Questions on Diablo 3 Torment Magic Find Issues


Some posts in the B.net forums illustrate common misconceptions about the new difficulty system and Paragon system.

when you go to any Torment level in the game when you actually get in and check your character sheet and look at what your magic find is it only show the gold find going up and i’ve checked it with 8 people already and when i go torment lvl 6 i still dont see it, it only shows my gold going up in percent it would say 1600% gold find and then with magic find it would only show 40% MF so i think your mf in the Torment lvls are messed up i just want to get my money’s worth playing this game plz fix this.
Tsarnis: Playing in Torment difficulty does not provide a bonus to the Magic Find stat. It does however confer a bonus to legendary drop chance, but this bonus is not visible anywhere on the character details pane.

Tsarnis – can you confirm what the legendary bonus for Torment 6 is over Torment 1? It’s very difficult to notice any substantial change. I’m not necessarily looking for hard absolute numbers, but rather something like “Torment 6 provides 4 times the legendary drop rate as Torment 1”.
Tsarnis: I can confirm that it does increase the higher up into Torment you go.

there are a lot of inquiring forum folk that would really like to know
Tsarnis: I am sure that is the case, but it’s not really my place lift the hood and show everyone the nuts and bolts, as it were. I was simply clarifying for the OP why there wasn’t an overt magic find bonus granted for Torment difficulty and clarify that this is, in fact, intended.

I would like know why I have still only 29% for magic find after update. Although paragon level rising, magic find is still only 29%. Is it some bug?
Tsarnis: This is not a bug. Paragon levels gained no longer grant a bonus to Magic Find.

I can hear leg sound when i drop it from my inventory but never from a monster or chest.
This is a bug that hasn’t been addressed yet but it will be in an upcoming patch for which I have no ETA at this time.

Torment 6 from the RoS beta: "250% bonus Legendary drop rate."

Torment 6 from the RoS beta: “250% bonus Legendary drop rate.”

Their confusion is understandable, since in the old Paragon and Monster Power systems your character gained 3% MF with every Paragon level, and each higher difficulty level added 25% Magic Find. Those steady incremental boosts to Magic Find are not present in D3v2, which is done on more of a plateau system. Your MF is identical (AFAIK) from Normal-Master, and only improves, in the form or more frequent legendary drops, with each higher level of Torment.

I haven’t played that much Torment yet in D3v2, but I played a great deal of it in RoS, and despite the tooltips promising higher legendary drop rates, I never noticed any change in the *quantity* of legs. I did see a boost in *quality*, since I found a few of the higher quality, rarer, Torment-only legendary and set items. Special Torment-only legs don’t seem to be in D3v2 though, and while Torment grants a lot more exp, if your gear isn’t great and it’s taking you 3x as long to earn 2x the exp, you’d be better off dropping down to faceroll Hard until you find a few more gear upgrades.

How do you guys feel about the difficulty progression in Diablo 3 version 2? Are there enough perks on Torment to make it worth the trouble? Have you noticed more or better legendaries commensurate with the increased challenge level?


OT, but one of the basic tips for proper writing is to read your sentence aloud. This works especially well if you’re writing dialogue, but can be helpful even with general prose. Imagine if that first guy had done so with his *sentence*? Try it if you want, but be sure you take a deep breath and talk fast.

Or else you will die.

Comments

You're not logged in but can still post comments. Register or login to remember your details.
  1. Hi Flux. Just to clarify. Have you noticed an increase in legendary quality through the Torment levels? Or just from non Torment, to Torment?

    I’ve only played Torment myself (3/4), and not noticed any significant increase in drop rate, or quality. But it’s only been a week 🙂

    • In RoS I never notice if I was finding more total legendaries on Torment. eventually my DH was very well geared and I could do Torment 1 basically speed farming, as quickly as I’d been doing Hard a month earlier. And the total Leg finds seemed about the same.

