’s what’s taking up so much space?
    2)  Even if you kept that, this is where a concise/full option comes into play. GuildWars figured this out over 3 years ago: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Sever_Artery
    As you can see, the first description adds some flavor and the second is obvious. This option applies to every skill in the game and is a simple toggle in GW’s options menu.

    [?] Show concise descriptions

  49. Who actually reads tool tips ? Are they expecting people with the mentality of cavemen playing the game ?

  50. true we don’t need all the number crunching because of no skill points but that just means We don’t need an arreat summit type site but I think we do need tooltips that have an accurate number of damage we will do, without our current level and weapon taken into account, something that arreat, just won’t be able to do. and if its a pulse rate like elecrocute I think we deserve that.

    basicly I think they got it ass backwards

    no arreat summit – yes damage in tooltips

  51. I suspect this is a result of testing the game, but not necessarily out of direct feedback. If the testers are anything like me, they probably ended up spending hours calculating and reading through tooltips, and blizzard probably thought the game should be more intuitive and more hands-on. Hence their reluctance to include it even as an advanced option.

    It is debatable how much of a good game design decision this is. I do admit that sometimes I kind of feel cheated out of my play time when I end up spending so much time reading through skill descriptions and trying to plan out the entire career of the character before playing it. However, other times I feel like this is precisely what makes the game more interesting: the planning it takes to actually play it well.

    It’s kind of hard to tell how it will feel like without actually playing. I guess we’ll have to wait and see.

  52. I’m freakin out!

  53. It’s a shame the internet ego reads Simplified as “You’re simple”.

    When it means, we want this game to be accessible for as many players as possible.

    It’s a shame when people start to invest emotion into something negative and ignore the positive.

    It’s a shame when a remarkable game is dissected by angry people, when it has never been played.

    It’s a shame when people resent a company for being number one and endeavouring to
    remain so.

    • “It’s a shame the internet ego reads Simplified as “You’re simple”.”

      I think “extremely Simplified” instead of “You’re simple” would be more fitting.

      “When it means, we want this game to be accessible for as many players as possible.”

      We? Are you on the development team? Did i ask for this? ???

      “It’s a shame when people start to invest emotion into something negative and ignore the positive.”

      In context of tooltips i can agree (even though there are some gripes with them, i.e. why no toggle?), but in many cases with Diablo 3 it’s understandable.

      “It’s a shame when a remarkable game is dissected by angry people, when it has never been played.”

      How come you know it’s a remarkable game, since you havent played it yourself? Besides, why a game cannot be dissected? Should it be imprevious to any criticism? And why should it be above criticism?

      “It’s a shame when people resent a company for being number one and endeavouring to remain so.”

      First of all, Blizzard isn’t the same blizzard we all got to love. Further on, Blizzard has been making some stupid decisions lately, so it’s hard not to get cynical about them. Last but not least, personally, i wouldn’t call Blizzard a no. 1 company. Ever.

  54. i never lookat at the tooltips in D2 so i don’t care. and [email protected] delay doomsayers
    you act like they can’t finish shit like tooltips in 2 months

  55. Just small offtopic… anyone else having problem with Avast and forums ? When I try to get in I have Avast alarm saying:
    http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/|>{gzip}
    HTML:Iframe-inf

  56. After reading the tool-tips on the skill calculator (I’m assuming they are representative of what’s in game), I can’t imagine anyone thinking “OMG so complicated! Numberz oh nos!” Most of them are barely two complete sentences. So… My guess is maybe shorter = easier translation to multiple languages =  cheaper/less time? I really don’t know, seems like such a trivial thing.

  57. I don’t do my theorycrafting in-game. Having 100% information in a good format on the web is better than advanced tooltips imo.

    • If you want to play competitively its common having to search for information outside the game to make the best build possible, even if the new build is 0,1% better than the previous one. Having short or long tooltips won’t make much difference. However if the simplification is made to the point that its only possible to differentiate two skills by looking at their animations (cleave/leap attack i.e.) instead of their damage then everyone must agree its a crap concept.
      Information like damage, coldown, resource cost, buff/debuff duration, proc chance are mandatory in any tooltip. I bet those announced simplifications will remove most of those infos, leaving only the damage indicator in the tooltips. That is LAME!

  58. The majority of the player base of D3 will be casual gamers. Blizz wants as many people as they can turning into hardcore D3 gamers before they reach 60, and simplifying/describing how things function is just another step for them in doing that.  The hardcore gamers represent a minority.  The average gamer wont want to number crunch and would rather have things explained exactly how they work.  The same thing goes with limitless respecting, that is geared toward the casual gamer as well.  If Blizz can pull off a more defined, easier to understand tooltip while still having a game which attracts the hardcore gamers(and i think it will) then i think Blizz would have accomplished what they set out to do:keeping a large percentage of the player base coming back for more. If they make the game geared toward the hardcore only then that means too much work initially for the casual gamer which potentially could make them(casual gamers) leave the game.  Blizzard wants as many people using the RMAH as possible and if the majority of your player base dies off before they reach level 60 that means less people buying items which means less money for Blizzard.  Blizz wants to satisfy as many people as possible and this is another step in that direction.

  59. I don’t see how this has any impact on _real_ hardcore players. They should memorize all the skills in Diablo II already. And if deeper skill planning is required the arreat summit is the way to go in any case.

  60. I thought they already simplified tooltips…   I mean, removing spellpower, damage types, basing everything off weapon damage.  Attack and Precision also come to mind.

  61. Uhm, then we don’t need stats and numbers on items and weapons either, I assume ? I mean, why would I slap on a new axe for another reason than that it’s shinier and bigger than my old one ?
     
    *Shit, I hope I don’t give them ideas !*

  62. At this point I really hope this isn’t taking time away from the bigger things that need to get done to actually make a Q1 12′ release……. *sigh

  63. Feeling more and more like I can’t tell the difference between D3 and an isometric Tekken.
    Honestly their perspective of “hardcore” is insanely skewed. There exists a “normal” gamer between hardcore and couch-wii-family-casual………….and guess what? That normal gamer wants an actual RPG experience in there. It is a sad day when RED FACTION starts having more RPG elements than Diablo.

    But all my bickering ASSide, I’m not angry…………..I’m scared. I’m scared the game I’ve been looking forward to for so long will not draw me in. It seems like it is going to be about loot, loot more loot and oh? What’s that on the floor? MORE LOOT! Loot is nice but does nothing to make your character feel truly “unique” in the world. By endgame everyone will be running the same gear for each class and with the ability to completely swap skills on the fly? You’ll be exactly the same as everyone else from your class! 🙁

  64. If this “simplifying” trend continues, five or six more months in the development, and Diablo 3 will be ready for release. On mobile phones.

  65. Many people who said Blizzard keep duming down the game don’t even know what deep gameplay means.

  66. Many people who said Blizzard keep duming down the game don’t even know what deep gameplay means.

  67. http://diablo.incgamers.com/gallery/data/585/videogame-then-now-easy.jpg,

    Tool-tips aren’t the most critical thing, but still,
    the feeling is relevant in my opinion,
    and that is sad.

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