      The point in Torment in RoS was to have a chance at the higher quality, less-common legendaries. I don’t think that’s quite the case in D3v2 at this point, but I could be wrong. Bliz has said that the legendary items are weighted in D3v2, so you’ll find some much more often than others, with the ones with better legendary properties less common. That would presumably be a reason to play Torment and higher; to boost your odds of finding the rarer, better ones.

      • After a bit of analysis, I can write the following.

        I had a Barb with mp10 farmable gear. Since the patch, I’ve done t3 solo and t4 co-op. A total of 34 legendaries have dropped. 6* of which have been upgrades (3 immortal kings armour pieces, and braces, shoulders, and a one hander), and all but 4 of the 34 were smart drops. *One of the IK was a non smart drop off my co-op partner. *ALL the upgrades have come from t4*.

        It’s too small a sample to draw any firm conclusions, but anecdotally, i’d say farm as higher Torment lvl as possible for quality drops.

  2. I’ve not noticed any, but I’ve only bounced around expert/master/torment1 being hardcore.

    That said, for god’s sake Blizzard, if you have a system in place, make it transparent. I too felt that going higher then expert was detrimental to my drops.. and had reason to think going higher would be better for any reason besides the side game you put in called Paragon.

  3. Sorry, a bit drunk.. should have just stopped here..

    That said, for god’s sake Blizzard, if you have a system in place, make it transparent.

  4. They chose not to reveal the legendary drop increase %. I think the difference between T1 and T6 is not large. This is based on the way they changed key drops odds from 5-100% to 25-50%. Maybe due to the small difference, they decided not to reveal the numbers. On the other hand, maybe the difference is large and they did not want to make the numbers public to prevent players feeling forced to play on higher difficulties.

    • Yeah, pretty evasive of them, I think. I suspect it’s a combination of ‘higher quality’, where it’s really only the chances of the torment-only legendaries that increase on the higher torment levels, and possibly the “auto-drop legendary” timer they have in the background cranked up a bit to ensure shorter time between drops.

      • I should say “to ensure a more consistent rate of drops and fewer dry spells”, which is subtly different.

        Really wish you could edit comments here.

    • Agreed. They’ve been extremely open about nearly every other number involved in the game, why start hiding things now? Either this CM is making a decision on their own without actually asking the devs, or they know it would be a disappointment.

      If T6 is only double the chance of T1 (like the keys), that wouldn’t be too terrible though. Legendary drop rate is pretty high as it is. I got *two* from the Skeleton King on T2 yesterday, and that’s after the patch to remove the guaranteed drop.

      • They didn’t hotfix the Skeleton King legendary bug yet…

        And I don’t think the legendary drop rate is high… I played 3 hours yesterday and found just 1 legendary… This is very annoying.

        • oh my god the legendary drop rate is sooooo much higher i get 2-7 or a 6 hour play when pre patch i could go a week without seeing one

      • Also note that this is from the EU forums. Those CMs have no direct daily contact with the devs in Irvine, so they have to be more careful about what info they give out, since they can’t just pop into Wyatt’s office and ask what the current Torment drop rate boosts are and if it’s okay to reveal them on the forums.

  5. I prefer to play on a higher Torment level even though I probably don’t have the DPS for it. I’d rather have a chance that I’ll die and make it more challenging than facerolling through a lower difficulty for faster XP or loots.

  6. @ “I haven’t played that much Torment yet in D3v2, but I played a great deal of it in RoS, and despite the tooltips promising higher legendary drop rates, I never noticed any change in the *quantity* of legs. I did see a boost in *quality*, since I found a few of the higher quality, rarer, Torment-only legendary and set items.”

    Yep, same here. Since we have a guaranteed legendary drop mechanic that kicks in after ~2 hours (to help you out if your RNG is bad), my *theory* is that there is another mechanic in place that makes sure that you won’t get more than 1-2 legendaries per hour. So, if you’re a fast farmer and your RNG is normal, you won’t see an increase in drop rates but in drop quality instead.

  7. “despite the tooltips promising higher legendary drop rates, I never noticed any change in the *quantity* of legs”

    It’s kinda counter-intuitive, but this actually means that there’s an increase in quantity. Torment levels scale enemy HP way up, so if the drops are similar on T1 to say Master with a given gear and character, then that means that the drops are scaled up by an same amount proportional to enemy HP.

    Basically this means that if you could kill enemies in one hit on both Master and T1 then T1 would be vastly better in drops. People need to realize that for item finding purposes it’s never a good idea to play on the highest difficulty they can manage. Doing that is a good choice only if you care about the other rewards as well (XP, gold and higher level gems in the expansion).

    As for why they don’t show the exact Legendary increase between Torment levels, I find it funny how everyone automatically assumes the worst. It’s much more likely in my opinion that the drop scaling is not as simple as increased Legendary drop chance, so it’s not as easy to describe in a short tooltip. For example, it could be that higher Torment levels make it so that the now famous Legendary timer kicks in sooner. Whatever the case, I’m fairly sure Torment levels increase the drop chances. At T3 this becomes noticeable.

    My friends and I can only handle T2 in solo, but we can easily play on T3 in a party. Playing in a party has the huge advantage (amongst many other things) that you can stay ahead of the enemy scaling, so drop scaling becomes much more apparent. Ever since we started playing on T3 we usually get 2-3 Legendaries per hour and one of my insanely lucky friend tends to get slightly more than that.

    • You’re correct that they probably boost the leg quantity so even if you’re slower you’ll find about the same number. But, by the end of the beta my DH could farm Torment 1 as or more quickly than my other chars could clear Hard or Expert.

      I didn’t keep exact numbers, but I never felt like my DH was finding any more total legs, even while facerolling torment. Obviously that’s a pretty subjective measure and I didn’t record data, but it wasn’t anything like 3x as many legs as I got when clearing Expert at about the same pace with a weaker char.

  8. I’m kind of feeling lucky myself.

    In about 20h of game play I’ve found around 30 legs already and in a 35 min play session I found 3 (1 plan, one ring and one amulet). Granted the stats on some of these are not worth calling home.

    I play T1 even though I’m not geared uber godly like some of the clan folks I play with in INC2 (I stopped playing like 8 months before 2.0.1)

    I also glanced quickly at all the sets/legs on the game guide and I find that a lot of legendaries do not have any special bonus that would make it “interesting” (I play DH)

    There are a few like that bow that gens hated for Elemental arrow but most of them have no bonus. The one I’d like to try is the quier where Bolas explode instantly as I’m currently using burriza which pierces 2 times so when you shoot bolas and you have mutliple enemies lined up, you can actually get 3 bolas hitting an if they would blow up instantly, it would speed up killing and you could use the rune of 2sec delay without delay.

    • “The one I’d like to try is the quier where Bolas explode instantly”

      Yeah, I’ve got that, but by itself it’s not very impressive. The unique affix I mean. Even though it dropped at level 39 for me I still use at 60, because it rolled with near perfect stats.

  9. “OT, but one of the basic tips for proper writing is to read your sentence aloud. This works especially well if you’re writing dialogue, but can be helpful even with general prose. Imagine if that first guy had done so with his *sentence*? Try it if you want, but be sure you take a deep breath and talk fast.

    Or else you will die.”
    It’s not so hard, there is one comma in the middle so this helps a lot. Maybe he’s “hardcore” player 😉

  10. Found 7 legendaries, 5 of which are weapons.

    Amulet dropped from random cellar mob and weapon (bul-khatos with socket) dropped from the chest right next to where amulet dropped :D.

    2 at the same time. And i almost decided not to open it. Hah! good i did!

  11. Best legendary so far dropped on Expert A4.

    Thunderfury with 351% dmg proc, 527 str, 319 vit, socket, and immobilize on hit as well as 1240,4 DPS.

  12. I have been concentrating on speed runs on T1, so far I am almost fully decked out in new Legendaries. Found 2 upgrades yesterday and 3 the day before that.

    I treat it like the pit runs of old, where I jam to some tunes, slay, and pick up the good stuff. Seems to be working well. 🙂

  13. Okay, my only question is… what’s up with the infernal machine quest? I’ve killed the keywardens on T1 a bunch of times, with not a single key to show for it. I thought the drop rate was 25%? That was basically my to do for the pre-RoS weeks: trying to get a hellfire ring.

    Anyway, after being at MP0/MP1 pre-patch and finding MP2 too difficult, I was surprised that T1 was very doable for my same characters in 2.0.1. It feels slower than the lower levels, but I keep track of drops and gold and in the end I was getting as good or better results for the same time frame playing Torment, so it made sense to stay there for the better experience and chance of keys. Also, upgrades are coming so fast for me now that it’s been pretty easy to break into T1 and stay there.

    • I’d say you’re just unlucky. I’ve heard from other players doing T1 or T2 key runs that they were finding them roughly 25% of the time.

      Also, most people know it but key hunting is much better done in a group, since it’s faster to find the KW and everyone has a chance for the key to drop, and then if you all do the Machines at once all 3 or 4 people can get in on just the one IM.

      • I had the same feeling about key droprate yesterday. For the first 16 runs I got 1 key in act3 torment1. In the end I got a total of 9 keys in 44 runs which is not to far of from the expected 25%.

  14. Last night I wanted to start farming the keywardens, to craft another hellfire ring. But since I just had my quest reset, I didnt had the wp for all the wardens. I decided to rush through the content playing on normal, just to get the quests to farm the wardens.

    I found out that breezing through normal awarded me a LOT more legendaries than playing T1. And I can farm T1 pretty fast.

    Yesterday I tested out doing this on hard difficulty, since I can pretty much one shot everything, even elites, and I was getting about 1.5 legendaries per act. And also as a bonus, a lot of pool of reflection stacks plus a couple of levels, since the XP is surprisingly good even o hard.

    I’m gonna play a little bit more like that today, going really fast through hard difficulty and reseting for the guaranteed legendary on Leoric to see if it was just luck or if it is really better to find legendaries this way.

    As far as I know the torment only legendaries are some high end sets and a couple more items, so farming below torment doesnt compromise my loot I guess.

    • “As far as I know the torment only legendaries are some high end sets and a couple more items, so farming below torment doesnt compromise my loot I guess.”

      Not at all until the expansion hits, since the Torment exclusive items are level 70 ones.

  15. I’ve been pushing to see how high I could solo on my DH. So far, I’ve found that I can do T2 easily and T3 if I am willing to die on a fairly regular basis (once every 3 or 4 boss packs). I assumed the drop rate and quality were both going to be higher on higher Torment levels, but I can’t say I’ve found that to be the case, so I’ll probably just stay at T2 for now, at least until I get a few more upgrades.

    My 2 best upgrades so far were both found on T1.

  16. I don’t really think the whole Torment difficulty system is working out. At least not for D3 classic. Maybe it works better with RoS and adventure mode. As a player, I was kind of happy with the system. You could farm SK if you wanted items, or farm Mira/Dalton if you wanted XP. The point is there were finally things to DO. You had options/choices. Then they decided to nerf everything. Wyatt Cheng pretty much said they only want people running bounties in RoS. Probably should have waited until RoS dropped before nerfing classic then. Maybe they were just worried about the backlash of “they nerfed classic to make you buy RoS!”

    We were kind of doing Bounties anyway, I was killing all purples on T6, and the white trash mobs. Unless they nerfed the hell out of Bounties I don’t see how Mira/Dalton runs would have been better than them. Well, I guess it’s a guaranteed enemy, whereas you have to actually find the monsters in bounties, but still, that you can do more than 1 per game would yield more XP, plus goody bag.

  17. Useless anecdotal evidence but what the hey:

    Found 6 legendary items in an hour while playing T2 just now.

  18. Oddly enough I posted about this difficulties and rewards yesterday. There is some concern with the systems now.

    http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?852652-To-torment-or-not-to-torment&p=8609230#post8609230

  19. i had a question on legends. can you now find all legendaries (regardless of level) in any act in torment? or do you have to go to certain acts/locations to get certain kinds of legends? i recently found a gift of silaria (http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/dAPhREAk-1843/hero/3929813) in act 1, cota, torment 1 or 4 (cant remember). the sword is a level 34 sword.

    i recall if you wanted to get that special experience ring that there were certain acts/levels that you would want to play over and over to get. also, i think you were supposed to do it in nightmare.

    thanks

  20. I think part of the increase is the much higher cost to remove gems from items in D3V2, which increases the value of free gems by restricting supply.

  21. What they need to do is allow loot specs/loot profiles. It is near impossible to gear ANYTHING other than the character you’re actually playing. Even shared stat classes have trouble b/c there’s almost always a bonus roll to a skill that’s for the character you are playing. If you want to farm and gear up an alt, it’s ridiculous. You have to build up the fresh character slowly, w/ maybe a hellfire here or there. I guess that’s one way to slow everyone down to a crawl.

  22. I think the reason they hide legendary drop chance is that people are really bad at math. They were transparent before and most could not quite understand what mp to really farm. I did the math on what they provided and it boils down to simply playing where it feels good. You want to play somewhere elites die in under 15 seconds to maximize loot from elites in 1.08 d3.

    Thing is, you could go up or down 1 mp and only do about 5% worse. My guess is this is the same for d3 v2.

    What skewed things in 1.08 was trash being too dense and rewarding, making trash farming too profitable for items and xp. In 2.0, you could farm trash at high torment for xp, but the drops won’t be so good.

    Now key farming and ube rs are a different story. You should go as high as you can for those.

  23. I’ve been using a route that works pretty well for finding legendary drops, but isn’t great for xp.

    Start the kill Azmodan quest and get the check point right before his lair.
    Exit the game and run backwards from the check point to the way point, return to town rinse and repeat.

    Normally you get about 1-3 champion packs, 6 chests, and a possibility for a goblin.

    I found about 18 legendary drops this morning alone. You still get dry spells, but its the most efficient way I’ve found so far. I even got a double drop of one of the goblins.

    Here is part of the loot log from this morning, its too large to even fit it all.

    http://imgur.com/dhzAVZx

  24. QUOTE

     ... People need to realize that for item finding purposes it's never a good idea to play on the highest difficulty they can manage. Doing that is a good choice only if you care about the other rewards as well (XP, gold and higher level gems in the expansion).

    Well in D2 we had exact drop rates so it was easy to time your runs and find the most efficient player setting. With all its complexity I still had a much firmer grasp on D2’s drop mechanics, in D3 I am completely in the dark.

  25. It boils down to this: if you only care about items find the difficulty where you can one-shot trash mobs and clear areas with high enemy density and lots of Elites. For most people this difficulty will be Normal and Hard and for areas the old Alkaizer run still works well.

    If you care about XP and gold gain as well, then see what’s the hardest difficulty you can handle reliably and stick with it.

    Following these rules worked equally well in Classic, but there are two key differences in 2.0:

    1) Drop rates are *much* more reasonable on Normal (previously MP0), making low difficulty farming more efficient.

    2) During your runs you should open and destroy any objects. These have greatly increased chance to drop Legendaries compared to Classic, especially white chests. So much so that some people reported getting more Legendaries from chests than from Elites.

  26. Something that I noticed, when playing with 1-2 friends in Torment 1, I spent about 2-3 hours and never got a single Legendary drop. We cleared multiple areas and scrapped thousands of enemies/breakables but none of us got even 1 Legendary. Playing by myself in Torment 1, I generally pull on average 1 Legendary an hour, sometimes up to 2-3 depending on the area.

    Why would the drop rate seem lower with more people?

Comments are closed.